Bill Mastro and his crew are even worse than I thought

[sports-rings]

This appeared online today at the NY Daily News website.

Unbelievable what lowlifes Mastro and his crew are:

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/iteam/bill-mastro-accused-stealing-baseball-card-collection-blog-entry-1.2014089

[Econteachert205]

About as Bad as it gets

[sports-rings]

If the poor guy couldn't sleep for a year, and being an attorney, why in the world didn't he file a lawsuit or threaten to expose them?

[Tao_Moko]

How could you consign a supposed $300k worth of cards without appropriate inventory? This letter also outs another huge issue in our hobby with TPG's.

[Peter_Spaeth]

This story has some credibility issues IMO.

[nolemmings]

D'ya think?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Well I was trying to be charitable.

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

This story has some credibility issues IMO.

Maybe not. Here are the Ruth card Evers references as it is the only fact I can check about his story.

And I believe it does checks out! Here are the two Ruth card lots:

December 2007 Lot 225 (the Ruth card is in the upper right corner of first photo (yellow background Ruth card graded VG-Ex by SGC):

http://www.legendaryauctions.com/Lot...entoryid=76592

Evers’ consignment lot #225 comprised of 108 cards including two Babe Ruths sold for $6,544.

And here is the same #53 Ruth card now graded PSA 6 in Mastro’s 5/1/2008 closing date auction Lot #459 (easy to identify due to flaws – look at unique mark in upper right as well as left border):

http://www.legendaryauctions.com/Lot...entoryid=80276
This ONE CARD all alone sold for $7,800!

“Two months after they scammed me, in Mastro’s February 2008 auction catalogue, I saw many of my 1930s’ cards, now selling in small groups of four with high grades on them. Six months after they scammed me out of my collection, in Mastro’s Summer 2008 sports memorabilia auction catalogue, I saw my rare cards taken out of their low graded slabs and put in PSA grading company slabs now with much higher grades. For example, one of my 1933 Goudey Babe Ruth cards was graded a 4 by SGC when it was “mine.” Now that it was Mastro’s , it was taken out of its SGC grading slab and put into a PSA grading slab and graded a 6 (exponentially more valuable due to higher grading). The reason I know it was my Babe Ruth card is because it had two unique imperfections on it which matched perfectly to “mine” in the December 2007 Mastro catalogue photograph. In December 2007, as “mine,” it was graded a 4. In June 2008, as Mastro’s it was graded a 6! “

No wonder he’s upset!!!!

[Peter_Spaeth]

So where's the conspiracy? Mastro got SGC to undergrade it so he could buy it and get it into the right holder?

[Exhibitman]

The writer seems to fall on the crackpot side of the spectrum. I have no doubt that he feels something happened, but come on, what kind of moron accepts a random description of the lot? If Mastro's henchman doesn't have time to do a proper inventory, pick up your crap and walk out, counselor!

BTW, when I think of the Mastro offices now I always picture it tilted, like a criminal lair on the old Batman tv series.

[Rollingstone206]

...

[quinnsryche]

For a lawyer, that is one of the most childish, poorly written letters I have ever read. Not saying true/untrue, just sounds extremely odd the way it's presented.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Further, I am requesting a court order for $300,000 in restitution to be paid to me.

[nolemmings]

Further, I am requesting a court order for $300,000 in restitution to be paid to me.

"I'm just a caveman. Your world frightens and confuses me." Keyrock. Just Keyrock.

https://screen.yahoo.com/unfrozen-ca...223412426.html

[scooter729]

Hard to see for sure if it's the same Ruth card from the first SGC scan, but if it's the same card crossed over, it would have to have been graded by PSA when they still used their old grading flips (since the PSA 6 has the old pre half-point flip).

Does anyone know when they switched to the half-point flip style? I would've guessed it was prior to December 2007, so if they were using the half point flip style in the time frame from 12/2007 to 4/2008 (in between the two auctions), then either it's not the same card or something really weird is going on.

[Rich Klein]

I'm pretty sure PSA switched much later than 2007 to the half point grades.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

I'm pretty sure PSA switched much later than 2007 to the half point grades.

I think it was 08.

[sandmountainslim]

Originally Posted by quinnsryche

For a lawyer, that is one of the most childish, poorly written letters I have ever read. Not saying true/untrue, just sounds extremely odd the way it's presented.

Maybe he wrote it himself instead of having his paralegal do it

[Fred]

Looking at the two scans of the Ruth cards (SGC and PSA graded), they appear to be the same card based on a couple unique characteristics of the card.

There have been a few credible hobby veterans that have also sent letters to the courts about Mastro and crew. I can't believe this guy just made up all of this stuff.

I guess a lot of the posters in this thread are arguing that Mastro and crew could not have done this to someone. Seriously? Are we to believe that everything being said in court is a huge lie and that these guys are "clean"?

Biggest hobby hoax - the PSA8 Wagner.... come on... I think it's common knowledge that the card was trimmed, does anybody dispute that? Are we to believe that anybody that would perpetrate such a fraud is honest in any sense of the word? Geesh....

[Rollingstone206]

...

[nolemmings]

I'm not saying Mastro or others involved with him are above anything. I just find the story strange to say the least. As Peter mentioned, what was the motive for the Ruth "swap"? Tell SGC to grade it low so you can scoop it at a low price (apparently keeping other bidders suppressed--the old anti-shill), get it re-graded and then make a profit?

An educated man then in his 40's relies on an Antique Roadshow and Antiques Trader to lead him to Mastro and apparently does little or no other research? Maybe for the old guy who doesn't know the first thing about some stash he found in the attic but this guy has been collecting since 1965, and has had a card graded seven years prior (why?). He knows of no other hobby resources? He doesn’t have the faculties to do a five or ten minute google search to better understand the market and other auction houses?

He has a Goudey Ruth and Lajoie but doesn’t want to pay $25 to have them graded --thankfully Mastro could have it done for $7, so that 's some sort of huge factor in his decision? Anyone want to show me a $39K Koufax rookie? Mastro employee Marren "examined" each of his 1500 cards--what is that a 5 hour or more process?-- but then only hurriedly scribbled a one-sentence reference on the consignment contract as to what was going to be auctioned, although there was a written "skeletal" inventory? The mysterious Mr. X "suddenly" shows up and the con is on? Really? They pressured you into not having better protection, or from giving them your own inventory for them to approve? And you're a lawyer? Sorry, IMO it just seems, um, strange. Bad cinema, actually.

[Fred]

Todd,

In a letter written by a BIG hobby veteran to the courts he indicated Mastro told him that "I would do anything to improve the appearance of any item or card".

The following is all speculation: The Ruth could have been submitted to SGC without being cleaned up. The card was shilled and not really sold by Mastro. The card gets cleaned up and submitted to PSA (as a preferential submitter) and the resulting grade netted a much larger bid than before. Tell me if any of that doesn't sound plausible, based on all we've been hearing. Pure speculation, but plausibe. It would be interesting to see WHO purchased that card when it was in the SGC holder.

Auction houses often submit cards for grading for their consigners, I don't find anything strange about that. I do feel the consignor was a bit naive (ok stupid) for 1 - not having an inventory list with him when he brought his cards, and 2 - a bit naive (ok stupid) for accepting a skeletal inventory list.

[packs]

To me the grading is fishy and definitely odd but the difference in sale prices are irrelevant. Once you've sold your card, it doesn't matter what it sells for the next time.

Not sure I buy the rest of the story as it is depicted. This person was a collector and not an inheritor of a collection. I would never walk out of an office without proper paperwork for even my modest and low-budget collection. I would assume he'd be just as passionate about his expensive one.

[sports-rings]

Once you've sold your card, it doesn't matter what it sells for the next time.

Well, it does matter if the letter is true and Mastro and his goons concocted a scheme to not auction the cards properly, obtain the cards below market value due to fraud and then sell them at a profit.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by sports-rings

Well, it does matter if the letter is true and Mastro and his goons concocted a scheme to not auction the cards properly, obtain the cards below market value due to fraud and then sell them at a profit.

I am not defending Mastro at all, he and his bunch will have a lot of time to think about what they did...and not much else to do while doing it.

That being said this guy's story sounds crazy to me.

[bn2cardz]

While reading the story I believed there wasn't a lot of substantiating evidence, just a lot of emotion. If there was evidence than it wasn't very well articulated.

He does claim an FBI agent does know more about the case including a list, but if the gentleman writing the letter can't confirm ownership of the cards I don't see how he can expect restitution.

That said I can believe that what he claims happened is true, but I wouldn't find anybody guilty off this letter alone.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by sports-rings

Well, it does matter if the letter is true and Mastro and his goons concocted a scheme to not auction the cards properly, obtain the cards below market value due to fraud and then sell them at a profit.

My 2 cents but I'll gladly let the lawyers speak to correct me. (assuming what the was in the letter was accurate)

I believe the fraud was committed on the purchase, not on the sale. The sale would not even had to have taken place in order for fraud to have been committed. My guess would be the sale only makes the intent to defraud more 'provable'.

Fraud would have been committed on the sale if the sellers purported the item to be something it was not, which I don't believe happened here (assuming card was unaltered, etc). So in this case, it doesn't matter what the card sold for. Nor would it at any re-sale of any item, assuming fraud is not involved in the actual SALE of the item itself.

[edhans]

Count me among the dubious ones. The letter is incredibly poorly written, especially for an alleged attorney. Were there shenanegans going on at Mastro? Undoubtedly, but these allegations really stretch credibility.

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by Leon

I am not defending Mastro at all, he and his bunch will have a lot of time to think about what they did...and not much else to do while doing it.

That being said this guy's story sounds crazy to me.

+1
He left their offices without a detailed inventory??
Please,,,
He is a lawyer who trusted a big business?????

[bigtrain]

Reminds me of one of my favorite quotes:

“The public regards lawyers with great distrust. They think lawyers are smarter than the average guy but use their intelligence deviously. Well, they're wrong. Usually they are not smarter.”
―F. Lee Bailey

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

I'm not saying Mastro or others involved with him are above anything. I just find the story strange to say the least. As Peter mentioned, what was the motive for the Ruth "swap"? Tell SGC to grade it low so you can scoop it at a low price (apparently keeping other bidders suppressed--the old anti-shill), get it re-graded and then make a profit?

An educated man then in his 40's relies on an Antique Roadshow and Antiques Trader to lead him to Mastro and apparently does little or no other research? Maybe for the old guy who doesn't know the first thing about some stash he found in the attic but this guy has been collecting since 1965, and has had a card graded seven years prior (why?). He knows of no other hobby resources? He doesn’t have the faculties to do a five or ten minute google search to better understand the market and other auction houses?

He has a Goudey Ruth and Lajoie but doesn’t want to pay $25 to have them graded --thankfully Mastro could have it done for $7, so that 's some sort of huge factor in his decision? Anyone want to show me a $39K Koufax rookie? Mastro employee Marren "examined" each of his 1500 cards--what is that a 5 hour or more process?-- but then only hurriedly scribbled a one-sentence reference on the consignment contract as to what was going to be auctioned, although there was a written "skeletal" inventory? The mysterious Mr. X "suddenly" shows up and the con is on? Really? They pressured you into not having better protection, or from giving them your own inventory for them to approve? And you're a lawyer? Sorry, IMO it just seems, um, strange. Bad cinema, actually.

Precisely my point. Just because Mastro is a crooked scumbag who should be locked up for as long as the cage is available doesn't mean he kidnapped the Lindbergh baby too. Judged on its own merits the story seems equal parts wishful and embellished, and the letter reads like an essay by a community college student who speaks English as a second language.

[Peter_Spaeth]

One thing is clear. If I ever need a workmen's comp lawyer in Naperville, IL, I will look elsewhere than the author.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Oh and another thing. If someone had REALLY defrauded me out of 300K, I probably would have filed a civil claim. Especially if I was a lawyer myself. Just sayin.

[Exhibitman]

I always have to wonder why educated professionals who aren't easy to BS turn brain-dead when it involves cards. Look at the otherwise savvy collectors who become mindless company shills when it comes to PSA. And for what, a worthless certificate at a crappy luncheon handed out by a mannequin with a bad haircut? Honestly, it is just mind-boggling.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Adam, it's an ego thing, pure and simple. I think set registry awards raise testosterone levels as well.

[frankbmd]

Should tinkering Evers be given a chance?

[Econteachert205]

Disregard, now I see what everyone is talking about.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Should tinkering Evers be given a chance?

A double play on words?

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

A double play on words?

Third base!

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Further, I am requesting a court order for $300,000 in restitution to be paid to me.

Do the courts in Illinois have drive-thru windows for judgments on-demand?

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by sandmountainslim

Maybe he wrote it himself instead of having his paralegal do it

I don't care who you are - that's funny!

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by quinnsryche

For a lawyer, that is one of the most childish, poorly written letters I have ever read. Not saying true/untrue, just sounds extremely odd the way it's presented.

The obvious reason for the court disclosing the letter was to demonstrate that Mastro and his cohorts caused an otherwise rational, successful, competent attorney to turn into an incoherent, traumatized victim.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

...And for what, a worthless certificate at a crappy luncheon handed out by a mannequin with a bad haircut?

LOL, this reminds me of: You're an errand boy, sent by grocery clerks, to collect a bill.

[jcmtiger]

Originally Posted by sports-rings

This appeared online today at the NY Daily News website.

Unbelievable what lowlifes Mastro and his crew are:

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/iteam/bill-mastro-accused-stealing-baseball-card-collection-blog-entry-1.2014089

Not sure if I believe this story.

Joe

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

This all sounds like part of the mafia's on going sports memorabilia conspiracy

[slidekellyslide]

I know a guy who used to live here in Lincoln (name given on request in PM) who sold his entire Nebraska football collection dating back in the 1890s with Mastro...Mastro buried the most valuable programs in lots. He tried to get Mastro to pull the lots, but they would not do it. I know the guy sells on ebay, I should send him a message that he may want to send his own letter to the judge.

And now for something completely different....

Did they ever catch the "Gypsies" that stole Lionel Carter's collection?

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=83250

[tim]

The real crime here is the Ruth card in question ending up graded a 6. I mean, I wouldn't kick it out of bed for eatin' Funyuns, but that card is a homely lookin' EX-MT 6.

[oldjudge]

Dan--and the reason for that was? Are you suggesting that Bill won the lot and resold all the "valuable" Cornhusker programs himself? BTW, what is a valuable Cornhusker program? One from a game that Bo Pelini isn't ranting and raving on the sidelines, or one from a game where they have beaten the Badgers? LOL

[deadballfreaK]

You're on ten here, all the way up, all the way up, all the way up, you're on ten. Where can you go from there? Where?

I don't know.

Nowhere. Exactly. What we do is, if we need that extra push over the cliff, you know what we do?

Put it up to eleven.

Eleven. Exactly.



UH.......These go to eleven.

[Fred]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3L4EZwmRrA

Need to go to about 50 second mark for the "11".....