New PSA Terms & Conditions: Comp. Damages and Injunctive Relief for Card Doctoring

[4815162342]

PSA updated their Terms & Conditions last week to include the following language regarding card doctoring:

‘12. Doctored and Inauthentic Items; Fraud Prevention and Investigation.

(a) You represent and warrant that any item submitted for any PSA Grading Service is genuine and you have no knowledge and no reasonable basis to believe that the item is a “Doctored” item. You affirm your obligations with respect to Doctored items set forth in these Terms. For purposes of these Terms, “Doctor,” “Doctored” or “Doctoring” means the alteration of the appearance of an item by things such as, but not limited to, trimming, re-coloring, bleaching, power erasing, cleaning, waxing, re-backing or any other form of restoration used to enhance the appearance, condition or content of an item.

(b) You agree that you will not Doctor items or participate in any way in Doctoring items or submitting any items to PSA for grading which you know or have reason to believe have been Doctored in any way, and acknowledge that the determination as to whether an item should be authenticated or graded shall be made solely by PSA in accordance with its standards. You acknowledge that detecting Doctored items is very difficult. You acknowledge that PSA will not authenticate or grade items which, in the judgment of PSA, bear evidence of Doctoring. However, because the determination by PSA to reject such Doctored items will require a review by PSA’s personnel, you will be required to remit, as set forth herein, the standard fee for any such Doctored items that are submitted to PSA. You acknowledge that Doctoring is wrongful and inappropriate activity which is harmful to PSA, and all of your obligations in this Section 12 shall survive termination of these PSA Terms.

…

(d) You agree that PSA would suffer irreparable damages if you were to engage in Doctoring of any item and that PSA is entitled to not only compensatory damages but also preliminary and final injunctive relief for any breach of your obligation not to Doctor items or to submit Doctored items to PSA in violation of your obligations hereunder.’

https://www.psacard.com/termsandconditions

[Leon]

So all cleaning (water and a q tip etc..) is now doctoring? And I am supposed to say that in order to submit to them it is wrong and I won't do it. Nice.

Originally Posted by 4815162342

PSA updated their Terms & Conditions last week to include the following language regarding card doctoring:

‘12. Doctored and Inauthentic Items; Fraud Prevention and Investigation.

(a) You represent and warrant that any item submitted for any PSA Grading Service is genuine and you have no knowledge and no reasonable basis to believe that the item is a “Doctored” item. You affirm your obligations with respect to Doctored items set forth in these Terms. For purposes of these Terms, “Doctor,” “Doctored” or “Doctoring” means the alteration of the appearance of an item by things such as, but not limited to, trimming, re-coloring, bleaching, power erasing, cleaning, waxing, re-backing or any other form of restoration used to enhance the appearance, condition or content of an item.

(b) You agree that you will not Doctor items or participate in any way in Doctoring items or submitting any items to PSA for grading which you know or have reason to believe have been Doctored in any way, and acknowledge that the determination as to whether an item should be authenticated or graded shall be made solely by PSA in accordance with its standards. You acknowledge that detecting Doctored items is very difficult. You acknowledge that PSA will not authenticate or grade items which, in the judgment of PSA, bear evidence of Doctoring. However, because the determination by PSA to reject such Doctored items will require a review by PSA’s personnel, you will be required to remit, as set forth herein, the standard fee for any such Doctored items that are submitted to PSA. You acknowledge that Doctoring is wrongful and inappropriate activity which is harmful to PSA, and all of your obligations in this Section 12 shall survive termination of these PSA Terms.

…

(d) You agree that PSA would suffer irreparable damages if you were to engage in Doctoring of any item and that PSA is entitled to not only compensatory damages but also preliminary and final injunctive relief for any breach of your obligation not to Doctor items or to submit Doctored items to PSA in violation of your obligations hereunder.’

https://www.psacard.com/termsandconditions

[BobbyStrawberry]

This reads to me like they are no longer going to encapsulate trimmed cards at all anymore, which would include ones like this:

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/bids/bidplace?itemid=188543

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Leon

So all cleaning (water and a q tip etc..) is now doctoring? And I am supposed to say that in order to submit to them it is wrong and I won't do it. Nice.

I’m sure this is aimed at the marketed card cleaning solution companies that openly brag online, with pictures and video, about bumping 3 or 4 grades with PSA.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

I’m sure this is aimed at the marketed card cleaning solution companies that openly brag online, with pictures and video, about bumping 3 or 4 grades with PSA.

Kurt's Card Care or whatever it's called, the signature product of the "bro" era of card collecting. Facial hair, backwards ball cap, t shirt, multiple devices, social media accounts and apps, and some Kurt's to make your shiny into 10s. This ain't your father's hobby no more and for those of you over a certain age like me, it ain't yours either.

If only PSA actually took card doctoring more seriously and didn't just pay lip service.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Kurt's Card Care or whatever it's called, the signature product of the "bro" era of card collecting. Facial hair, backwards ball cap, t shirt, multiple devices, social media accounts and apps, and some Kurt's to make your shiny into 10s. This ain't your father's hobby no more and for those of you over a certain age like me, it ain't yours either.

If only PSA actually took card doctoring more seriously and didn't just pay lip service.

You would think with some of the high end altered cards they are paying out big money on they would start taking it WAY more seriously. From reading their new terms and conditions it seemed like they might go after the submitter or is that just my uneducated take.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by bnorth

You would think with some of the high end altered cards they are paying out big money on they would start taking it WAY more seriously. From reading their new terms and conditions it seemed like they might go after the submitter or is that just my uneducated take.

CU sued some coin dealers years ago for submitting doctored coins. You would think it would be a bad PR move, acknowledging they had been fooled.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

CU sued some coin dealers years ago for submitting doctored coins. You would think it would be a bad PR move, acknowledging they had been fooled.

Opinions vary greatly but for me it would be a great PR move. As a collector it would make me want to use them rather than those that do nothing to the scammers.

On the coin side I was recently watching videos and several coin guys bragged about sending in cleaned coins. Very similar to the card bro videos.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Opinions vary greatly but for me it would be a great PR move. As a collector it would make me want to use them rather than those that do nothing to the scammers.

On the coin side I was recently watching videos and several coin guys bragged about sending in cleaned coins. Very similar to the card bro videos.

Cleaned coins is a nuanced subject. It would take a Talmudic scholar to decipher PCGS' rules on what is and is not kosher.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

PSA updated their Terms & Conditions last week to include the following language regarding card doctoring:

‘12. Doctored and Inauthentic Items; Fraud Prevention and Investigation.

(a) You represent and warrant that any item submitted for any PSA Grading Service is genuine and you have no knowledge and no reasonable basis to believe that the item is a “Doctored” item. You affirm your obligations with respect to Doctored items set forth in these Terms. For purposes of these Terms, “Doctor,” “Doctored” or “Doctoring” means the alteration of the appearance of an item by things such as, but not limited to, trimming, re-coloring, bleaching, power erasing, cleaning, waxing, re-backing or any other form of restoration used to enhance the appearance, condition or content of an item.

(b) You agree that you will not Doctor items or participate in any way in Doctoring items or submitting any items to PSA for grading which you know or have reason to believe have been Doctored in any way, and acknowledge that the determination as to whether an item should be authenticated or graded shall be made solely by PSA in accordance with its standards. You acknowledge that detecting Doctored items is very difficult. You acknowledge that PSA will not authenticate or grade items which, in the judgment of PSA, bear evidence of Doctoring.

I joked about this comment on blowout. I'll just boldface it here. PSA is admitting that they can't detect most card doctoring.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by swarmee

I joked about this comment on blowout. I'll just boldface it here. PSA is admitting that they can't detect most card doctoring.

Joked or stated a fact?

[Beercan collector]

Wonder if ‘52 Robinson PSA 02023137 That went from a PSA 8 to
PSA authentic played a small part ?
https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=353161