Auction Description

[Sterling Sports Auctions]

After the lovely thread about trying to sell a card without the buyers getting all the information on the card, how do you feel about auction description that do the same. The description may not be untrue but it fails to leave out pertinent information that the seller is aware of, but chooses to omit..

Lee

[Peter_Spaeth]

I guess it would depend on what the omitted information was. For example, on a graded card, I would probably want to know all the grading history the seller was aware of, but most sellers do not include that information.

[KNH]

As a seller, I would include any information in my description that I would want someone else to include if they were selling and I was considering bidding on the item. It's really very simple. Don't ever try to hide anything or leave out information for the sake of making more money. That's called being greedy.

[JP]

I think those eBay auctions that say "1090-1911 Evers Portrait PSA 5 - EXCELLENT!" and then in the auction you see that it is actually a PSA 5 (ST) or (MK) are the ones that piss me off the most. They are just banking on someone bidding on the title alone and overlooking that the card is worth 1-2 grades less in value.

[KNH]

I think those eBay auctions that say "1090-1911 Evers Portrait PSA 5 - EXCELLENT!" and then in the auction you see that it is actually a PSA 5 (ST) or (MK) are the ones that piss me off the most. They are just banking on someone bidding on the title alone and overlooking that the card is worth 1-2 grades less in value.

JP,
I was thinking the same thing. Also, on newer cards when the seller says "fresh out of the pack" and the card has dinged corners or some other defect.

Also, reprint cards that don't say "reprint" in the title. They really irritate me. It looks to me like they are hoping to find some sucker who doesn't read the description and thinks it may be real.

[botn]

Intentionally leaving out pertinent information or conveniently glossing over material facts in an auction description would be fraud. Similarly, failing to address pertinent information when an inquiry is made about an item in an auction, would be considered fraud.

There are some past and present auction house principals who post here. Maybe they can chime in? What are realistic expectations that we should hold auction houses to?

[Leon]

I can speak for myself on the issue of descriptions. Give big front and back scans and if a customer asks about something then you should tell them in an as honest of a way as possible. Anytime I have been asked about something I usually take a magnifier to the item and give a blow by blow account. No surprises. I also rely on third party grading to help. regards

[botn]

I agree that providing large scans and reliance on 3rd party grading is essential when it comes to cards. However, in the example of cards, should the auction house mention in the auction description any opinion should they feel a card is over graded? There are real advantages to viewing cards in person and sometimes large photos of graded cards is not enough.

[Sterling Sports Auctions]

The points brought up are all important in listings, but I guess the biggest concern is the provenance, history or background to not only the individual card but also the cards background within the set it comes from. This is auction descriptions you find mainly in major auctions and that is what concerns me the most.

Lee

[buymycards]

Yes, I am outing an auction, but it may save someone some trouble.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...T#ht_500wt_975

I emailed the seller and he told me that he is using a stock web photo of a PSA 5 card, but the actual item for sale is a PSA 2. His description is a little vague.

Rick

[vintagetoppsguy]

I was almost tempted to bid on that Cobb. One more "s" in "Collectorsssssssssss" and I just might have done it.

[lharri3600]

I emailed the seller and asked what does "not the card shown but the same card". Shame,shame,shame

[lharri3600]

Thanks rick:d

Originally Posted by buymycards

yes, i am outing an auction, but it may save someone some trouble.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/ebayisapi.dll...t#ht_500wt_975

i emailed the seller and he told me that he is using a stock web photo of a psa 5 card, but the actual item for sale is a psa 2. His description is a little vague.

Rick

[KNH]

If the high bidder read the description and still bid $1,300, he can only blame himself if he gets ripped off.

[Bridwell]

Wow Rick,

That's a good catch. That seller really IS deplorable. Worst ebay misdirection I've seen in awhile. Guess it pays to read all the fine print.

Ron R

[JP]

The iPhone app used to just show the picture, the title, current bid, and a place to put in a new bid....don't know if it has been updated but I imagine that would cause problems to only have that info.

I wonder if a buyer could argue that the photo was misrepresentation through a paypal dispute. I know that in the past, to save time, I've put 4 card pictures in one scan and run four different auctions for one card each, and that a past buyer was confused and though he was getting all $1300 worth of cards for $200, even though the title was clear and the description told what back the one card had....

[calvindog]

I don't expect it to happen, but I'd like to know the grading history of the cards sold in an auction; whether the cards have been crossed, rejected, etc. Of course, such information would only be provided if the auctioneer had such knowledge.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I don't expect it to happen, but I'd like to know the grading history of the cards sold in an auction; whether the cards have been crossed, rejected, etc. Of course, such information would only be provided if the auctioneer had such knowledge.

Jeff it is difficult to imagine a scenario where it would be in the seller's interest to disclose that, given that it is probably a safe assumption that any grading history would detract from the card not add to it -- at least in most cases. Whether it is material from a legal standpoint is an interesting question we have debated before.

[botn]

I suppose that info is relevant however where do you draw the line on the provenance of a card? I have broken cards out of CSA and PRO holders because I thought they were good and had them grade. On the flip side I have broken out cards from SGC and PSA holders and not had them regrade. We get information on grading history but what does that REALLY tell us?

Not to bring this up again but the T206 Cobb SGC 60 I won out of B-L I would have bid on even knowing it was crossed out of the GAI 6.5 holder. The SGC holder SHOULD be enough of an assurance a card is ok.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Greg to use the Cobb as an example, if hypothetically it had been rejected twice before someone got it to grade, I think that is something I would want to know. Although maybe I would be better off not knowing. I am less concerned about cards changing grades because of the subjectivity involved.

[botn]

I see your point Peter but no way an auction house is gonna disclose that. Imagine the write up... Graded EX but took 3 attempts and $200 in submission/shipping fees over 6 months to get this one holdered!

Ask anyone who submits large volumes of cards and they will tell you the grading services make mistakes. Just because it grades does not mean it should. Similarly just because it has been rejected does not mean it should.

[Peter_Spaeth]

I agree Greg, but that said I would still want to know about rejections. Knowledge is power, or something like that. And I would tend to err on the side of thinking a card that has been rejected and also has graded is bad. Someone must have seen something on the prior occasion that gave them hesitation. Will it ever happen? No, most likely not, for the reasons you state.

[botn]

Collecting graded cards requires one to have incredible amounts of faith in the the holder the card has been encapsulated. Though having a keen eye for detecting alterations (at least those which can be be seen through the holder) would also prove to be helpful.