The Top 5 Hofer's

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Posted By: Darren

My list
Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb
Lou Gehrig
Walter Johnson
Christy Mathewson

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Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Babe Ruth
Josh Gibson
Honus Wagner
Willie Mays
Oscar Charleston

-Ryan

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Posted By: Brett

This is a tough one, but for these guys should be top 3 anyways...

Ty Cobb
Babe Ruth
Walter Johnson

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Posted By: Aaron

Ty Cobb
Babe Ruth
Honus Wagner
Walter Johnson
Willie Mays

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Posted By: Bob

Babe Ruth
Lou Gehrig
Ty Cobb
Walter Johnson
Tie: Willie Mays and Joe DiMaggio

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

I tell you what, you'd have a hard time knocking about 20 off the top 5 list... I think the original 5 are pretty darn good... then there were others after them....

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Posted By: Damian Anderson

Tough call, my list in no order

Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb
Ted Williams
Willie Mays
Hank Aaron

Sorry to omit Negro League. I am quite a bit ignorant at this point. No pitchers, other than Ruth and really no need to take into consideration just a plus. This is a very hard call to bring to just five. Painfully absent are Young, Mathewson, Clemente, Jackie, Rose(Gambling Pete not in the hall), Gehrig, Ryan, and Wagner. Sorry Joe D does not make the list.

Damian

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Posted By: john/z28jd

1 Ruth
2 Williams
3 Mays
4 Wagner
5 Cobb

Hornsby,Gehrig,Bonds,Musial and Johnson would round out the top 10. I think after the top 3 my opinion changes constantly on 4-10

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Wagner
Cobb
Johnson
Ruth
Mathewson

Not necessarily in that order, but maybe so. I base that on reading old baseball books, new baseball books about old baseball, looking at commentary in the old guides, and considering the voiced perceptions of their contemporary players... devoid of New York bias.

Frank W.

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Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

All the prior responses have pretty much covered the bases for the top 5. Only person I think might sneak in is Lefty Grove.

Peter

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Posted By: Ray

That's a VERY tough question.

Here's mine (the bottom three could change on how I feel that day):

Ruth
Cobb
Wagner
Hornsby
Walter Johnson

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Posted By: barrysloate

Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb
Lou Gehrig
Walter Johnson
Hank Aaron

Second team:

Honus Wagner
Cy Young
Christy Mathewson
Ted Williams
Willie Mays

There are too many greats to have only five.

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Posted By: David G

My picks would be:

Babe Ruth
Walter Johnson
Ty Cobb
Honus Wagner
Ted Williams

Second 5 would have to be
Mickey Mantle
Hank Aaron
Joe DiMaggio
Willie Mays
Christy Mathewson

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Posted By: MVSNYC

babe ruth
ty cobb
chrsty mathewson
lou gehrig
cy young

2nd team:

mickey mantle
willie mays
honus wagner
walter johnson
joe dimaggio

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Posted By: Marty Ogelvie

The one constant in everyone's response has been Babe Ruth.

All but 1 of you listed Ty Cobb.

So I begin with those 2;
Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb

my next 3 would have to be;
Mickey Mantle
Hank Aaron
Watler Johnson



martyOgelvie
nyyankeecards.com

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

In order, position players only

1. Babe Ruth
2. Willie Mays
3. Hank Aaron
4. Honus Wagner
5. Ty Cobb

When the time comes, slide Barry Bonds right above Wagner.

-Al

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Posted By: Mark L

Wagner
Cobb
Ruth
Johnson
Williams

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Posted By: Sean Coe

Ruth
Mays
Josh Gibson
Walter Johnson
Wagner

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Posted By: T E

Can't see any modern player cracking this list...top two-
Ruth
Cobb

then...
Mays
Williams
Jackie

But...How do I leave off
Rogers Hornsby...only one mention of Hornsby thus far, amazing, he just won, what, six straight batting titles, six consecutive slugging pct titles, all-time BA leader in single season...incredible average, incredible power...lifetime BA= .358...you can argue he was Ruth's equal during the same time period, not quite the pop but a better hitter, which is an amazing statement...could this guy be underated because there really isn't a famous card of him?

Willie, Jackie and Teddy Ballgame, one of you has to get off my list...

And what about Satchel? And Christy? Ah shucks.

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Posted By: John Kalafarski

One of my pet topics.
1. The Sultan of Swat
2. Teddy Ballgame
3. The Georgia Peach
4. The Say Hey Kid
5. Joltin' Joe
6. The Flying Dutchman
7. The Commerce Comet

The above list, for me, represent the creme de la creme. Pitchers get their own list.

PS: No Bonds allowed here: only normal people!

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I agree with the postscript, John K.

BB can be in a pharmaceutical hall of fame. Pete is already in the Gamblers Hall of Fame, at the Tropicana in Las Vegas, so I'm told.

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Posted By: David G

Here are some top 5 modern players hofers

Nolan Ryan
Reggie Jackson
Steve Carlton
Eddie Murray
George Brett

May get some grief on some...but....

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Posted By: T E

David G, you can't take Ryan over Seaver, can you? For all those Ks and No-hitters, the guy was not the one I'd want on the mound in a do-or-die situation. Seaver, Koufax, Gibson were CLUTCH HOFs...

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Posted By: Jason L

In no particular order (since Top 5 is hard enough!)

Josh Gibson
Honus Wagner
Kirby Puckett
Rogers Hornsby
Jocko Conlon

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Posted By: Glyn Parson

5 Best Hall of Famers
Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb
Willie Mays
Lou Gehrig
Walter Johnson

5 favorite Hall of Famers

Willie Stargell
Honus Wagner
George Brett
Roberto Clemente
Babe Ruth

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Posted By: Bill Stone

1)Babe Ruth
2)Mickey Mantle
3)Joe DiMaggio
4)Ty Cobb
5)Lou Gehrig

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Posted By: Anonymous

Ruth
Wagner
Cobb
Charleston
Johnson
----
Hon. Mention (no real order)
J. Gibson
Grove
Paige
Young
Mays
Gehrig
Mantle
Aaron
T. Williams
Delahanty
Speaker
Anson
E. Collins
Musial
(note - only one 2b and no 3bs)
----
Possible Future additions :
Clemens --
Bonds
Arod (will be the greatest 3b ever)

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Posted By: barry arnold

Ruth,Cobb,Wagner,Johnson,Mathewson---My top 5

My only problem with asserting this list is that Ruth's not on my
beloved T206s.
But thankfully, Ruth made baseball BASEBALL

all the best,

barry

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Posted By: Andrew

Tough to rank pitchers and hitters together. . .

Hitters
1. Ruth
2. Cobb
3. Wagner
4. Williams
5. Mays

Pitchers
1. Johnson
2. Grove
3. Mathewson
4. Paige
5. Young


Clemens moves into the top five if he ever retires. . .

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Posted By: Richard

Ruth
Wagner
Cobb
Williams
Gehrig

Second Choices:
DiMaggio
Mays
Walter Johnson
Cy Young
Lefty Grove

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

No question that Ruth and Cobb are or should be in everyone's top 5. Assuming Rose eventually gets in: does he get into the top 5 ahead of, say, an Aaron or Mays? And if not, does he merit a position ahead of the other modern greats such as Schmidt, Jackson, et al?

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Posted By: howard

Pete Rose is not even close to the top five. There were plenty of better players than him even when he was playing, even on his own team. Jackson and Schmidt are among those better than Rose.

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Posted By: Jason L

my God, Howard is exactly right on this one.
he was just a singles hitter, but I suppose if you ever wanted the best player at running to first on a walk, well, then, Rose is your chump

Rose is not Top 75

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Rose could probably be in the top 5 HUSTLE players. He played with all his heart and soul. I'm not saying others didn't but you could call Rose the ultimate over-achiever. He played so much that the longevity factor really makes him stand out because of his hits record. I would in no way berate Roses ability as a player because he played the game the way it was supposed to be played. He's to baseball what Dick Butkus was to football. Look what he did to Ray Fosse in 1971... he just played old style, hard nose, tough as nails, in your face - baseball. How many players can make the claim that they played over 600 games at 4 different positions.

I don't think Rose is a top 5 overall player though...

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Posted By: sean

ty cobb
rogers hornsby
honus wagner
walter johnson
john mcgraw

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Posted By: blackborder

1. Babe Ruth (good grief, the guy was a power hitter who had a lifetime .342 average and almost 100 wins pitching with a .671 winning percentage which was higher than Cy Young, Christy Mathewson, or Walter Johnson!)

2. Walter Johnson (417 wins and had he not played for the dismal Washington teams of the deadball era, he would have probably had 500+ wins)

3. Ty Cobb (not a nice person to be sure but you have to give him his due as probably the greatest competitor baseball has ever known)

4. John McGraw. (not only was he a great manager but also a great player, with a lifetime average of .334. He also changed the game of baseball and brought it into the modern era, both as a player in Baltimore and as a manager in New York.)

5. This is a tough choice, there are a dozen players who could be number 5. I'm going with Micky Mantle. He was one of the greatest players of all time even though he was playing way below 100% most of the time due to injuries. Had he been healthy, he might have been the greatest player of all time.)

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Well, that's exactly why Mantle is not a top 5 HOFer; he wasn't one of the best of all time. While I love the Mick, he had like 4 100 RBI seasons...

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Posted By: Jim

in no particular order....

Ruth
Mantle
Ryan
Mays
Cobb

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Posted By: Glenn

Ruth
Johnson
Cobb
J. Gibson
Williams

(And I'd have to put Clemens ahead of Seaver, Ryan, Carlton, Koufax or B. Gibson... or anybody else since Johnson)

edited to initialize my Gibsons

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Posted By: Dan Koteles

Ruth
Cobb
Matty
Gehrig
SPeaker

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Thank you, Blackborder...

Up there somewhere I have:

Wagner
Cobb
Johnson
Ruth
Mathewson

And I was satisfied with the validity of those 5. But you've dredged up McGraw, and I think he should replace Mathewson in the 5th slot.

So now I'll go with this:::

Wagner
Cobb
Johnson
Ruth
McGraw

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Posted By: George Dreher

Babe Ruth
Ty Cobb
Lou Gehrig
Honus Wagner
Walter Johnson

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Posted By: CN

Willie Mays,Tom Seaver, Nolan Ryan, Gary Carter, Duke Snider, Warren Spahn,Casey Stengel I am still waiting for Mike Piazza and Tom Glavine to get in. Let's Go Mets. CN

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Posted By: John Kalafarski

I was born in 1945 and when I was a kid the standard answer to who was the greatest ballplayer of all time was Ty Cobb. I think most of us are aware of the famous quote by Cobb about what he thought about Ruth (I think at the time of his death). The gist of it was that he was a great guy ("the most unaffected man I ever met") but he didn't approve of the style of play he brought to the game: the game should be played inside the fences with more nuance Cobb felt.
If is one of the favorite words used by fans of all sports. I'd like to come to the Mick's defense here. If Joe D hadn't called him of that flyball and Mick hadn't veered off and run into the sprinkler or drain or whatever it was that didn't belong there, who knows what he would have done. Of course, hanging out with Billy Martin didn't help.
Another if I'd like to bring up are the five lost years of Ted Williams. What would his boxscore look like. Also, how many homers would he have with that short right field in Yankee Stadium to shoot at for half of every season? Or if he was a Tiger (he loved hitting in that field).
Lastly, I'd like to say a few words about Roger Clemens. He is simply not as good as Koufax or Pedro, no matter how many years he can go on winning games. Talent and longevity are two different things. We know from reading about the days of Cy Young that he was not as good as Walter, Matty, or Alex to name three. I would compare Roger and Cy in that they were both blessed with a very long career and were able to accumulate wonderful statistics (like Rose or Aaron?). But does that make them the guy you pick first after you choose up sides in the field of dreams?

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Posted By: Don

"Well, that's exactly why Mantle is not a top 5 HOFer; he wasn't one of the best of all time. While I love the Mick, he had like 4 100 RBI seasons..."

Mantle never had a decent leadoff man batting ahead of him, and he also walked a lot.

Mantle led the league in Runs six times. Mays led the league in Runs twice.

Career Adjusted OPS (pre-steroid era adjustments)
Mantle -- 1000
Mays -- 953

Mays played in the NL which had more hitter-friendly parks.

Mantle had more power, more speed, and more "intangibles" than Willie Mays did.

Mays one advantage was fielding. And Mantle was a very good defensive player.

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Posted By: Don

"Also, how many homers would he have with that short right field in Yankee Stadium to shoot at for half of every season? Or if he was a Tiger (he loved hitting in that field)."

Williams probably would have hit more HRs if he had played in Yankee Stadium or Tiger Stadium more often. But Fenway was awful kind to his batting stats. Ted hit .360 at home compared to .328 on the road. His career OPS was 70 points higher at home than it was on the road.

Ted hit .305 at Yankee Stadium -- that number is probably lowered because he was consistently facing the top pitching staff in the league there. But the point is, he probably wouldn't have won seven batting titles without the Fenway-Factor.

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Posted By: Don

Players

1. Babe Ruth
2. Lou Gehrig
3. Ty Cobb
4. Honus Wagner
5. Stan Musial

Pitchers

1. Walter Johnson
2. Lefty Grove
3. Cy Young
4. Christy Mathewson
5. Grover Alexander

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Posted By: John Kalafarski

Hey Don: Ted was a dead pull hitter and certainly was hurt by the long distance in right field. Your point is well taken about how tough, in general, Yankee pitching was during his career. But if he was a Yankee, he wouldn't have to face them. I think the green background of Fenway and Detroit helped Ted see the ball better. Likewise, Joe D suffered with the long shot to left he faced in Yankee Stadium. Also, Musial has been on record as saying that he was not the hitter Ted was. You sure about Grove? You know he did pitch for the Red Sox.

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Posted By: Don

John -- Musial wasn't the hitter that Williams was. Even taking into consideration the Fenway-Factor, Williams was one of the three-to-five greatest offensive players of all time. But Musial was the better all-around player. He was a better fielder, a better base-runner, and a better teammate. And he could hit a little too.

I have nothing against Red Sox players, but it's hard to deny that Red Sox and Cubs hitters benefited from their home parks.

Bobby Doerr
Home - .315
Road - .256

Jim Rice
Home - .320
Road - .277

Ron Santo
Home - .522 SLUG
Road - .406 SLUG

Ryne Sandberg
Home - 852 OPPS
Road - 738 OPS

And yes I'm aware that Grove pitched for the Red Sox (although his best years were with the Athletics).

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Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

Lefty was one of the all-time greats. Connie Mack's ace starter on all-time great Philadelphia A's teams. Why doesn't he get more respect. Clearly the best lefty starter of all-time. Sandy Koufax and Warren Spahn simply do not compare.

Possessor of one of lowest ERAs of all-time. Wicked fastball and near-perfect control.

Peter