Brown Lenox & Old Mill

[MVSNYC]

After collecting T206 for 20 years, i should probably know the answer to this, but i never gave much attention to Brown Lenox & Old Mill...my question is this, can the same player exist in both Black & Brown ink on either back respectively? my reference point is Hindu, where the same player cannot exist in Red ink if he already has a Brown ink example, and vice versa (correct me if i am wrong here).

thoughts?

[Mikehealer]

Yes, in fact all the brown OM are SLers. I don't know of of a brown Lenox that is not found in black. Although there are many black that have not been found in brown.

[wonkaticket]

As far as I’m aware this card (Overall) was not known with either black or brown Lenox not long ago and was an addition to the Lenox checklists. So this could be a brown only and no black example. Although I wouldn’t be surprised if a black example shows up one day or already has. I also think the Lajoie bat is brown only known to date...but again wouldn't be shocked if one shows up in black would make sense.

[Mikehealer]

Nice card Wonka, but then again it seems like all of yours are.

I new when I worded it the way I did someone would prove me wrong, but it seemed the easiest way. Didn't want to just say yes.

[wonkaticket]

Mike, thanks. Not sure I have proven you wrong LOL…according to Jim & Tim’s website they have the above card confirmed with black somewhere along the line on their list...

Cheers,

John

[MVSNYC]

Thanks guys!

John- if you are going to post scans of cards in my thread, please make sure they are not beaters...kidding. wow, nice card!

so it sounds like there can be black & brown of the same player. which is not the case with Hindus (red & brown), correct?

what about Sov. apple green vs. forrest green? i assume the same players can exist with both colors?

[mrvster]

They are Gorgeous!!!

[White Borders]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

Thanks guys!

John- if you are going to post scans of cards in my thread, please make sure they are not beaters...kidding. wow, nice card!

so it sounds like there can be black & brown of the same player. which is not the case with Hindus (red & brown), correct?

what about Sov. apple green vs. forrest green? i assume the same players can exist with both colors?

Brown Hindu and Red Hindu are exclusive for any subject.

Sovereign 350 dark (forest) green and Sovereign 350 light (apple) green are also exclusive for any subject.


Best Regards and Happy Collecting
Craig

[MVSNYC]

thanks Craig!

very interesting. so the Sov's are not just "faded" green then. all my years of collecting i never paid much attention to them...definitely sounds like different ink/separate print runs apparently (like red/brown Hindus).

PS- was looking on your master spreadsheet. i noticed separate entries for Red Hindu/Br Hindu, Blk Lenox/Br Lenox, Apple Sov/Dark Sov...BUT not separate entires for Blk Old Mill/Br Old Mill. why not?

[White Borders]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

thanks Craig!


PS- was looking on your master spreadsheet. i noticed separate entries for Red Hindu/Br Hindu, Blk Lenox/Br Lenox, Apple Sov/Dark Sov...BUT not separate entires for Blk Old Mill/Br Old Mill. why not?

Like Blank backs, I believe Brown Old Mill Southern Leagues are scrap and were not meant to be issued, so I do not include them in the spreadsheet. Here is a list of the Brown OMSL


Best Regards and Happy Collecting
Craig

[atx840]

I'm also thinking the McQuillan brown Lenox is the only known Lenox example.

Great cards Wonka!

[philliesphan]

Originally Posted by atx840

I'm also thinking the McQuillan brown Lenox is the only known Lenox example.

Great cards Wonka!

McQuillan is confirmed with Black Lenox. I believe Mastro or one of its entities sold one ~11 years ago.

[atx840]

Thanks for the info, I noticed its confirmed on Tim/Jim's list.

[atx840]

I'd like to get your thoughts if this is a new brown Lenox example?

T206 Black Lenox Harry Davis Philadelphia

All scanned with the same scanner Davis is in the middle compared to two other confirmed browns. Below are three black Lenox.

[wonkaticket]

From that scan at first glance it looks to be "Brown".

[baseballart]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

From that scan at first glance it looks to be "Brown".

I have self-diagnosed myself as black-brown color blind

[CW]

Based on the ending price of nearly $6K, is it safe to assume this Harry Davis card appeared to be a brown Lenox to at least 2 other bidders? In other words, that's not a typical price for a regular black Lenox back Harry Davis, is it?

[mrvster]

looks brown

[atx840]

Hey Chuck, I think being a 1/1 example was also a factor on the final price, its also possible a few others thought it was brown.

[CW]

Thanks, Chris. For the record, it looks brown to me as well.

[Leon]

I always have a difficult time telling the black from brown on the Lenox's.

[Brian Weisner]

Hey Chris ,
It's almost impossible to tell by the scan. If you have held a real" brown"than you should be able to see the difference.... I know you are looking for help, but it's going to be tough to get without someone seeing it in person.
Be well Brian

PS I hope it is a Brown for Chris's sake.... I bought a Brown OM 12 years ago, just to see the difference....

[atx840]

Thanks for the input guys, I was focusing on another card in the auction and didn't get the Davis...hopefully the owner is on here and can confirm.

[thehoodedcoder]

it is really hard to tell, but i think the scan is just a little lighter and that is making the black, not look so dark.


kevin

[Leon]

Amazing what a few shades does to the values!! But I am very empathetic to the issue myself, concerning minute differences in cards in general.