O/T: Bobby Fischer RIP

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Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

This one came as a shock. I was never a big chess fan, but have always been intrigued by mad geniuses such as Fischer and Howard Hughes. I was always hoping Fischer would have done something really interesting before this happened.

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Posted By: davidcycleback

He ineed was a curious fellow. Obviously very bright, but had personal issues.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I used to be a tournament chess player and was a bit of a chess bum in my youth, so this came as big news. But I won't call it shocking, because Fischer was a bizarre and mentally ill person, so these things can happen.

I followed his entire career closely, and probably have played out every one of his chess games. He was arguably the greatest player who ever lived, but his erratic personality, and early retirement from the game, made him an enigmatic figure. He reminds me of Van Gogh a little, who was perhaps one of the greatest painters who ever lived, but whose career lasted only a very short time.

It's hard to say Bobby will be missed, as he was deeply anti-Semitic and anti-American and overall an entirely antisocial individual.

But I will always remember the years 1970-72 when he went on to win the world championship. At one point he won 19 straight games without a draw (before the Spassky match). That is something that is so extraordinary, as great chess players draw the majority of their games, that there is almost nothing in sport to compare it to (maybe a 100 game hitting streak would give you an idea).

He was a very strange genius indeed.

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Posted By: LetsGoBucs

Strange indeed.

His is the type of story that makes you feel lucky to be "normal"....and shows that perhaps being extraordinary at one thing does indeed require sacrifice so great as to not be worth the sacrifice.

He scaled the highest heights for a short time...but lived the lowest lows the remainder of his life...always to be remembered but not in a way that one would want to emulate.

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Posted By: paulstratton

Nice synopsis Barry. I can't say I liked him as a person, but pure genius on the board.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Bobby was not a nice person. When I hung out at chess haunts in Greenwich Village in the 1970's, I knew the Rossolimo family, who were interesting in their own right. Nicholas was a grandmaster and his wife Vera helped him run one of the chess shops on Thompson Street. They were like surrogate parents to Bobby and used to tell me stories about him when he was a boy. They always knew how great a chess player he was- that was apparent very early- but they also knew how very strange he was.

When he played his match against Spassky all of America was watching one of their own try to break the Russian's stranglehold on the world title. Bobby made an amateur blunder in the first game, then accused Spassky of cheating and demanded that his chair be taken apart because Fischer was certain there were secret microphones hidden in it. He forfeited the second game and was down 2-0. It looked like everything he worked for was now wasted.

But when he sat down for the third game and began to play chess, he was a steamroller. He made the world champion look like he did not even belong in the same league, and coasted through the match to become the first American world champion since Paul Morphy in the 1850's (another tortured genius who died young).

Fischer never played a serious game again for the rest of his life. A very sad waste of talent.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Barry,

Really! We will have to play sometime. I also played in tournaments when I was younger but now that I don't have the time to play in them anymore, I play my Kasparov 9000 once in a while to test my latest ideas on how to defeat the Dragon Variation of the Sicilian Defence with my Yugoslav Attack. Like many I got my start in college in early 70s when Fischer was playing for the title. One man defeated a whole system--the Russian Chess Machine.

Jim

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Posted By: Joe D.

I never knew that Barry was a tournament chess player.
very cool.


I've never been a good chess player, although I like the game.

-- I did lose a chess game once in just 4 moves (or 6 moves? I forget). My cousin beat me that way... I guess I fell into a quick trap.

-- I really liked the movie 'Searching for Bobby Fischer'. It was one of those movies I would find myself watching everytime it was on HBO.

-- Based on the comments he made, genius or not, it sounds like Bobby Fischer was a jacka$$.

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Posted By: Marty Ogelvie

Its ironic that just this past weekend I taught my oldest son Jackson (7) how to play chess.  We played about a dozen times last weekend as he was learning the moves.  He took to it well and has been constantly asking me to play with him. 

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Posted By: barrysloate

So Jim, you are a dragon slayer! Get that white bishop out to c4 early and break up that fianchettoed kingside with your kingside pawns. Nobody slayed the dragon better in chess history than Bobby Fischer! That's a fact.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

1e4 c5 2Nf3 d6 3d4 cd4 4Nd4 Nf6 5Nc3 g6 6Be3 Bg7 7f3 0-0 8Qd2 Nc6 9Bc4 Bd2 10)Bb3 Rc8 11)0-0-0 Ne5 12)h4 h5.

One of my favorite lines against the dragon

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Posted By: barrysloate

Yep- have to castle long, because you need your king's rook on the h-file. That is where your attack will develop.

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Posted By: howard

"This is all wonderful news!"

-Bobby Fischer reacting to news of the attacks of 9/11/01

"You know they invented the Holocaust story."

-One of Fischer's milder comments about Jews

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Yeah, Howard, Fischer was a real charmer. Good riddance.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I know, he was a really sick puppy...and the greatest chessplayer who ever lived.

Very complicated individual.

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Posted By: Steve

yeah, he will be sorely missed... not

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Posted By: bill latzko

How can you play two grand masters at the same time on two different chess tables and do NO WORSE than a draw against both of them OR WIN against one with a loss against the other????

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Posted By: Shawn Chambers

Bill,

You replicate the first game's opening move on the second board and then the response to this back to the first board.... and thus pit your opponent against each other with you just being the intermediary. If #1 beats you that means you beat #2. If you beat #2 that means you lost #1...and, of course, the ever popular draw.

I still think Morphy could have taken Fischer.

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Posted By: bill latzko

checkmate!!!

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Posted By: barrysloate

I never thought of that but you're right. Only problem is grandmasters play dozens of patzers in a simultaneous exhibition. I never heard of one patzer being treated to two grandmasters.

Other than that, it would work!

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Posted By: Shawn Chambers

Barry,

Really this will work for an infinite number of simultaneous games where the infinite number is even (ha ha)...imagine an infinitely long hall with tables lining the walls - boards set up with a Grandmaster waiting at each of them. Joe Average merely has to start on whichever side (left or right) that has the white pieces. He waits for GMster #1 to move his white piece, crosses the aisle and plays the same move. He then moves up a table and, again, waits for the white move and plays the same across the aisle at the waiting table. As he makes his way to the end of the hall GMster #(infinity) makes his move, he crosses the aisle and plays this on GMster #(infintity plus one haha) and he then can head back to table #2, check black's response, cross to table #1 and play this black move and continue, again, up the aisle and begin answering the moves and continuing this process until all games are resolved.

Obviously, I don't recommend this technique for infinite games!

No matter what, though, you will never come out a loser in any games involving an even number.

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Posted By: barrysloate

I guess it will work mathematically, but you aren't really playing chess.

I believe when grandmasters play matches against dozens of opponents, they play white in every game. They don't alternate colors. So you can open every board with the same move, but you could get a different response from each player.

Or am I missing something?

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Posted By: Patrick McMenemy

My twin brother, Mike, was taught chess by his 6th grade teacher, Ms. McCoy. He in turn taught my dad, and my dad taught me how to play. Each evening the board would be set up in the dining room, and we would have the Red Sox on the radio in the background. Some of my best memories growing up were the chess games between my dad and my brother. We started playing chess around 1970, so we knew quite a bit about Bobby Fischer, and we followed his match closely.

Patrick

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Barry,

You are missing something. In simultaneous exhibitions, grandmasters have played 50 games blindfolded alternating colors. It is unbelievable.

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Posted By: Mike

I'm a strong tournament chess player, and was actually called by our local newspaper for my reaction to his death. I was born about the time he became World Champion, so I could only comment from a limited perspective. Fischer suffered from an untreated mental illness that only got worse as he got older. What was unfortunate is if he would have stayed retired and stayed out of the media, he would have died a living legend. His hate and bitterness towards the Russians was applauded by the public in the 60's and 70's. As his hate grew (probably attributed to his mental illness), his hate towards Jews and American's wasn't as popular with the media in the 90's and 00's. Simply a sad ending to the Fischer story.

My biggest suprise is how much media attention Fischer's death has received. Seeing a Fischer thread on this forum is very interesting. Seeing the Yugaslov Attack discussed is even more interesting.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Mike- what's your rating? Mine never got higher than the 1600's, as I gave up tournaments to play coffee house chess. The Village was the perfect place for that.

Jim- I've tried a single blindfold game and by about move 8 I'm lost. I've heard of guys play dozens of people blindfold and it is truly extraordinary.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Barry,

I was also 1600s ish. We would probably have close games as long as it was not 5 minute chess(i get too flustered)--I never do well when I play those guys that set up in the parks in NYC.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Mike,

In ther variation I discussed if white played Bh6 would you sac the exchange on c3.

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Posted By: Ed Ivey

He sure looked older than 64. Is there a steep price to genius?

I heard Nietzsche died talking to his cow.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Thats of course after 13Bh6 Bh6 14Qh6, Rc3!?

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Posted By: James Feagin

Bobby Fischer, the 64 year-old virgin.

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Posted By: Mike

My rating has bounced between 2150-2250 over the years. School, career and family takes a beating on your rating. I mainly play online now. I'm strong enough to compete against GM's, just not strong enough to beat them.

Against Bh6, the Rxc3 sac is thematic. But I've seen black play Bh8 and sac the exchange on f8 also. I watched a game in Chicago many years ago that featured a novelty on move 28 in the Yugaslov Attack.

Also, Fischer fathered a child with a Philipino lady about 5+ years ago.

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Posted By: Brian

Barry,
I have walked by those chess shops on Thompson St. and found them completely full
at midnight or even 1 a.m. Very intense!
Brian
(By the way, Barry, how about calling it a day and ending the auction early?
Sorry for being off-topic.)

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Posted By: barrysloate

Mike- so at 2200 you reached master level, very impressive. You would be out of my league. But I think...Rc3 is speculative. Black breaks up white's queenside pawns but it's still a tough game to win. Lots of counterplay on both sides.

Brian- I worked for several years at the Village Chess Shop on Thompson St, often until 1:00 AM. Part of my job was to play chess with people who came in, so I typically played 6-8 hours a day, for quite a few years. I eventually came to my senses when I realized I would never be great.

Jim- we probably would be equal strength but I loved speed chess. Preferred 10 minutes over 5, but played 5 minute all the time.

And I think we'll keep the auction going a little longer.

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Posted By: DJ

That's very interesting, Barry. I struggled to be mediocre at Chess and therefore a few years ago, turned my efforts full time to defeat the less than brilliant college students at Hold'Em.

I used to go to Bobby Fischer's official site and I think I went there more for the shock value. Pages and pages of non-sensical rantings. But with the genuius mind comes "that kind of crazy".

He was also one of the toughest living signatures (at the time) to obtain, with only checks (which I have owned), a few FDC's and some of his owned books with his name on it in offered to the collecting public.

I'm not shocked, nor will I miss him. He was already gone, but never the less, every death is sad.

I will post the same phrase on the VBC Forum "official Britney Spears R.I.P" thread in the very near future.

DJ

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Posted By: barrysloate

I think I've seen a few signed copies of "My Sixty Memorable Games", one of the greatest collections of games ever offered. But I would imagine an ornery nut like him wouldn't be very friendly to the general public.

Reading what his colleagues thought about him was kind of tragic. They knew throughout his career he was mentally ill, but he shut the entire world out of his life. All he cared about was chess. There was nothing else.

Edited to add I heard that some newspapers already have Brittney Spears obituary ready to go. I predict she has a very short life ahead of her.

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Posted By: Steve

Barry, Have you chosen your coffin or urn yet? Have a look at my sweet ride!

Look, they've got a Sox box!
http://www.eternalimage.net/mlb_page.html

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Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

See, this is what I meant...look how many posters are chess fanatics! Now you get to talk about yet another common interest that might not have come up in a vintage card thread! I'm happy that so many of you fine folks are enjoying yourselves.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Steve- that's pretty funny!

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Posted By: john/z28jd

I dont like chess but I couldnt pass up the vintage card chess set from the Franklin Mint. Every month for a small fee they send me one vintage card for my chess set by mail. So far I've gotten 3 Bishops,2 Kings(one of them Silver!),2 Knights and the Rooks.

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Posted By: David

I'm glad I picked this up a few months ago.

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Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

Awesome! I have NEVER, ever seen him sign "Bobby" before. Always with his first two initials. Did you get a good deal?

I picked up a cut in 1995 for $20....wish I still had it.

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Posted By: David

I got it for the minimum bid of $225 (or close to that). I was thrilled to pay it. I haven't been scouring the world for his auto's, but it's the only authenticated one I've seen.

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Posted By: barrysloate

That's terrific David, nice score.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Mike,

2200ish is impressive--my chances of beating you are probably as good as you beating Kasparov.

We are seeing many games with theoretical innovations past move 20--you c ertainly have to be well versed in opening theory to play at the highest level.

Barry--we will play 10 minute games--I can handle 10 but not 5!

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Posted By: Brad