My Kreindler project

[effe]

As you may imagine I'm still in shock. This is by far the best item I've ever won. Over the past few days I've been scouring the web for possible subjects. I'm not a photo collector so I really didn't have any potential candidates in my collection. While I've come up with a few, I realized I'm ignoring what is likely the best resource out there, you guys. So here it goes...As someone already guessed, I'm a Milwaukee baseball fan so if you you've got any ideas for subjects you wouldn't mind sharing I'd love to see them.

Attached below are the potential candidates I've found out there. Feel free to critique them as well.

[slidekellyslide]

Hank Aaron on one knee or Hank jumping against the fence....you can't go wrong with either of those IMO.

[sebie43]

Cant go wrong with that first Aaron

[yanks12025]

Were you buying a bigger size. Cause I think the size of the raffle is big enough for a portrait, I remember them saying something about this.

[Lordstan]

Congrats on the win. Color me very jealous. No doubt you will enjoy this item forever.
My personal bias is for Graig to create his paintings from B+W images. I feel like he really gets to bring the image to life by starting with a more blank canvas.

My favorite of the ones you posted, BY FAR, is the Aaron jumping at the fence. It is a spectacular image that would make an incredible painting, but probably not at 16x20. Unfortunately, I think it would need to be bigger to really get the full impact and majesty of that shot. From talking with Graig, it's my understanding that he feels 16x20 size is most appropriate for portrait type images. Even the one kneeling would probably look a bit better with a slightly vertically longer canvas to keep the full effect.
You might consider talking with Graig about different sizes and how much extra they would cost. I'm not sure if the extra cost is doable for you, but knowing whether what size is your absolute limit will help you decide on the best photo.

I would speak to Graig now about your ideas. He is full of ...great ides(bet you thought I was going to say something else ) and can help guide you through the process.

The good news is that no matter what you choose, you will love it.When I got mine, I posted this thread.
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=kreindleritis

[RTK]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

Hank Aaron on one knee or Hank jumping against the fence....you can't go wrong with either of those IMO.

This. Mr Aaron is a great subject. I tend to like action shots with old ballparks in the background. Aaron playing defense is not something we think of often, it's a unique subject matter. The fence has wonderful texture too.

[effe]

Originally Posted by yanks12025

Were you buying a bigger size. Cause I think the size of the raffle is big enough for a portrait, I remember them saying something about this.

I thought of that as I was posting them this morning. I kind of figured that would eliminate the Aaron jumping photo, but based on my brief correspondence with Graig, I think the Aaron on knee photo would work. Plus it has Milwaukee County Stadium in the backdrop.

[gregr2]

My 2 cents, I think the Aaron on his knee would work great for this project.

[mark evans]

If you decide to go for a portrait, you might consider a painting of his 1958 Topps card. The bright green background, I should think, would be quite striking. Plus, you get Braves logo, etc., not to mention his name for viewing guests who don't know baseball.

[billyb]

Effe,
I am so glad you are sharing this process with everyone, as for many of us, it is a learning experience of what we can and cannot get done. (size matters).
Future winners will have a better idea of the whole process, from this point to completion.
Congratulations again, and, I like Aaron kneeling also.

Bill

Maybe with this we can lure you to the photographic side.

[CW]

That's pretty funny... the Aaron kneeling and the shot of him jumping at the fence were my two favorites as well.

While the jumping shot wouldn't work in this size, as mentioned, I'd also go with the Aaron kneeling. I'd imagine Graig would have a blast with it, too, as he'd have the stadium to "play" with in the background, and he'd have the added challenge capturing the sunlight from the photo.

[baseball tourist]

I love the two Aaron choices too. You can't go wrong if you choose the knee shot or upsize and go for the fence image. I would have gone with Hank too. I feel that being 3 fans away in the attendance count and you picking Aaron, that I have won (sort of)! Now if I could just convince you to let me borrow the painting on weekends!

[71buc]

I too am very happy for your good fortune and a bit jealous. I think Hank Aaron is a great choice and the shot of him leaping against the fence has long been one of my favorites. However, if I was choosing an Aaron image I would go with something quite different. Although he isn't in uniform I find the image poignant. It was taken moments after signing with the Clowns. He was leaving Mobile and his family as a scared teen not knowing what the future held. For me there is a lot of emotion in photo and it represents one of biggest moments in baseball history. How could anyone imagine that the frightened young man in that photo would go on to such greatness?

[ethicsprof]

great photo, mike. I taught Aaron's daughter around '80-'81 and love to see the personal side of his life in the photos and paintings.
and congrats John on being the lucky winner.

best,
barry

[terjung]

I have the honor of having one of Graig's paintings in my home office. Based on my experience, I would advise you to ask Graig for his opinion on size and subject matter early on in the process. If you tell him you'd like a Hank Aaron, he may have dozens of images of him that he can show you.

I'm considering having him do a second painting for me and he has shown me many images of the subject that I didn't even know existed.

During your discussion with him, ask him what size a particular image would need to be in order to do it justice. Just my $0.02, but I think it is better to have his involvement in all stages. He is an amazing artist and his process starts well before the brush hits the canvas.

[tnfoto]

Here are a couple of Aaron options I didn't see posted above.

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by tnfoto

Here are a couple of Aaron options I didn't see posted above.

T. Scott,
I LOVE that top photo of Aaron. Absolutely terrific!

[Forever Young]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

T. Scott,
I LOVE that top photo of Aaron. Absolutely terrific!

Agreed... the top one posted by Scott would be my pick on what I have seen here and would most likely fit the parameters without issue.

[sago]

I also like the top one (2 posts above). The first shot in your OP is fantastic, but it's already a color photo. I think black and white shots work best to start with, and then have Graig work his magic.

[YankeeFan]

Belated congratulations on your winning this fantastic prize.

Though I'm a "YankeeFan", Henry Aaron was actually my favorite player growing up in the late 1960's - 1970's. I was rooting for him as he chased the Babe
and felt so bad for all of the grief he endured because of it. My Dad would take me to Shea Stadium whenever the Braves were in town.

Lots of great Aaron photos here. Both pics of him kneeling (your first one and the one with him wearing #5) are great.
Then again, in that press photo shown by Tnfoto, I love the way his face looks with the light shining on him.

The best thing is that between the artist and the subject, no matter what you choose, the end result will be a winner!

[milkit1]

Aaron jumping against the fence, without a doubt

[nebboy]

1st photo - head and chest. Right in Greg's zone

[balltrash]

This has always been one of my favorite Milwaukee baseball related images and seems like it would work given the size. Sorry for the link..http://www.nytstore.com/Warren-Spahn--1956_p_5436.html

[Lordstan]

Wow. Some great photos.
I really like the Aaron T Scott posted. I very much prefer it over the similar color one in the first post.

Jeremy, you really stepped up with that Spahn. Incredible composition and would definitely fit the size requirements.

I am torn. I think if he can go a little bigger, I would definitely do the Aaron jumping in the outfield. If he is going to hold to the 16x20 size, I would flip a coin to choose between T Scott's Aaron and Jeremy's Spahn.

[Tigerden]

John good luck in your pursuit of the ideal Braves image for Graig to paint. Though I am partial to the Tigers , I had saved these two Braves photos and would have given them serious consideration if I had been fortunate enough to win the raffle.

[Tigerden]

...and this photo of Eddie Mathews.

[thecatspajamas]

Originally Posted by terjung

I have the honor of having one of Graig's paintings in my home office. Based on my experience, I would advise you to ask Graig for his opinion on size and subject matter early on in the process. If you tell him you'd like a Hank Aaron, he may have dozens of images of him that he can show you.

I'm considering having him do a second painting for me and he has shown me many images of the subject that I didn't even know existed.

During your discussion with him, ask him what size a particular image would need to be in order to do it justice. Just my $0.02, but I think it is better to have his involvement in all stages. He is an amazing artist and his process starts well before the brush hits the canvas.

+1

Graig probably has more killer images in his "some day" dreamer folder than he has lifetime left to paint them in. If you've got some idea of the direction you'd like to go (team, player, era, etc), it's well worth your time to see what he's got already.

Another Mathews worth considering:

[thecatspajamas]

Originally Posted by balltrash

This has always been one of my favorite Milwaukee baseball related images and seems like it would work given the size. Sorry for the link..http://www.nytstore.com/Warren-Spahn--1956_p_5436.html

This is the one he's referring to (and would get my top vote of those presented thus far):

[JoeyF1981]

Id go with the first aaron but any aaron would be awesome

[frankbmd]

I'm guessing that you will not be picking the only known image of Willie Mays Aaron.

[thecatspajamas]

So how about it, John, any updates on the decision-making process?

[billyb]

John
I agree, the suspense is killing me. Have you at least narrowed the field down to a few.


Bill

[Runscott]

I love 'Aaron Leaping'. If Graig thinks it would lose too much Aaron detail in a smaller painting, maybe something like this?

[Lordstan]

Originally Posted by Runscott

I love 'Aaron Leaping'. If Graig thinks it would lose too much Aaron detail in a smaller painting, maybe something like this?

That would be an awesome painting.



Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[billyb]

RunScott,

Wow, my new favorite.

[prestigecollectibles]

What happened to effe? If he is too busy or can't decide, maybe there should be a new winner

[billyb]

John told me he is a card guy.

Rumor is now, after looking at all these photos, he is selling his card collection to buy photos..........LOL

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by billyb

John told me he is a card guy.

Rumor is now, after looking at all these photos, he is selling his card collection to buy photos..........LOL

He won't be the first.

[effe]

Hi guys, I've been exchanging emails and photos with Graig pretty regularly. I have one a nice Aaron in mind that Graig is currently looking into. I'd rather hold off posting that one until I get his go ahead. The Peskin image I posted earlier and the early wire photo tnfoto posted are my runners up.

[billyb]

John,
You are suspenseful. But I am sure your choice will be a good one.
Can you tell us, at least, if the photo you chose, was posted on this thread?

[Deertick]

I already had my choice if I had won. It may have taken Graig extra time to get the nuances of the eyebrows, but it would have been worth it.
BTW, I LOVE Scott's idea.

[Runscott]

Scott's ideas are lovable - it's Scott who's an a-hole

I really want to see that 'Aaron Leaping' in Kreindler-color. I might have to learn to paint.

[GKreindler]

Hey all,

So, I wanted to update everyone on the status of this thing. I'm sorry that it's been taking a long time to get going, but there have been some issues with the image that John selected. I mean, not issues with John's choice, but issues with the image itself. Unfortunately, the nature of the whole thing is that the rights to it are owned by a third party who can be rather...um...flaky. In other words, I'm at their mercy right now.

I'm not going to post his actual choice until I'm completely sure that we can do it (I'm supposedly getting word and the scan in a few days), and even then, maybe I'll leave that part to John, as what he chose really reverberated with him. I can tell you for sure that it'll make a great painting.

In the meantime, I did purchase the necessary supplies for the piece, starting off with the stretcher bars, which I constructed below.



When selecting a linen, I end up trying different kinds and brands, as the weight and weave will vary. I think most of the time, I end up getting one that has a medium to smooth weave, which is nice for portraiture and heavy paint. Also, when I need to sand or scrape things down, the weight of the linen can withstand a beating.

A day or two after the bars were stapled into place, the linen arrived in the mail, which I then stretched onto the frames.



When that's taken care of, a coat of matte medium (which is water-based) is applied to the stretched frame. Traditionally when working with oils, artists would apply rabbit skin glue or other substrates to act as a boundary between the paint and the linen. Reason being is that over time, if the raw linen had oil paint applied to it (whether intentionally or not), the area can start to rot. We're talking 100-200 years down the line, but the goal is to be as archival as possible without being insane. In the photo below, I did a few at once.



After a day or so, the canvas was coated with acrylic gesso, which is that white stuff you're seeing on top. This is normally how I set these things up, though every now and again, I'll use an oil primer and not an acrylic one. Reason being is that paint reacts differently with each primer, and for the most part, the gesso surface is more along the lines of what I enjoy working with. Generally speaking, the paint tends to grab the surface and sit on top of it. I find that with oil primer, the paint sinks into it and dries quicker, which is not a bad thing by any stretch, but is not really the way I like attacking the thing. Of course, they're plenty of purists who would turn their noses up at the idea of using anything other than oil primer for their surface, and their certainly welcome to those opinions. However, I just work with what I like to work with.

Anywho, two coats of gesso are applied, and sanding occurs between the both of them (first a light one, and then a heavier one). At the end, the surface ends up being pretty smooth (the severity of which depends on the weave of the linen - a wider and heavier weave won't ever be super smooth).



From here, the thing is ready to be drawn on. And once I get the appropriate image, I'll be able to do as such.

Hopefully this shop talk isn't too boring to anyone. I just figured that some of you might be interested in the process from that point of view. If not, I can certainly keep it less intense.

Either way, thanks for reading, and thanks again for participating!

Graig

[Runscott]

Graig, that is COOL. Thanks for sharing.

I can't wait to get my 2nd Kreindler study, and to post the two framed results with associated autographs. I'm eyeing that Cobb, so someone better grab it quick.

[baseball tourist]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Graig, that is COOL. Thanks for sharing.

I agree...very interesting.

[thecatspajamas]

Very cool seeing the process in detail. What some may find tedious and over-informative, others (myself included) enjoy for the abundance of information and insight that it gives into the process. I can't wait to see the whole thing laid out, so that I can just follow along step-by-step and start producing my own Kreindler knock-off paintings!

[Deertick]

Originally Posted by thecatspajamas

Very cool seeing the process in detail. What some may find tedious and over-informative, others (myself included) enjoy for the abundance of information and insight that it gives into the process. I can't wait to see the whole thing laid out, so that I can just follow along step-by-step and start producing my own Kreindler knock-off paintings!

I'd much rather see a step-by-step documentation of the process.

I can't stand when a cooking show throws a non-disclosed amount of ingredients into a bowl and the next thing you see is them eating a soufflé.
Or a DIY show on building a deck, jumps from pouring footings to " and then just add the stairs and railings and enjoy your new deck".

[sebie43]

Thanks Graig, I learned alot about the procees that I had no idea of. And I like how it fills in the life story of these great paintings, awesome stuff.

[GKreindler]

Lance, I just hope that your knock-offs aren't non-Yankees - then I'll be jealous.

I'm glad you guys enjoyed that last post. I'll keep things in that spirit, and if you have any further questions that you feel like asking, don't hesitate to. Once I get to actually painting the thing, it might be a bit tougher to articulate things, but I'll certainly do my best.

Graig

[billyb]

Graig,
Thanks for sharing the set up process, I had no clue all that was needed. You definitely have great knowledge, not to mention your skill. Combined, you are the tops.

Thanks for sharing

Bill