Sportsfest 2008..Anyone attend?

[Archive]

Posted By: paulgrubor

I was going to set up at this show but I coach a girls 18U fast pitch softball select team and we had a game scheduled on Sunday.
From what I'm hearing, the attendance on Friday was pathetic. Did any of you guys go? How was Saturday and Sunday?

I was called a few times by a rep of Sportsfest asking me why I wasn't setting up at the show. I even heard they were giving deals or a gas allowance. Well even if I wasn't coaching a team, I probably still would have passed on the show. For me its easier auctioning cards on Ebay vs the show scene. The booths are 795.00 and gas, food, tolls, lodging, etc. make it not very cost efficient. Now, If they lowered the fees for tables and quit charging $150.00 an autograph, I might just reconsider.

I would say if I sold $10,000.00 worth of merchandise/cards on Ebay my fees including paypal would probably be around $1200.00.
Now if I buy a booth and figure in all the rest my fees my cost would be around $1400.00. I agree that the one on one dealing is fun and there's nothing like a good trade. How many good show are there per year? I did the National and Sportsfest last year and dealers were telling me that there are maybe 5 or 6 good shows left. I remember the late 80's and setting up in Minnesota at the Fair grounds 4 times per year, Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, San Francisco, Gloria's, St louis, etc etc were dynamite shows. The lack of good shows must have to do with the internet. I've got some great customers that send me want lists and auction off 500 or so cards per month, and its all because of the internet. Now, If that Ebay stock would just get past $31.00 and stay there I'd be even happier!

[Archive]

Posted By: Ed Hans

Paul,
Ebay and the internet have indeed taken a huge bite out of many local and regional shows. Where I live (western New York) is no exception. But the pendulum may have started to swing back in the other direction. The last show here (in early April) was a throwback to the halcyon days of the late 80s-Lots of collectors with honest-to-goodness cash to spend, building sets or or type collections. I for one, hope the trend continues.

[Archive]

Posted By: Tony Gordon

My observations from Saturday: the smallest customer and dealer turn out I have ever seen at a big show. There were dozens of empty dealer tables. A lot of the major national dealers were missing. Though all the dealers I talked to said they were doing well. I watched a guy throw down two thousand in cash for a '33 Goudey Ruth as I was leaving.

Quite a few guys I know brought in piles of cards to sell to the national dealers and all these guys went home happy.

Low turn out may be due to the competition this past weekend with the White Sox/Twins, Bears Fan Fest, Blues Festival and of course, my daughter's dance recital.

To improve on next year, I think the $800 dealer tables need to come down in price. Everybody and their mother is a card dealer in Chicago, there is no reason to have so many empty tables.

Also, the folks at SCD need to branch out with their advertising. I didn't hear any ads for the show on sports radio. How about a TV ad on local Chicago cable TV?

[Archive]

Posted By: keyway

I think it's about time the promoters of these shows start moving them around a little. With the expence of travel and set up at these shows, I think all will be shrinking. New shows are needed in different parts of the country, but still with quality dealers. I live in Tennessee and there are no shows in this area. Why are there no large shows in the Atlanta area. Why not in Charlotte, or Chatanooga. Seems like all the big shows are now in the Chicago area. Time to move them around. Frank

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Shows are nonexistent in NYC, but just about every other major city has them. And New York has the Javits Center and loads of hotels.

The excuse is always it's too expensive, but I don't see anything being given away in Chicago or Los Angeles. I think shows will eventually be obsolete.

[Archive]

Posted By: JimB

WHen I lived in Madison, WI in the 1990's, I always drove down for Sportsfest. It was a great show.
JimB

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

Barry--Don't forget all the shows that are in the city's surrounding area. It seems as though there is at least one a month, if not more. I do have to say that they all are terribly disappointing from my perspective. Perhaps they're better for vintage cardboard; I don't really pay attention.


And I wholeheartedly agree with the original poster's viewpoints. I refuse to lug my inventory across the country, paying exorbitant show fees, not to mention the litany of travel expenses. For dealers such as myself, who specialize in niche markets, setting up at shows is tantamount to simply throwing your money in the garbage. Dealers in my position can't afford to shell out $800 for a table. It's not smart business sense.

This is how I see a part of the problem, and (hopefully) how it might be averted:

1. The crowds at these shows are thinning out because the same dealers are always sitting there with inventories that change little from show to show, year to year. The people are getting tired of the repetition.

2. This, combined with the present-day economy, obviously causes a severe lag in sales.

3. Dealers, wary of plunking down another $800+expenses, are simply not going out as much anymore. Customers, due to the economy and lack of new material, just aren't bothered to drive to the shows anymore. eBay has also taken a hit, whereas things appear to be looking up again for the major auction houses after a not-so-great previous fiscal year.

These issues might benefit from the following, if at all feasable:

1. On the show promoters' websites and in the usual trade rags, offer dealers a few more free table draws--but make the contest open only to new dealers.

2. If not already implemented, offer a reduced rate to dealers for purchasing table space at multiple shows.

3. Find some way of giving back to the faithful dealers in an effort to have them keep coming back.

4. Offer first-time dealers a one-time discount (perhaps 30% off, or thereabouts).


As previously stated, these shows would fare better if only the customers could see some fresh faces/new stock behind/on the tables. These ideas won't solve everything, but could be a good starting point.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason L

good points, for sure.

in reading it, it sounds to me as though much of the problem could be solved by addressing the fixed costs of setting up at a show.

Drastically reduce it, and you should get more dealers willing to set up. The out of pocket up-front goes down, makes it easier to make money, may encourage more activity at shows if the dealer isn't hung up on clearing a high break-even, etc. If this happens, then you get more varied inventory, and thus more customer interest. The problem I see with the shows is that dealers are focused on making slow dollars, rather than fast nickels. The mentality that inventory isn't turning, so maximum margin must be realized is what is slowing activity...reduce fixed costs to encourage a fast nickels, high turnover environment.


Another bogey to be cleared for the in-person sales: Both sellers and buyers alike may be more hesitant to buy in person because there may be better deals to be found online in the various venues...just a thought, albeit not tremendously well thought-out.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

I do agree with your "fast nickels" theory. I still see certain dealers of affordable commons/off-grade raw cards doing well. They don't look like they're feeling the sting as hard as the wheeler-dealers.

And, to be fair, the show promoters have to lay out a hefty sum to rent many of the show venues. We can't lay the blame entirely on the table costs. There has to be a happy median there somewhere, however.

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

I know of no venue more expensive than a trade show. You can buy vintage baseball cards anywhere for less money than at a show. That's why I haven't attended one in over ten years.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

With all due respect......Absolutely not true. At every National I have been to (7-8) I have bought stuff at less than I could elsewhere. I have also bought cards I have seen no where else. Last year I bought about 10-12 Star Player cards and flipped them all at the National. I got a great deal and the buyer I sold them to got a great deal too.....To make a blanket statement is problematic. I don't go to any shows besides the National so can't speak to others....though I have heard there are a few good ones left....

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

I suppose if you stay at a show for the duration you will eventually be able to find some good deals. But for someone spending the day and walking from table to table, the prices are ghastly.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

When was the last time you walked the National, just curious? (I do stay all 5 days too)

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Atlanta. I forgot the year, but it was early to mid-90's.

I know where this is going...you like shows, I don't, and we won't agree on anything. Still friends?

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

Of course, always friends....Friends should be able to debate and disagree and still be friends. I don't take any of this personally. I do like the National as it is a great time to hoot and holler with many of my collecting friends. I go there more for the camaraderie than the buying and selling....I would venture to guess if you went to it you would have a blast too. best regards

[Archive]

Posted By: Tony Gordon

I LOVE shows!! I set up at shows most every weekend. There are some really nice small shows in Chicago's suburbs, Milwaukee and Madison. Those heading to Chicago early for the National should check out the Orland Park show on July 27. I purchase 90 percent of my merchandise at shows (well below eBay prices) from customers stuffing shoe boxes in my face or other dealers looking to move cards quickly.

The small shows in Chicago have a dedicated following and aren't going away anytime soon. I've gotten to know the promoters, dealers and regular customers real well and look forward to seeing them each week and shooting the breeze on cards and Chicago sports.

I buy and sell a great deal of cards and customers find new items on my table every week. Same goes for many of the other dealers. I rarely see dealers with the same table each week.

This Saturday (June 14, 2008) I will set up at Orland Park. Next Sunday (June 22, 2008) I'm heading out to Bloomingdale. There are also weekly mall shows in the Chicago suburbs but after working a 50-hour week, I'm not interested in a 12-hour day at a mall show. The show at Gonzaga Hall in Milwaukee is tremendous with a live auction where items go for pennies on the dollar.

I don't know what the lousy turnout at Sportsfest means for the future of card shows. I think we'll have a better idea after the National but I'm confident that the small shows in Northern Illinois and Southern Wisconsin will continue on because they serve a need by providing cheap table fees for dealers, low cost commons for set builders and comaraderie for card addicts.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bruce Perry

although prices can be higher at shows sometimes, the bigger auctions are more times than not no better after you pay the 17.5-25% surcharges...the bigger auctions do offer tremendous quality and selection....and most people know that is where the quality cards for the most part are going....but the most important factor for me is that there is no substitute for seeing a card (s) in person...no true scan can do a card justice in my opinion and show every little flaw or bad (or good) characteristic....and for those who buy the graded number or the grading company, and not the card...LOL.....I just returned from the sportsfest show on Saturday...the attendance on friday was decent and the people there were buying..I purchased several nice cards at reasonable prices, and traded for some also...a handful dealers I know well had great shows even before Saturday....the Renaissance Marriott Schaumburg hotel is first rate and one of the top ones I have stayed at in my 27 years traveling to shows....the convention area itself was as good as any I have seen..maybe too small for the national...but with the National seemingly decreasing in size every year, maybe this venue will eventually be considered....the NATIONAL experience is like no other if you are a collector (or dealer)and want to have a fun time..I have been to every one since 1985 (the 20th selling one for me is this year) except one (1988 NY) and I would not miss it for anything...if shows completely die out, and that possibility exists (for lots of reasons), that will be a huge shame

[Archive]

Posted By: Mike

The National is an absolute blast. I've been to the last six and they where great. The prices are higher than say Ebay, but you get to meet people who collect the same thing as you. It is also cool to see others collections while at the National. I'm going to the National next month and can't wait.

See y'all in Chicago!!
Mike Gray
gray766@hotmail.com

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

I'm just an old crank, what can I say.

[Archive]

Posted By: Alan

I will be coordinating a dinner get-together on Friday evening, August 1 right after the National at a restaurant in Rosemont. I will post details as the show gets closer. Hope to see you guys there !!!