Wagner PSA 1 vs. SGC 30..... How is this possible?

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Posted By: Bob Beyerle

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=160150302665&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=006


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280144957957&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=018

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Posted By: barrysloate

Can't explain it, because it makes no sense.

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Posted By: Ben

The SGC 30 was listed in the 1930-39 category instead of pre-1930, so I'd imagine that cut down on views by potential bidders/buyers.

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Posted By: JimB

The photo of the SGC 30 is no longer up. Hard to compare.
JimB

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Posted By: Bob

Despite all the shots PSA has taken (many deserved), their cards still sell for the most.

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Posted By: Bob Beyerle

the cards were professionally graded, why would you need a photo?
Seriously though, it was a legit 30, At LEAST as nice as the Psa 1, probably nicer.

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Posted By: Joe D.

I would take a PSA 1 over an SGC 30 depending on the flaws in the card.

That PSA 1 looks very nice. very good eye appeal.

If the SGC 30 had a crease going through Wagner's face.... I would spend half on the the 30 than I would on the PSA 1. Actually, I would probably just avoid the SGC 30 altogether.


edit to say: Bob, I think you have a better shot at making the 'professionally graded' argument for higher graded cards. Much tougher to do so with low graded cards... where eye appeal might take over the technical grade.


I am guessing there are 20s or 30s or PSA 2s that don't present nearly as nice as this card...

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Posted By: Joseph

the cards were professionally graded, why would you need a photo?
Seriously though,


Well... the top line SHOULD BE serious. In a perfect world a BLIND PERSON should be able to
buy a graded card and know what he or she is getting.

There are some people out there who actually think that "card grading" is a joke, ya know...

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Posted By: E, Daniel

Great time for Bobby to pop in with the last three results for this card in approx. this grade. That price of over $3000 looks at least 2X going rate to me, regardless of holder.......


Daniel

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Posted By: sagard

It seems like the market pays for eye appeal when dealing with 1s/2s/3s.

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Posted By: boxingcardman

buy the card and not the holder?

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Posted By: anthony

ben, i dont think the catagory matters much when you are talking about a top name player. if i wanted to find that card, i'd run "honus wagner" or "wagner" or "honus" or something similar...its still gonna find it right? or is that not how ebay works ?

also, there isnt a photo with one of the links so i cant judge the appearance of the card

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Posted By: robert a

I agree with Ben.

I have a search set within pre 1930 stuff.

Rob

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Posted By: quan

it's hard to imagine someone missing an e95 wagner...u just do an "e95" search and there you go. the sgc30 seems more inline with recent pricing than the nice psa1. that's more than what a 3 cobb went for.

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Posted By: JimB

Bob said,
"But Jim...
August 30 2007, 12:12 PM

the cards were professionally graded, why would you need a photo?"

Bob,
It is because there is a lot of variation in eye appeal at many technical grade levels, but especially at the lower levels. Eye-appeal is a major factor when considering value and overall desirability of a card. I have always thought that the grading companies should consider eye-appeal more in their assessment of cards. The most glaring problem is with grading of N172s and similar 19th century issues, but there are others.
JimB

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Posted By: JK

Bob - I dont think the premium that one might get by having their cards graded by psa accounts for this. This is quite obviously a case of two bidders fighting it out for a card. If you take away the two highest bidders, the next highest bid is 1326 - lower than the price of the sgc 30. Its not a lot lower though - that, I think, can be explained by the eye appeal of the psa 1 - very nice for the grade.

By way of example, this psa 3 e93 cobb sold in the last mastro for a little over 2k with the juice:
http://www.mastroauctions.com/index.cfm?action=DisplayContent&ContentName=Lot%20Information&LotIndex=70466

Im willing to bet that despite the full grade difference, I could get as much or more for this sgc 30 cobb based on its eye appeal:

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Posted By: davidcycleback

That the same card in the same holder can sell twice for significantly different prices says that comparisons like these can be problematic. If a single, isolated price per price comparison proves that SGC is worse than PSA, does a similar comparison of the two sales a week apart of the same PSA card prove that PSA is worse than PSA? Obviously not. In fact, if the latter conclusion is illogical (PSA is better than PSA), that would make the former reasoning illogical as well (proves SGC is worse than PSA).

Duly note that I'm talking about a single sale versus a single sale (as is often posted on websites as 'proof' of this or of that), which is different than objectively comparing a wide body of sales.

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Posted By: Bob Beyerle

My post on August 30, 12:12 pm was intended as sarcasm. At least Joseph got it.....
My timing was bad as the photos of the SGC 30 Wagner were removed just prior to my post, however, when a 1 gets more than 2x a 30, it says something about the grading system.
Both Wagners were nice, visually, for the grades.
Generally I prefer SGC grading.
The Psa seller did have better feedback (99.8 to 99.4)
Both auctions ended within a 72 hour timeframe and both had 24 bids, which I found interesting.
Wasn't intended as a SGC vs. PSA thread (in ANY way), just strange winning bids I think....

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Posted By: Elliot

The seller of the SGC30 doesn't accept bids from Canadians.

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Posted By: Bob Beyerle

I thought he just wasn't accepting bids from people who believed in baseball cards as an asset class.

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Posted By: anthony

elliot, there are a lot of french in canada, i dont blame the seller.
just kidding, i just went to niagara falls a couple of weeks ago and it was really neat along with the canadians.

depending on what im selling, i do not openly ship to foreign countries unless the bidder contacts me first. i have had too many problems with foreigners claiming they didnt receive their item...maybe 10 total but 3 were from canada

when in doubt, keep it!

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Posted By: quan

sgc30 wagner...i hope i'm not outing the auction for the board member willing to go 4k on this card.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1909-Phila-Caramel-E95-Honus-Wagner-HOF-SGC-30-2_W0QQitemZ160153937797QQihZ006QQcategoryZ57993QQs sPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

...amazing prices. i've noticed the e95 wagner seem to go for more than the e93/e92 and maybe even the e98s...must be the pose???

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Posted By: Richard

bidding like this never happens on cards I am selling.

give me an e98 any day over this one.

for one half the price, give me two.