Shuttle to scuttle. grrr

[Ladder7]

Lotsa jobs went poof, and notit just inas Central Fla. We're gonna pay Russia to send our astronauts to the ISS. At least 2500 jobs eliminated and that's just the beginning. Brilliant

What's in theearnest wprks?.. A token, scaled-down space program. I hear our $ can be better spent on Earth issues. But, isn't this just as important?

I was born a month before the space race began in earnest with Sputnik. I've followed it in awe since grade school, as many my age have. More people around here are more concerned with the Red Sox and the Bruins prospects. *sigh*


Space exploration timeline;

http://my.execpc.com/~culp/space/timeline.html

[teetwoohsix]

I agree Steve, there are MANY other ways this Country could find other "monies" that are being wasted in other areas than to scrap all of the progress we've made with our space programs. Sign of the times I guess.......sad. Degeneration right before our eyes- people need to wake up.

Sincerely, Clayton

[vintagetoppsguy]

Ok, I'm probably going to get blasted for this, but I disagree and I'm from Houston where a lot of the jobs will be lost.

Sure, we've made progress with the space program, but for what? What's the goal? That man may live in space some day? Come on.

I think those monies could be better spent on other things (at least with the econonmy the way it is).

I do agree that there is also a lot of wasted money in other areas that needs to be cut as well.

Again, what was the goal of the space program?

Not sure of the benefits of the space program (outside jobs, especially in R&D), but it beats the U.S. government allotting $2.6 million dollars to educate Chinese prostitutes about responsible drinking (see below).

http://www.cnsnews.com/node/47976

[barrysloate]

The space program seems a little out of date today. When men landed on the moon the world was in awe, it was a galvanizing moment. Is anybody except a small group of diehards paying much attention to each shuttle launch? Interesting yes, but not a high priority anymore.

[canjond]

The scientific and medical communities have benefited immensely from the shuttle programs, even if those achievements are not as glamorous and newsworthy like the Apollo missions were.

Just a small sampling of breakthroughs that have resulted from the shuttle program include:

•"cool" laser heart surgery technology
•body imaging
•infrared thermometer
•light emitting diodes (LED)
•composite forceps
•digital mammography

It's sad and disheartning that we are taking a (hopefully) temporary break from space. IMO, our leaders should be ashamed of their poor planning.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

The space program seems a little out of date today. When men landed on the moon the world was in awe, it was a galvanizing moment. Is anybody except a small group of diehards paying much attention to each shuttle launch? Interesting yes, but not a high priority anymore.

I grew up in Clear Lake City, home of NASA. I played in Nasa Area Little League. Many of my early childhood friends had parents that work(ed) there. I think we should continue the program and not continue sending support for countries that harbour terrorists and lie to us about it. And we can quit funding insane things like has been pointed out in this thread too.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by Leon

I grew up in Clear Lake City, home of NASA. I played in Nasa Area Little League. Many of my early childhood friends had parents that work(ed) there. I think we should continue the program and not continue sending support for countries that harbour terrorists and lie to us about it. And we can quit funding insane things like has been pointed out in this thread too.

Well there is no question America does not spend its money wisely. There is so much waste, and so much fraud, that if we could become a more efficient nation we could afford things like the space program. Look how bloated everything is these days- do you know how much money could be saved if we could trim the fat? But that's for those idiots in Washington to work out.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Leon

And we can quit funding insane things like has been pointed out in this thread too.

Like nearly $600K to study shrimp on a treadmill?

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/federa...-Taxpayers.htm

How ridiculous is that?

[canjond]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Like nearly $600K to study shrimp on a treadmill?

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/federa...-Taxpayers.htm

How ridiculous is that?

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by canjond

The scientific and medical communities have benefited immensely from the shuttle programs, even if those achievements are not as glamorous and newsworthy like the Apollo missions were.

Just a small sampling of breakthroughs that have resulted from the shuttle program include:

•"cool" laser heart surgery technology
•body imaging
•infrared thermometer
•light emitting diodes (LED)
•composite forceps
•digital mammography

It's sad and disheartning that we are taking a (hopefully) temporary break from space. IMO, our leaders should be ashamed of their poor planning.

Very well said.

As far as the goal of the space program, I imagine the main goal would be to find signs of life in the universe, or evidence of life having existed in space before on other planets or in other galaxies. I think this is what the space station is about- testing the waters, so to speak, with humans living in space for extended periods of time, maybe with the ultimate goal of having them stay in space for longer periods of time further out in space. This is just my take- I honestly don't follow the space program too much. I guess I'd rather see money spent on this instead of us occupying all of these foreign countries in the name of "war on terror" or running guns into Mexico and giving them to the drug cartels, or like the examples above- shrimp on a treadmill??? WTF ???

Apologize if I'm ranting, I've just been bothered lately about the mess our country is in.

Sincerely, Clayton

[barrysloate]

Just about everybody is pissed about what's going on Clayton. Is it really possible we will default on August 2? Normally I would say they will never let it happen, but with this gang of idiots running the asylum, who knows?

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by canjond

•"cool" laser heart surgery technology
•body imaging
•infrared thermometer
•light emitting diodes (LED)
•composite forceps
•digital mammography

I disagree. Sorry, but this looks like copy and paste to me. I can copy and paste too:

Body imaging:
The first full body security scanner was developed by Dr. Steven W Smitth, who developed the Secure 1000 whole body scanner in 1992. He subsequently sold the device and associated patents to Rapiscan Systems, who now manufacture and distribute the device.

The first passive, non-radiating full body screening device was developed by Lockheed Martin through a sponsorship by the National Institute of Justice (NIJ)'s Office of Science and Technology and the United States Air Force Research Laboratory. Proof of concept was conducted in 1995 through the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA). Rights to this technology were subsequently acquired by Brijot Imaging Systems, who further matured a commercial-grade product line and now manufacture, market and support the passive millimeter wave devices.

Infrared thermometer:
Sir William Herschel, an astronomer, discovered infrared in 1800. He built his own telescopes and was therefore very familiar with lenses and mirrors. Knowing that sunlight was made up of all the colors of the spectrum, and that it was also a source of heat, Herschel wanted to find out which color(s) were responsible for heating objects. He devised an experiment using a prism, paperboard, and thermometers with blackened bulbs where he measured the temperatures of the different colors. Herschel observed an increase in temperature as he moved the thermometer from violet to red in the rainbow created by sunlight passing through the prism. He found that the hottest temperature was actually beyond red light. The radiation causing this heating was not visible; Herschel termed this invisible radiation "calorific rays." Today, we know it as infrared.

LEDs:
Electroluminescence as a phenomenon was discovered in 1907 by the British experimenter H. J. Round of Marconi Labs, using a crystal of silicon carbide and a cat's-whisker detector. Russian Oleg Vladimirovich Losev reported on the creation of a first LED in 1927. His research was distributed in Russian, German and British scientific journals, but no practical use was made of the discovery for several decades. Rubin Braunstein of the Radio Corporation of America reported on infrared emission from gallium arsenide (GaAs) and other semiconductor alloys in 1955. Braunstein observed infrared emission generated by simple diode structures using gallium antimonide (GaSb), GaAs, indium phosphide (InP), and silicon-germanium (SiGe) alloys at room temperature and at 77 kelvin.

In 1961, American experimenters Robert Biard and Gary Pittman working at Texas Instruments, found that GaAs emitted infrared radiation when electric current was applied and received the patent for the infrared LED.

The first practical visible-spectrum (red) LED was developed in 1962 by Nick Holonyak Jr., while working at General Electric Company. Holonyak is seen as the "father of the light-emitting diode". M. George Craford, a former graduate student of Holonyak, invented the first yellow LED and improved the brightness of red and red-orange LEDs by a factor of ten in 1972. In 1976, T.P. Pearsall created the first high-brightness, high efficiency LEDs for optical fiber telecommunications by inventing new semiconductor materials specifically adapted to optical fiber transmission wavelengths.





Those were only three of the bullet points I Googled. I'm sure I would find similar results if I searched the others, but I just don't have time (nor do I care).

I agree with Barry's comments, "The space program seems a little out of date today. When men landed on the moon the world was in awe, it was a galvanizing moment. Is anybody except a small group of diehards paying much attention to each shuttle launch? Interesting yes, but not a high priority anymore."

And honestly, does anybody give a rat's you know what if life exists on other planets or galaxies? Sure, it would be neat to know, but do we need to spend billions of dollars to find out when we could spend the money on better things? Clayton, yes our country is in a mess. So is the world. Let's fix the problems in our own world before we go searching for life in other worlds.

[canjond]

Copy and paste - yes it is. And, I can respect your opinion even if I completely disagree (what makes America great). However, if you're interested in reading some more about NASA's LED breakthroughs as it relates to helping cancer patients and bone-marrow transplant recipients (just as one example), here's a link:

http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2003...al_trials.html

A quick summary as follows:

"Doctors at the Medical College of Wisconsin in Milwaukee have discovered the healing power of light with the help of technology developed for NASA's Space Shuttle. Using powerful light-emitting diodes, or LEDs, originally designed for commercial plant growth research in space, scientists have found a way to help patients here on Earth."

[teetwoohsix]

And honestly, does anybody give a rat's you know what if life exists on other planets or galaxies? Sure, it would be neat to know, but do we need to spend billions of dollars to find out when we could spend the money on better things? Clayton, yes our country is in a mess. So is the world. Let's fix the problems in our own world before we go searching for life in other worlds. (quote)

Well, I do (give a rats you know what) if life exists on other planets or galaxies- but that's just me. I guess I look at space exploration as science, and I'd much rather fund science than fund fake wars.

Just about everybody is pissed about what's going on Clayton. Is it really possible we will default on August 2? Normally I would say they will never let it happen, but with this gang of idiots running the asylum, who knows? (Quote)

I don't know Barry- I think we defaulted already- we are defaulting every day. There is no way in hell we could ever pay back the trillions we owe- do you see it? It is sickening that we've allowed things to get to this point. If any of us did this lousy of a job where we work (or worked) we'd have been fired a long time ago.

[barrysloate]

It's over my head Clayton- I'm too busy worrying about paying my own bills.

[Exhibitman]

The argument that there are other things more wasteful than NASA is a straw man argument; the question is not whether there is additional waste but whether the space program is a luxury that needs to be cut in supposedly lean times. If you believe that times are tough and we need to make difficult budget choices, adios Buck Rogers.

Frankly, the responses in this thread are indicative as well of the schizophrenia evident in so much of the political discourse today. Government is inefficient and wasteful and taxes need to be cut...except for the programs we like--keep your stinkin government hands off our farm subsidies, military industrial complex and space programs! I would think that if it is more efficient, leaner and cheaper, to send up our people using the Russian space infrastructure--who aren't our enemy any more, BTW--the shrink-government-lower-taxes cadres would be all over than as an example of good management. I also find it ironic that the same politicians who vociferously guard the private sector's mass outsourcing of the American economy and its manipulation of the tax codes to hold profits outside the USA to avoid corporate taxation are screaming about losing a few thousand NASA jobs. Why doesn't the same standard apply to government programs as to private sector industries? Why not outsource the spaceman delivery program and as much else as we can? Who needs local government offices when a phone bank in Mumbai can handle the calls from rubes asking where their Social Security checks are at a fraction of the cost? Because we're American, damnit, and we have the right to be illogical, inconsistent and childish!

[D. Bergin]

Big fan of the space program. I think it's one of mankind's ways of pushing the envelope, and it needs to be done with as much help as possible IMO.

Part of the growth of our civilization as a whole.

There will always be "bigger" problems.

Cutting the space program certainly won't fix the economy, poverty, political partisanship, war, famine or any of the dozens of other maladies people can think of to place on a pedestal above NASA.

Many people may think what becomes of it is useless, but they have been saying that about just about every sign of progress since the beginning of humankind.

Big picture thinking may not help "you" right now..........but it will help many 25, 50, 100, 150 years down the road that may never even realize the consequences of what we do today.

[teetwoohsix]

Some great posts here !!

My favorite show is "Ancient Aliens", it is fascinating to me. I would recommend it to anyone who may be interested in Ancient Astronaut Theory-these shows are what make me feel that space exploration is something we definately need to continue- they cover a ton of mind blowing topics. I have not seen one bad episode (if you're into this stuff).