Very Sad! - Lionel Carter auction story

[Archive]

Posted By: Ken W.

I know the recent Lionel Carter auction story is well-known to most board members, but here is a link to listen to the NPR interview with him. Breaks your heart.


http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9923905

edited title to be more specific

[Archive]

Posted By: T206Collector

It makes me think of ways to preserve the collection, if I were him. Couldn't you see just $1.0M worth of cards in order to finance securely housing the remainder in a vault somewhere? Why just sell them all?

Maybe he's doing something like that, but keeping it quiet.

[Archive]

Posted By: mr. moses

what I'm talking about! Super share! The events that precipitated the sale and the knowledge that there are bad people out there is sad but a fact of life. That there are good people and impassioned collectors that feel like this about their "stuff" is well....... priceless. "I'd rather have the cards..........". Know the feeling all too well.......

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

While there was clearly sadness in his voice, there are mitigating circumstances here too. First, while he would much prefer to have the cards, getting millions of dollars in return is not by any means the worst scenario in the world. Second, none of us will live forever and these little pieces of cardboard will be around long after we are all gone. That other collectors now have a chance to enjoy them is a good thing too.

There is a large piece of Mr. Carter's life being taken away from him, and the robbery was unquestionably traumatic. Perhaps he feels the modern day collector/investor does not have the pure appreciation for the cards that he did, and I understand that fully. I suppose this would all have been better if he voluntarily chose to dispose of his collection. Because of the circumstances, you can see that he is somewhat resigned to their fate.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Sad story. I wish we could hear what he was planning on doing with the cards had he not sold them. As for thieves in our hobby, they're all over the place -- in fact we've had thread after thread about it. Very sad, indeed.

[Archive]

Posted By: peter chao

Although it's a sad situation, Mr. Carter does have some options. The first third of his collection sold for over a million dollars, with that kind of money he could move to a high security complex and restart his collection. It may not be the same, but there are many 89 year olds that have far fewer options.

Peter

[Archive]

Posted By: Alan

Very sad indeed. It proves that money isn't going to bring happiness to him !!

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave F

Peter....restart his collection at 89? He doesn't look too eBay literate to me....I would say that is hardly an option.

[Archive]

Posted By: peter chao

Dave,

I gotta admit that Mr. Carter probably would rather have his collection. I'd like to think that if I made it to 89 I would still be able to collect, that's one of the great things about this hobby. It's not physically taxing and doesn't necessarily take up a lot of space.

Peter

[Archive]

Posted By: D. C. Markel

First off, it is tragic that anyone has to live in fear of being robbed - especially senior citizens.

As someone mentioned earlier, there was another opinion and that was living in a highly secure, retirement community or high-rise. I have friends and relatives who live in both and someone would really have to get around a lot of security measures to rob someone.

However, I have to question his judgment by coming forward and identifying himself as someone who is selling a major sportscard collection (see page 468 of the recent Mastro Catalogue) plus all of the recent press coverage and personal interviews of the sale. He's now a multi-millionaire celebrity. If he doesn't want to be bothered by criminals and unscrupulous people, he sure is going about it in a very strange way. Sorry for the cynicism.

[Archive]

Posted By: quan

just heard on my local sports am station carter will be on to talk about the mastro sales and his collecting experience.

will be on in the 1pm pst hour.

am570radio.com

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

Thanks for the heads up....also, I think Tbob would appreciate an email from you.....regards

[Archive]

Posted By: quan

i will email him, carter is coming up after the half hour break...

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob

Just listened to Lionel Carter on the radio show thanks to Quan's link. He sounded great but reiterated his story that if it had not been for the jackass who robbed him (he got all his cards back)he would still have all his cards and he preferred them to the money. He also said that his cards sold for 1.6 million but he has many more to go and the final total will be around 3 million. I am assuming that he has an extensive postwar collection also. He sounded wistful and sad in describing his cards but I smiled while I listened to him as he sounds like a crusty old bird, and I mean that in a loving sense. Continued good health to you Lionel, may you live another 89 years and keep following those Cubbies!

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

I don't mean to speak for Lionel or to know what is inside his head but the man clearly seems to not have any interest in the 'celebrity' of his collection. I'm sure Doug Allen wanted to publicize him and his collection in order to maximize the returns on the sale -- certainly, this is an appropriate thing to do -- thus the recent spate of Lionel publicity. I also feel sad for an older man who have to live in fear of being robbed. I hope he spends every last penny of the money he makes from the sale of his cards and really lives it up.

[Archive]

Posted By: Dylan

i completely understand fear of having your collection stolen. I often think of how to best secure my collection. That being said I dont think its neccesary to sell your collection to prevent theft. There are other options ofcourse. I think the main reason for his selling is his age, it was probably just "time."

[Archive]

Posted By: James Feagin

Speaking for myself, no matter hong long I have them for, I hope I never will become so attached to cards. In the end, cards are fun remembrances and a great hobby. However, they are inanimate objects and hope to one day sell them and hope to do some good with the money for my family.

[Archive]

Posted By: Doug Allen

I will be heading out to see Lionel and Irma tomorrow.

It was funny, I bought them a TV/DVD combo so they could view the video we produced. Now Irma wants me to hook it up so they can watch the Cubs games on a nicer TV (their's dates back to the 70's).

The ultimate decision to sell came when the police sent them a person who watches over elderly in North Chicago who indicated for their own personal safety they should purchase as safe and high end security for their house. That was the point they decided it was time to part with the collection.

Actually, we offered to keep the news of his collection inside the hobby but he actually has enjoyed the publicity. He is getting tired and now he will only do phone interviews. No more TV and newpaper cameras. He has really enjoyed the feedback from local friends. Irma didn't want to know how the sale was doing but one of her friends from the senior center told her the Mantle was approaching $100k. She responded "don't worry it will go higher!".

BTW...we will be sending out a special issue of SGC collector with our June Classic Catalog. In that issue is the 30 minute video featuring the Lionel Carter collection and an interview with Irma and Lionel.

All the best,
Doug

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob

Doug- It would be great if somehow they could make it to Cleveland for the National. Maybe Mastro could convince them?
Bob

[Archive]

Posted By: Dan Koteles

JAmes. F -his collection wasnt just your run of the mill collection. What good is the money going to do? It will not ever make up for his lifelong passion and then just to see it go?

A big emotional loss for him. I wished that he could have taken it all with him when his time on earth is through...afterall thay are his.

What would I hope for him?...to take his money and snipe all of the key cards that he wanted in all the major auctions ... cannot afford then anyway.

[Archive]

Posted By: Doug Allen

That is a long one for them.

I am going to try to get them out to a show...or at a minimum a Cubs game!

[Archive]

Posted By: James Feagin

Dan---

I agree with you to an extent. However, I feel that every material possession, whether we've had them for many years or just a few weeks is on temporary loan to us. I submit that Mr. Carter will still have those wonderful memories without the physical reminders. I look at my collection that as much as I am enjoying them now, in a few years, someone else will have them and own them; and I'm OK with that. My best to Mr. Carter.

James

[Archive]

Posted By: Larry

To those that read this....

My father, Murray Gladstone was a man who worked for the painting industry for 60+ years and married to my mother for 59 years. He died this weekend of lung cancer. Unfortunately due to circumstances of having BOTH parents that were living with major health issues at the same time, their entire retirement went to paying medical and household bills during the last several years. My mother, who survived a recent heart attack cannot live alone in her modest condo anymore, she lost her husband and we had to put her 15 year old sick dog to sleep. Now we have no option but to help her with assisted living as we have 3 young children and it is so difficult to have her climb stairs and live alone. My wife and I are lucky enough that we can fund her assisted living for now. Both of my parents lost almost everything and yet they lived life without the fear of losing their material possessions, the biggest fear now is my mom will be ALONE, without the husband she adored, that is the worst part of getting old, not losing your baseball cards.

Mr. Carter is blessed to have Doug Allen help him sell his collection and leave his legacy on plastic slabs, unfortunately my benevolent father is leaving his legacy on a granite slab. Hopefully all of those that read this will put life in perspective. We have a short window here on earth and are just custodians of these cards and possessions, our true measure of a quality life should be how we treated others while we are alive. My dad's funeral was packed with all types of people, young and old, rich and poor, and for that he died a rich man, as he will be always loved and remembered......I hope Mr. Carter uses the money to enjoy his family while he can and I pray he will not have to endure the pain of suffering health issues.

Thank You and please say a prayer for my dad, a World War 2 veteran, loving father, and mostly a compassionate human being.

[Archive]

Posted By: barrysloate

Hi Larry- my condolences to you and your family. We spoke a couple of weeks ago about your dad and you knew then he was very sick. I know all about assisted living because my mother is getting older and has 24 hour care. We know sometime in the future we too may have to take that route.

Wish you all the strength to get through this difficult time. Your friend, Barry

[Archive]

Posted By: peter chao

Larry, my condolences to you and your family. Quite a few of us baby-boomers have parents that are going through similar decisions. All of a sudden our parents are living 20 years longer than expected and not everyone has financially planned for these additional years.

It's a wake-up call to all of us to do the best we can to assist them and at the same time to plan for our own retirements.

The best of luck to you and your family.

Peter

[Archive]

Posted By: Dave S

Larry...having been there myself, know what you're going thru. Your perspective certainly hit the nail on the head. Agree that your Dad died a rich man, at least in the manner that most matters. Heartfelt sympathy to you and your family...

[Archive]

Posted By: Larry

I just wanted to say thank you to many of this forum that took the time to express their sincere condolences and support, I have been truly blessed as my dad and I had 46 years together, I just will miss him terribly.

Life is short and needs to be appreciated. To me baseball cards is theraputic, it allows me to relive my early childhood days and it has given me the blessing to meet many kind and thoughtful people.

I am grateful to so many people, from my elementary school days, up thru my current position which is a paint coatings sales engineer for the Benjamin Moore Paint Co. in NY, people from all walks of life, all religions, races and classes, everyone took the time and effort by the hundreds to support our family and express their deepest feelings for a man that really was special. You can read about my father in the NY Newsday web site...www.newsday.com/obituaries dated May 3rd 2007 under his name Murray J. Gladstone or google search, he was a gem mint caring human being. Thank you.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bob Pomilla

A wonderful perspective, eloquently stated. Condolences, Larry.