Exhibits Question

[judgejules1]

Greetings Everyone!

Received this back from PSA today. I thought this was a Canadian example, back on the mark on the back. But PSA didn't grade it as a Canadian example, rather a normal 1947 - 1966 Willie Mays Portrait with a "mark". So, question to the Exhibits experts out there: does this mark on the back indicate that it's a Canadian example?

1947 -1966 Exhibits Portrait Canadian_000001.jpg
1947- 1966 Exhibits Portrait Canadian Back_000001.jpg


Thanks for your time.

Brian

[whiteymet]

Brian:

When they first showed up on ebay years back they were indeed "marketed" as being Canadian.

I was never sure of their authenticity. If I recall correctly there were only 7 or 9 cards in the "set"

I will be interested in others take on this issue.

Fred

[Exhibitman]

I doubt it. The Canadian cards are very different. The only back stamps I've seen are origin designation stamps on some prewar cards that lacked them on front. Stock also looks funny and the image looks cropped. I'd say counterfeit.

[whiteymet]

I just dug out my "set" of these.

Adam, I don't think he was asking if these were the 50's Canadian set. There were issued much later if in fact they are a legit issue. And supposedly they DID come out of Canada.

CNE stands for Canadian National Exhibition. See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadia...nal_Exhibition

I have with the same stamped back: Aaron, Berra batting, Cash, Clemente, Kaline w/bats, Mantle Batting pose, Maris, and Mays as seen above.

[Zach Wheat]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

I doubt it. The Canadian cards are very different. The only back stamps I've seen are origin designation stamps on some prewar cards that lacked them on front. Stock also looks funny and the image looks cropped. I'd say counterfeit.

Adam,

Does the general rule that gray back (as opposed to cream or tan colored) backs likely indicate "Canadian" Exhibits are counterfeit as well?

Just curious. Thanks.

Z Wheat

[Exhibitman]

That's a really interesting question, Z. In terms of baseball cards:

The Canadian baseball issue of 64 cards has a mix of reissued US cards with numbered fronts and new cards of the Montreal IL team [Lasorda, Alston and Amoros RCs there]. I am looking at a Canadian Lopat as I write this. It is not a 2nd generation print made from photographing an existing card, as many reprints are, but is in fact an original halftone print. You can tell because the areas of white are absolutely clear. The stock is that crappy gray stuff. The Canadian set has been well-defined and known for many years. It is numbered consecutively. As far as I know, there is no other definitively identified Canadian Exhibit issue.

There are a number of reprints known from the US run. They vary in qualities. What concerns me about the card in question specifically is the stock, which is unlike anything I have ever seen in an Exhibit product, and the printing, which looks muddier, with more gray-ish areas than the card usually has. That is indicative of a 2nd generation item. Clarity is lost and areas of shadowing increase. The dimensions also seem a bit more square than an Exhibit.

The only similar genuine issue I can think of is the Wrigley Exhibits from the 1960's but the print on those was clear and the stock, while gray, was not the same as this stuff. Also matched the dimensions of the regular set to a tee.

That is not to say the card isn't Canadian. It may be. I just don't think it is an ESCO product. Here is a picture of a Bogart card from a Canadian issue that it sort of reminds me of:



There were other arcade card makers. The hockey cards that are labeled as Exhibit products do not have American analogs and I have always wondered about them:



There are also a whole bunch of non-ESCO cards that I won't bother with here [see my site http://imageevent.com/exhibitman/notanexhibitcard ]. The common thread in the non-ESCO arcade cards is that they are their own designs, not ESCO designs.

[whiteymet]

Another Exhibit issue that came out of Canada are the extremely rare Dad's Cookies cards from Vancouver.

They do not have the gray backs. See below.

[39special]

Originally Posted by whiteymet

Another Exhibit issue that came out of Canada are the extremely rare Dad's Cookies cards from Vancouver.

They do not have the gray backs. See below.

Do you know what year or years they are from?

[whiteymet]

Steve:

The SCD Vintage Standard Catalog list them as 1959.

[39special]

Originally Posted by whiteymet

Steve:

The SCD Vintage Standard Catalog list them as 1959.

Thanks! I have never seen that issue before.

[Exhibitman]

Right, I forgot about those, Fred. The Dad's product uses the 'normal' stock.