SGC you need new holders.

[iwantitiwinit]

It's just amazing to me that complaints about SGC holders continue to mount and nothing is done about it. These problems are not simply associated with older holders but as far as I have experienced with holders newly circulated. In fact, I just received two t206's won at the Saco River Auction and guess what, one card had slipped completely out of the gasket.

SGC you need to do something about these constant issues and no its not in anyway convenient for me to ship the card back to you to repair something that should have been done correctly to start with. These holders suck (at least as far as t206's and t205's are concerned) and we don't need more replies from you saying that you are working on the problem or that we can always have them reholdered.

We need redesigned holders.

I'm not going to buy another SGC graded card until the holders are changed. Other than offering a grade on the card they are useless and defeat their intended purpose. They don't protect the item properly and in a few situations I have actually damaged a card while trying to shake/coax it back into place.

Now I don't want to be totally negative SGC does do a great job of grading in my opinion, they are consistent, impartial and the holders do look great, but in many cases we are spending significant amounts of money for these items and deserve better.

If you feel the same or disagree please voice your opinion. Maybe this will move SGC to act.

[kmac32]

I collect E121 cards and subset. never had an issue but I do understand where you are coming from. I had a friend that had a card come like you have described and he was able to tap the edges of the holder until the card slipped into the correct location. Shouldn't have to do that but he did and it worked.

[vthobby]

If you want cards that will not move around, look cool in their little protective airtight inner sleeve, then slab with BVG. Beckett rules in this area alone!

Damn....where is that retainer they put me on...??hmm.....

At some point (and I'm amazed it has not been addressed yet) a company has to realize they are shooting themselves in the proverbial foot by not listening to its core customers. Biz 101. AKA....common sense or is it Customer Service?

peace, mike

[vintagetoppsguy]

I think the T206s are so thin that they easily slide under the gasket. I bought one the other day and when I opened the package the card was slid under the gasket. I tapped it back into place, but it easily goes back under the gasket just by moving it around.

I contacted Earl and asked him if I could remove the card from the slab and send it back in for a re-holder. I was afraid if I shipped it back to SGC in the slab, the movement would cause it to slide back under the gasket again and do some damage to the card. He never responded. That was two weeks ago today.

I went ahead and removed it from the slab so I wouldn't risk damaging the card.

[4815162342]

David, I corrected your post.

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I think the T206s gaskets are so thin that they cards easily slide under the gasket. I bought one the other day and when I opened the package the card was slid under the gasket. I tapped it back into place, but it easily goes back under the gasket just by moving it around.

I contacted Earl and asked him if I could remove the card from the slab and send it back in for a re-holder. I was afraid if I shipped it back to SGC in the slab, the movement would cause it to slide back under the gasket again and do some damage to the card. He never responded. That was two weeks ago today.

I went ahead and removed it from the slab so I wouldn't risk damaging the card.

[jcc6252]

The first T206 I obtained in an SGC holder had the slippage problem. This has to be damaging to the card. I was able to get it back in place only after some violent tapping and cussing, lol. I find it lame, and gives me another reason to prefer PSA.

[Eric72]

Dear SGC,

Your grading and authentication services are (in my opinion) top-notch. Kudos for a job well-done.

Your holders look great, too. They make the cards stand out quite well.

However, using gaskets that don't always hold these cardboard treasures of ours in place is a serious problem. And I believe this is fixable.

I understand that any improvement to a product has associated costs. Still, it seems to me that the return on this investment would be significant. Not only would it address concerns from current customers, thereby ensuring more repeat business. It would also help you gain market share by offering a product which, compared to your current one, was superior.

Just my two cents. Although, I speak for many when stating that part of the benefit of getting cards graded is the perceived protection offered by the holder. Because of the gasket/slippage issues, SGC falls short of doing this consistently.

Imagine your favorite card slipping and sliding around inside the holder that was supposed to keep it safe. How would you feel? Many collectors feel let down.

Please fix this.

Sincerely and respectfully,

Eric

[iwantitiwinit]

Originally Posted by Eric72

Dear SGC,

Your grading and authentication services are (in my opinion) top-notch. Kudos for a job well-done.

Your holders look great, too. They make the cards stand out quite well.

However, using gaskets that don't always hold these cardboard treasures of ours in place is a serious problem. And I believe this is fixable.

I understand that any improvement to a product has associated costs. Still, it seems to me that the return on this investment would be significant. Not only would it address concerns from current customers, thereby ensuring more repeat business. It would also help you gain market share by offering a product which, compared to your current one, was superior.



Just my two cents. Although, I speak for many when stating that part of the benefit of getting cards graded is the perceived protection offered by the holder. Because of the gasket/slippage issues, SGC falls short of doing this consistently.

Imagine your favorite card slipping and sliding around inside the holder that was supposed to keep it safe. How would you feel? Many collectors feel let down.

Please fix this.

Sincerely and respectfully,

Eric

Nicely put, much more diplomatic than my sentiments and exactly what I had hoped would result from this thread. Hopefully it gets some results.

[Jobu]

+1

Has anyone on Net54 ever started an online petition using something like this, gotten as many board members as possible to sign it, and sent it to SGC? There are 6196 people on Net54 after all.

Originally Posted by Eric72

Dear SGC,

Your grading and authentication services are (in my opinion) top-notch. Kudos for a job well-done.

Your holders look great, too. They make the cards stand out quite well.

However, using gaskets that don't always hold these cardboard treasures of ours in place is a serious problem. And I believe this is fixable.

I understand that any improvement to a product has associated costs. Still, it seems to me that the return on this investment would be significant. Not only would it address concerns from current customers, thereby ensuring more repeat business. It would also help you gain market share by offering a product which, compared to your current one, was superior.

Just my two cents. Although, I speak for many when stating that part of the benefit of getting cards graded is the perceived protection offered by the holder. Because of the gasket/slippage issues, SGC falls short of doing this consistently.

Imagine your favorite card slipping and sliding around inside the holder that was supposed to keep it safe. How would you feel? Many collectors feel let down.

Please fix this.

Sincerely and respectfully,

Eric

[tiger8mush]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

If you want cards that will not move around, look cool in their little protective airtight inner sleeve, then slab with BVG. Beckett rules in this area alone!

I'm in the minority, but I agree with you Mike. If I had to choose a TPG to protect my card for the next 100 years, I'm going with Beckett (for the record I store most of mine raw in binders or boxes cuz slabs take up too much space). I believe they are good at authenticating and grading as well. We've seen errors by all 3 top TPGs, and Beckett is no different, but the masses prefer SGC and PSA I believe cuz of their registry (which leads to higher resale value). To each their own, no wrong way to collect.

Rob

[CW]

Thanks, Eric. I just copied your email and inserted my name at the end and sent it off to SGC. Hopefully someone listens and does something about it, because I'm tired of bitching.

[pclpads]

I know this board tends to go ballistic whenever anything positive is said about PSA. But for the reasons mentioned by the OP and the fact that clearly o/c cards don't seem to faze SGC for slabbing them in higher grades is why I never sub to them. And no, I am not a PSA shareholder and JO is not a relative.

[freakhappy]

Originally Posted by pclpads

I know this board tends to go ballistic whenever anything positive is said about PSA. But for the reasons mentioned by the OP and the fact that clearly o/c cards don't seem to faze SGC for slabbing them in higher grades is why I never sub to them. And no, I am not a PSA shareholder and JO is not a relative.

Lol, people love their grading companies!

I don't necessarily prefer one over the other as I collect any card in any of the three main TPG's that passes the eye test. Bob has a great point about the SGC holders...they are really starting to suck and get on a lot of people's nerves. Where's the quality control at? We pay for a service and we should get quality in return, not this shaky holder that for some reason failed to evolve with time.

One thing that I believe SGC has over PSA and BVG is that I feel I can trust, for the most part, things like paper loss being somewhere on the card when it's not supposed to be there. When I buy a VG graded card, paper loss should not be anywhere, but I've noticed it a lot more on PSA graded cards than SGC. Sometimes I feel like I get on seller's nerves because I always ask them a lot of questions about the condition, but because of these inconsistencies I feel like I have to ask to save me some issues down the road.

Anyway...SGC...get your crap together if you want to continue being a top notch grading company. Don't let something this small sink your ship!

[brewing]

Why fix the gasket issue and not address the tamper issue? PSA came out with more secure holders and now SGC leads the industry in easiest to tamper holders.

I've been an SGC fan for a long time, but my last 3 subs went to PSA.

[t206hound]

I believe this was the latest response from SGC on the gaskets... from the thread "Is this typical for SGC holders?"

http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...9&postcount=57

[The Nasty Nati]

Well I'm glad they are at least admitting their fault: http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...9&postcount=57

I still think they need to reconsider the gaskets all together. All of the other TPG's never have a problem with T206's shifting in their gaskets no matter the size of the T206. Perhaps a sturdier gasket insert like black plastic will fortify the T206's better. Tobacco cards I believe are SGC's bread and butter and yet they are historically bad at having those specific types of cards properly fit their gaskets. When you are paying $10+ on a grade and case, you'd expect better.

Still, I'm more than thrilled that they listened to whiners like myself and switched the SGC label back to the old green label style.

[iwantitiwinit]

Originally Posted by t206hound

I believe this was the latest response from SGC on the gaskets... from the thread "Is this typical for SGC holders?"

http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...9&postcount=57

Yes thier response was not adequate in my opinion and how convenient to mail back a card to be reholdered. I sent a note to them this morning also, really a version of Eric's letter and am waiting for a response. Will let you know what they say.

[glchen]

Originally Posted by pclpads

I know this board tends to go ballistic whenever anything positive is said about PSA. But for the reasons mentioned by the OP and the fact that clearly o/c cards don't seem to faze SGC for slabbing them in higher grades is why I never sub to them. And no, I am not a PSA shareholder and JO is not a relative.

Don't forget that PSA has its own holder issues which are similar to SGC's such as the cases where the card "floats" in the holder. This occurs where the PSA insert doesn't fit the card size very well, so the card floats inside the holder. Can't find the thread, but I remember there was an example in an auction where there was a high grade PSA card was floating diagonally inside the holder. In terms of pure card protection, Beckett is probably still the best as the insert typically always matches the card, and the holder is a brick so it's practically tamper proof.

[iwantitiwinit]

Received an email back from Dave Forman at SGC earlier today. I'm not going to post it here but he is aware of the problem and working to resolve it. If he gives me anymore specifics I will let you know.

[sb1]

I cracked one of the new label oversize holders today and it had not one but two gaskets, so apparently they have begun to use that strategy to keep cards from sliding over or under the gaskets, especially while being tossed around in transit.

[smtjoy]

Glad SGC is working on this. I just got a sub back and they are using a plastic gasket on this M101-6 I sent in, not crazy about the glare but protecting the card is whats most important to me so happy they are trying-

[sb1]

Also had one of those last week.

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by sb1

I cracked one of the new label oversize holders today and it had not one but two gaskets, so apparently they have begun to use that strategy to keep cards from sliding over or under the gaskets, especially while being tossed around in transit.

Putting an extra gasket in sounds like a band-aid, not a fix. Can't imagine it looks too good either.

[sb1]

Actually I had no idea there were two until I opened it. Could not tell from the outside.

[bobbyw8469]

I guess I am confused. Is it not just as simple as having a thicker gasket to help keep the tobacco cards in place?

[KCRfan1]

Originally Posted by the-illini

Putting an extra gasket in sounds like a band-aid, not a fix. Can't imagine it looks too good either.

I wonder if any cards could slip between the gaskets?

[JasonD08]

I had mostly used sgc in the past. Until they change their holders I am done (and ugly new labels). The black is nice, but gaskets are not great. My last several dozen subs have went to PSA including pre war which I rather go to SGC. Perhaps the budget is not there anymore to make a major needed fix.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I guess I am confused. Is it not just as simple as having a thicker gasket to help keep the tobacco cards in place?

It could be, but a business of any size would buy a bunch at a time so they'd be less expensive. So if they bought 10,000 gaskets doubling up is the best way to both make an interim fix and use up the old stock quicker.

Steve B

[the-illini]

Originally Posted by JasonD08

I had mostly used sgc in the past. Until they change their holders I am done (and ugly new labels). The black is nice, but gaskets are not great. My last several dozen subs have went to PSA including pre war which I rather go to SGC. Perhaps the budget is not there anymore to make a major needed fix.

Same here Jason. I prefer the look of SGC holders but I have had too many cards slide around and get damaged. PSA will get my business from now on.

I also dont see how adding a second gasket secures the card any better than a single gasket does.

[TanksAndSpartans]

Could someone please show an image of the issue of cards slipping in the SGC holder? Where is the gasket? How is what they do different from the other companies? Thnaks.

[CW]

Originally Posted by DezHood

Could someone please show an image of the issue of cards slipping in the SGC holder? Where is the gasket? How is what they do different from the other companies? Thnaks.

Here's a thread with a few examples:

Link

The "gasket" that everyone is referring to is the black insert with the square cut out for the card, which is intended to frame the card and help hold it into place.

[Joshchisox08]

I've got a little over 50 SGC's and now I'm getting scared lol. I've never had this problem but don't want to have it either.

[Luke]

I've never had the problem with t206. You're probably safe.

[The Nasty Nati]

I've definitely had issues with SGC cases. Below is a photo of my last submission where two t206 cards became loose in their casing...I was able to tap them back in but I was lucky that they didn't get damaged. Now they still float around.

Just last week I got some more T206's back and this time right out of the box several of the "brand new" slabs were cracked or had deep scratches. I emailed Earl and hopefully he'll resolve the issue.

If SGC wants to survive they really need to completely rethink their slabs. Keep the black color (which is a big draw to why people use them), but make solid slabs like Beckett and PSA. Some SGC's slabs I could literally pry them up open with my hands without a lot of effort.

That and they need a better registry. I love their customer service, but if you're paying $10+ to get a card graded, I think the consumer deserves better than a slab that is highly scratch-able where the card holder is essentially a crudely cut piece of black cardboard.

[Luke]

Wow. Ok, I stand corrected.

[TanksAndSpartans]

Originally Posted by CW

Here's a thread with a few examples:

Link

The "gasket" that everyone is referring to is the black insert with the square cut out for the card, which is intended to frame the card and help hold it into place.

Thanks Chuck. I get it now. Appreciate it.