T206 Dubuc with a Miscut Piedmont

[iggyman]

Yikes! My snipe hunt wasn't even close.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/320835723410

Lovely Day....

[mrvster]

Iggy...

I saw it when it was listed......sweet miscut.....

I put a low bid in for laughs......

[Blunder19]

cool miscut .. to bad it wasnt upside down..

[z28jd]

The upside down back in Mile High went a mile high, $2149. I feel bad for Johnny V, if a two back upside down costs that much, think of how high the four upside down 4 backs he's going to eventually buy, will now cost! Sorry Johnny

[wonkaticket]

John, might cost poor Johnny even more seems I'm buying them now too, I mean you would have to look at all offers right?

Johnny just can't seem to catch a break.

[z28jd]

If I took offers on these poor Johnny would be mortgaging his house tomorrow

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by z28jd

If I took offers on these poor Johnny would be mortgaging his house tomorrow

LOL, so true. Johnny you going to let us beat you up like this?

[jcmtiger]

I wouln't even call that miscut, just creased and damaged.

Sorry did not see the back. Miscut on back

Joe

[atx840]

I was the underbidder

[Blunder19]

in my opinion the mile high auction was crazy hi.. unitl I see a 2nd sell for over $2K im considering that a battle between 2 guys for that 1 particular card... Id be surprised if it was more than 2 people bidding that up all the way...I wish we could see a list of the number of bidders on each lot... bidder #1 vs Bidder #2 for example.

its funny how back in 1910...some guy... probably his first day on the job... put a sheet in upside down... then lined the sheet up off center and cut it... and his mistake is worth thousands these days...

I solute you.. rookie factory worker from 1910.

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by Blunder19

in my opinion the mile high auction was crazy hi.. unitl I see a 2nd sell for over $2K im considering that a battle between 2 guys for that 1 particular card... Id be surprised if it was more than 2 people bidding that up all the way...I wish we could see a list of the number of bidders on each lot... bidder #1 vs Bidder #2 for example.

its funny how back in 1910...some guy... probably his first day on the job... put a sheet in upside down... then lined the sheet up off center and cut it... and his mistake is worth thousands these days...

I solute you.. rookie factory worker from 1910.

Jamie, no offense but that is a really silly comment. This was just a case of a bidding war between two interested parties regarding this item? Jamie that describes just about every auction. There can’t be two or more under bidders ever. There is a winner an under bidder and folks who participated that’s it (and sometimes folks shilling.) LOL

Jamie you can say you wouldn’t pay that price yourself that’s 100% fair, but to say something is crazy high or anomaly is not perhaps the proper way of looking at it. As the market clearly showed what someone was willing to pay for the item the other night.

IMO it’s very hard to set value on many of these cards because some of them trade so irregularly one could put ballparks to some cards but others it’s very hard to say until they are offered. Then through the process of an auction a price is realized. Regardless of how many people participate.

Exactly the point with Leon’s other thread about what would these sell for. Leon knows my private offer but to truly see what the market will show he needs to put them off in an auction and wait till closing night.

Will I get the same down the road? Will I get more? Did I over pay? The market will decide that when it’s sold.

In the end all cards are worth only what somebody is willing to pay. In regards to these oddballs the market is even less defined and way more thin because each one is one of kind per say and they trade way less often.

Cheers,

John

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

In regards to these oddballs the market is even less defined and way more thin because each one is one of kind per say and they trade way less often.

So true. I have sold a few of my error cards over the years and basically been able to dictate the prices I wanted because they are just that idiosyncratic.

The Dubuc price was in the right range for a T206 mistake; that was a nice miscut back. IMO a front miscut would be worth even more; I'd not be surprised to see one sell for $300 or more on fleabay.

[mrvster]

Wonka

GREAT SCORE!!....that upside down back is sick.....a clean , great example.....i told Jimmy, the auction would probably go $2500.00......you actually got it cheaper than i expected!.....

You nailed it Wonka....these anomalies are too unique to put a price on it...especially upside down backs....i have seen approx 25 total of them in 15 years....hmmmm....much rarer than drum/uzit ....thats including all different backs....i beleive an upside down back should be part of a back run....but i know that might not be "main stream" for now


Anyway, you got a great example CONGRATS....the true acid test Jamie, put your om at auction....

Ask jim what he'd sell his upside down sweet cap Batch for...


Put your upside down om in Goodwin or Rea, i but it goes past $2500.00...i have seen only 3 upside down om total besides chris's 4 back..i told you to buy Chance and that sounded high at the time??aren't you glad you bought??

I told you to get om at $750.00, and that was a steal, but the price jumped in just a few months...and you still got a steal..

Let me put it this way, post a bst or do a survey out there asking for an upside down back...


better yet.....HOW MANY OUT THERE OWN upside down backs vs. Uzit or Drum????

I can gaurentee there are way more Drums and Uzits than upside down backs, they are just more poular cause everyone wants one in there run, but wait until everone wants an upside down back when they have others,i have been watching these things for years, they are finally getting the respect they deserve, Way rarer than Drum or Uzit....

Look at blank backs, i have been saying this for years, blank backs are rarer than Broadleaf or red Hindy or Lenox imho.....and i would take one any day over those tuf backs...the perception is"i have seen alot of blank backs" just a relative term....


They are one of a kind cards, they are unique T206 unto themselves...if a collector wanted a "one of a kind set" theyd put together the whole set this way, and none could be duplicated....how can you put a price tag on that???

Think about this....rare backs all look the same, the anomalies are all different, they are like "snow flakes"(especially the dramatic scrap, in where each one is unique!!!( this is my snowflake theory), the more dramatic, the more unique, the more value...Chris knows where i'm coming from....these freaks have just flown under the radar the last few years(to my benefit)...


Let me say another thing , Jamie....What card would you never part with besides your drum cobb??? Would that be Chance??

Jimmy r, what card would he never part with???? I can tell you that would be his blank back SICK-ASS Cassidy ghost....and he has one of the sickest collections out there


Chris....what card would you never part with


Always seem to be the most unique ones huh???Coincidence??

Sure you can hunt down bl 460 , just bl 460 is needed for back runs are they are truly rare, but on the same rarity feild as some of these freaks....try to hunt down a Chance ghost, or over- print back??? Jamie, you have been scouring BST for months, and they are few and far between.......if you asked for bl 460 and have the cash, a few will show up.....the only time i ever seen the opp for the ghost is my weimer twin....look at the offers already on him ....there are only 2 known that i'm aware of....

Leon, what are 2 of your most prized cards??could it be multi strike or Matty proof???

My point.....can't replace uniqueness.....each one HAS IT'S OWN MARKET


Keep an eye on these freaks, collectors have started to realize....if you want something truly unique, special, and rare these are the way to go...


Everyone when bored with the same ol back , Magie, ect will desire something truly unique....ya, a drum back is cool to look at or a bl.....but check out a multi strike back like Leon's, then you really see the difference...


if anyone is bored with there freaks, send em my way!!LOL
Peace

V

[mrvster]

I dream of that "sheet"



I will work for t206!LOL......

Adam,

You nailed the market to the "T"....

Titus is Chillin.....still can't figure that card out...

[mrvster]

That double vision...I've been looking for this Damn example for 12 years and finally got one....Close my eyes, that double Vision....

Chris, YOUR THE MAN....Jamie and Chris, you guys also, thanx...one of my "white whales"....

[sb1]

Stayed tuned for the next B & L Auction, upside down Bender!! from the same sheet as Johnny's. The card was discussed here many years ago and now being offered for sale.

[scottglevy]

That will be fun to see at auction

S

[atx840]

Loving the double strike Johnny! Wish this one had more of an offset.

[mrvster]

Chris,

Your card (scrap) is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!

The upside down bender back is SWEET!!!

I love these cards....

[Exhibitman]

I know it isn't vintage but I just got these:

[Gradedcardman]

Had to be at least 3 of us on the Engle in the Mile High auction. I took it to 1800 and had to bail thinking that the Schlei Lenox on ebay was mine !! Someone made a great offer on it and I lost everything I was after !!

Never again !! John that is one beauty of a card !!

[mrvster]

John


...you got a great card....Believe it or not, i didn't even bid....it wasn't me driving up the price, just an undervalued type of card that now collectors realize is a tufer card than uzit or drum any day inmho, some might say i'm crazy, but i think i am anyway...Sorry u lost Adam, it is a super card...they come up, but got to get em when u can....i was lucky to grab a few when i could....took a few years...but thanks to fellow board members who helped me over the years..

Adam....Great cards also, I love the Ryan....i have been a huge fan since a kid and still have the 70's and 80's stuff.....and his rookie in a lower sgc grade..

....I think I might Start a post of upside down T206 Cards...

[Gradedcardman]

If you got extras...Let me know !!

[mrvster]

Adam...

I have a few but have been trying to collect one in every back which will take a lifetime! if possible examples exist, but if i change my mind id keep you in mind....they are EXTREMELY tuf...... you have to almost refer to them by name, the Parent, The Thebo, Ect....as most of my cards are one of kinds or two of a kind, pretty cool to do that....like the Bender Ghost.... or Chris and Jamies Chance ghost...


If you see one, pull the trigger, as they are under valued now, but the cat is coming out of the bag on alot of these cards....i will not be able to afford them soon.......as collectors get bored of looking at the same ol' type of back, they will seek an alternative rarity such as these....then hold on, cause will be tuffer to pick up an upside down back than drum or quite possibly bl 460....they are just as rare inmho....

a 1 K card a few years ago is becoming a 10K card...i knew i should have grabbed every example i saw





HOW MANY UPSIDE DOWN BACKS OUT THERE???

[Jaybird]

If I knew I could get it for what John paid and not get into a bidding war, I would've bought it. I think it's a fair price for a card not seen very often and rarely available. I'm saying what everyone else has already said but the only reason I didn't get into the bidding was that I know there are a few diehard collectors going after these cards. If it was just me and a dealer working out a price for this card, I can tell you I would probably have paid this. It is a clean example, nice looking card with a miscut back.

There are other examples but if you have a solid VG-EX grade collection, this card fits in there better than some others I've seen with creases and other distractions.

The other thing to consider when looking at auction prices is that if you wanted the card, you would have had to pay higher than the auction price for it. Obviously, someone was willing to go to the level that it landed at, so if you put yourself back in time (TIME MACHINE?) on the card and want it, you WOULD NOT have gotten it at that price and would have had to go AT LEAST one increment higher.

[mrvster]

Great points Jay......btw.....Thanks for Hemphill card....i love it!!....John's pristine taste fits the engle......i would' ve love it if it was half burned!LOL..


I started a thread with upside down backs...very rare backs Imho....took me years to get a few examples....

[atx840]

Originally Posted by Jaybird

IThe other thing to consider when looking at auction prices is that if you wanted the card, you would have had to pay higher than the auction price for it. Obviously, someone was willing to go to the level that it landed at, so if you put yourself back in time (TIME MACHINE?) on the card and want it, you WOULD NOT have gotten it at that price and would have had to go AT LEAST one increment higher.

Exactly this, I was bummed when I missed the SGC A Manning UZIT back at $1500 a few months ago but after checking what I might have needed to go up to win it, minimum over 2k with BP.

Agree Johnny, these are getting a bit too heavy for me now and so ends my short lived "major" error pickup run. There are still some decent little mistakes out there that fly under most peoples radar (two names, regular back miscuts etc).

You and Jamie have some amazingly rare and cool cards! Let's see those upside down OMs gents.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by atx840

Agree Johnny, these are getting a bit too heavy for me now and so ends my short lived "major" error pickup run. There are still some decent little mistakes out there that fly under most peoples radar (two names, regular back miscuts etc).

Chris, they aren't expensive if you are patient. I picked up almost all of mine for the price that an undesirable piece of scrap should go for - they were sold to me by people who hoped I wouldn't notice they had slipped a piece of garbage in among a large lot of 'correct' cards ; i.e.- I didn't even realize I had bought them until they arrived.

[atx840]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Chris, they aren't expensive if you are patient. I picked up almost all of mine for the price that an undesirable piece of scrap should go for - they were sold to me by people who hoped I wouldn't notice they had slipped a piece of garbage in among a large lot of 'correct' cards ; i.e.- I didn't even realize I had bought them until they arrived.

Yeah those hidden gems are what I'm banking on! Now when can we work a deal on that undesirable wet sheet transfer Bescher

[Jantz]

Scott & Chris

I couldn't agree more. A lot of little gems still out there. I've picked up 4 two name T206s now and the most I paid for any one of them was just recently when I got the Barbeau/Strang for $30.

Picked up a Jennings with a Piedmont back cut similiar to the Dubuc and the dealer actually lowered his price due to the miscut.

I didn't see the Dubuc when it was listed on Ebay. I have been avoiding this seller because half the time his back scans don't load up and I've asked him questions about a card he was selling and he never replied.


Jantz

[Runscott]

Jantz, I have to admit - that Dubuc card does nothing for me.

I won a lot of about 400 raw T206's 8 years ago and would have lost money on it except for two upside-down backs that were actually centered pretty well. The Wiltse ghost front and Bescher ghost back were in a lot of about 250 raw cards. I do admit to springing for about $75 for this one, though:

[willworkforT206]

Just for closure on this thread, I am the high bidder on the Dubuc miscut Piedmont back. Certainly not the coolest miscut, but I went after it pretty hard because I already own another Dubuc print freak and thought it would make a nice companion piece. It ended up going for more than I thought it would, but I'm happy to have won it. Slight back miscuts are pretty easy, but the more severe miscuts and especially the upside downs are pretty hard to find. Personally, I think such backs are underrated. This was the first severely miscut back I've had a shot at in a long time.

Totally agree with Johnny about the freaks. They are rare and they are unique, which is what makes them so cool. It's taken me quite a while to learn to appreciate them.

My other Dubuc print freak is an upside down Sweet Caporal, which I will post in Johnny's T206 upside backs thread.

Steve

[mrvster]

You just hit the nail on the head!!!If me or Chris didn't win Dubuc, glad it went to you!!congrats and sorry for driving it up on you......great compliment to your dubuc sweet ass upside down....great pair of freaks...


btw steve....you actually got a bargain on the dubuc, those more severe miscuts like that are few and far between with that much dramatic miscut....great score....a sleeper card that will only gain more popularity once collectors realize how cool and really rare they are....that card you picked up is tough to hunt down, an example like that...just ask jamie...

you did great my friend, if you ever want to part with it, u know how to ask.....

[z28jd]

Few more miscuts while I got the cards out, the one with the top to bottom(90/10 cut) is cut the same on the front. The sweet cap printer mark is just along for the ride

[mrvster]

Johnny!!

Great cards.....Sweet ass crop....that's the crop that kept me searching