T 205 border color

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Posted By: Rich S

Were all T205s borders gold or were there variations ? I am trying to ID this disaster of a Wiltse card.

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Posted By: boxingcardman

I've seen this same thing on other T205s, but always with very heavy wear. The gold ink had actual metal in it (not gold--from the way it tarnishes I'd guess something copper, zinc or tin based). A small T205 find I was in on a few years ago had very bright borders, much brighter than the typical cards. They'd been sitting in a box for 90+ years without light or handling to fade them. When the cards get really worn, they sometimes seem to take on a dull greenish appearance.

Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: dan mckee

There are legit green border variations in decent shape, I will try to post one later.

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

There was a whole stack of green border variations at auction recently, if I remember.

-Al

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Posted By: davidcycleback

The T205 metal has usually tarnished over the years, and in differing degrees and ways. So there will be legitimate variations in color and tone (darkness). As with the famously green Statue of Liberty, the T205 metal can have a bit of green to it. You'll also find old pennies that have turned green, and both the Statue of Liberty and pennies are made with copper.

If you find an original antique card or cabinet card with gold-colored metal that has remained as bright and shinny as new, it's probably genuine gold. People have long been enamored with gold in part because it tends not to tarnish. Some 1800s cabinet card mounts used real gold, and I believe one of the non-sport 1880s Allen & Ginter has gold touches.

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Posted By: judson hamlin

Are the green borders a true (intentional) variation, or were they produced by an error in the process (like a missing color pass)?

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Posted By: J Levine

These are not really variations but one of two things that I feel happened. The first is that many of the green borders seem to occur on the Hassan fact. 30 backed cards and Piedmont cards. I think that the print run on these may have used a higher copper content and tend to tarnish or turn green quicker. I have a couple of cards with very green borders incl. a Tinker and a Huggins.

I also feel that exposure to moisture or humid conditions often turns the borders from bight gold to a greenish gold tint. Again, caused by the copper content in the gilding.

I think someone (Ted?) has talked about this a little in his talk about the printing process and gilding process.

Joshua

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Posted By: davidcycleback

It's possible that different metal content was used during the print run, which may cause variations. More copper would mean better chance of turning green.

I think the variations are mostly caused by the tarnishing of the metal, and the green tint or very dark metal isn't the way it originally looked. I assume the borders originally resembled a new penny. 1909 pennies don't look new pennies anymore.