Collectibles Insurance - Stories about claims

[parkplace33]

In the two posts this year about the Memory Lane fiasco and the Dallas Show theft, collectibles insurance and claims were brought up many times. While I have no idea if claims against insurance was used in those two instances, it brought up some questions. Have any board members had to use collectible insurance? If so, how was the process, timeline, etc.?

[hcv123]

CIS was very easy to work with. They asked for copies of the police report, contact information for the detective working the case and comps for what was stolen. A little bit of negotiation and we were agreed on a settlement amount. I don't recall how long the process took, but I am sure it was timely, if it weren't, I likely would remember it. I was definitely satisfied with the process.

[jingram058]

I had mine on our Farmer's Insurance. In the aftermath of hurricane Ian, Farmer's pulled out of Florida. Now we have Citizen's, and I was able to simply transfer over. There was a process, but it was fairly straightforward.

EDIT: I have never had to file a claim; but my collection is insured.

[Peter_Spaeth]

One claim for an almost unheard of occurrence -- a box actually disappeared after being in the mail system. Notified agent, received a check within a week or two, didn't have to wait months to see if it showed up.

[philo98]

I have CIS and although I have not had a claim yet, went with this company after hearing similar stories to Howard's. Also, being a global nomad and at times not coming back to the US for many years at a time, I have my collection stored across safe deposit boxes, safes in a storage unit and other properties and they were able to easily and with zero hassle, draft a policy that covered everything I needed at the locations I wanted.

[rand1com]

CIS is my current insurance company. Been with them for 4 years or so.

No claims so far but I like they way they operate. You can add or subtract from the total coverage during the year if you make a large purchase or sell a pricey item.

I had Chubb before that but the inventory listing/valuation was cumbersome. Not sure if they still use that system or not.

[bandrus1]

CIS is absolutely the most amazing company

[ajjohnsonsoxfan]

I also have CIS. No claims but would also echo that's it super easy to add/modify coverage. You need to schedule/list any cards over $25k, otherwise you can just pay for blanket coverage for a set amount.

[philliesfan]

I also have CIS and had never had reason to file a claim. But for peace of mind, I am glad I went with them.
Bob

[Brent G.]

I got back into collecting last year after a couple decades off, and as I added more pieces, thought it'd be smart to insure it through my homeowner's with State Farm. It was a remarkably low price for peace of mind. I'm in a low crime area with little weather threat, so no doubt that's why it's such a good deal.

[jchcollins]

I'm also with CIS.

I like the schedule the coverage comes with for selling (sending items in the mail, anyway). Rather than springing for costly postal insurance, items up to $200 are generally just covered with regular mail (first class / ground advantage) and then for higher priced items with the USPS you just have to buy $4 signature confirmation to be covered up to $2500.

I have never had to file a claim, knock on wood.

[Exhibitman]

I went with ASIC because it is a lot cheaper than CIS. No claims history to speak of (thankfully) but I am confident of being paid in full if I have a claim (a bonus of being a litigator with lots of experience suing insurers is an unlimited litigation budget).

[Flintboy]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I'm also with CIS.

I like the schedule the coverage comes with for selling (sending items in the mail, anyway). Rather than springing for costly postal insurance, items up to $200 are generally just covered with regular mail (first class / ground advantage) and then for higher priced items with the USPS you just have to buy $4 signature confirmation to be covered up to $2500.

I have never had to file a claim, knock on wood.

Do you have the dealers coverage with them?

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Flintboy

Do you have the dealers coverage with them?

I don’t. But those who are primarily collectors (not dealers) mailing incidental items / occasionally selling things that are no longer desired is covered as well.


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[Snowman]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I don’t. But those who are primarily collectors (not dealers) mailing incidental items / occasionally selling things that are no longer desired is covered as well.


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That's what I was told as well when I purchased my CIS policy, which I had had for a few years until I learned about what's happening with Ash's claim (they're trying as hard as they can to avoid paying out). So then I decided to actually read what's in my policy. It very clearly states that if you have cards for sale anywhere online, you are considered a dealer, and if you try to file a claim under a collectors policy while having cards listed for sale on ebay, then your claim can/will be denied. Perhaps there is some amount of leniency with that if you're just filing a small claim relative to your coverage amounts (say a $2k claim on a $1M policy), but if you're on a collectors plan and you have cards listed for sale and something catastrophic happens that requires you to file a claim for the full amount, then you'll quickly discover that you do not have the coverage you think you have.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Snowman

That's what I was told as well when I purchased my CIS policy, which I had had for a few years until I learned about what's happening with Ash's claim (they're trying as hard as they can to avoid paying out). So then I decided to actually read what's in my policy. It very clearly states that if you have cards for sale anywhere online, you are considered a dealer, and if you try to file a claim under a collectors policy while having cards listed for sale on ebay, then your claim can/will be denied. Perhaps there is some amount of leniency with that if you're just filing a small claim relative to your coverage amounts (say a $2k claim on a $1M policy), but if you're on a collectors plan and you have cards listed for sale and something catastrophic happens that requires you to file a claim for the full amount, then you'll quickly discover that you do not have the coverage you think you have.

That's interesting, because I had a 10 minute conversation with them on the phone this spring to go over these very points, and they said I was covered. Why is the postal / Fed Ex rate schedule attached as part of my policy then, if I want to mail cards - if I'm not covered?

[NYYFan63]

Originally Posted by Snowman

That's what I was told as well when I purchased my CIS policy, which I had had for a few years until I learned about what's happening with Ash's claim (they're trying as hard as they can to avoid paying out). So then I decided to actually read what's in my policy. It very clearly states that if you have cards for sale anywhere online, you are considered a dealer, and if you try to file a claim under a collectors policy while having cards listed for sale on ebay, then your claim can/will be denied. Perhaps there is some amount of leniency with that if you're just filing a small claim relative to your coverage amounts (say a $2k claim on a $1M policy), but if you're on a collectors plan and you have cards listed for sale and something catastrophic happens that requires you to file a claim for the full amount, then you'll quickly discover that you do not have the coverage you think you have.

This is why I have both a collectors and dealers policy.


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[CardPadre]

With a CIS dealer policy, the policy deductible is $500 I believe. So maybe you’d feel mostly protected on shipping a $10k card, but it’s kind of light on the coverage for a $1k card and non-existent protection for a $500 card.

[jchcollins]

So. I thought I had read my entire policy. Turns out, what they send you in the mail is just a summary, and some of the first few pages. The actual policy I found in my email is 20-something pages long.

This would seem to be the most relevant language about the situation I could find in the policy that I apparently have:




So what this says to me is what they told me, if sometimes I "incidentally" sell items from my PC, it should not be counted as "Dealer stock."

I'm not a dealer. I don't have an or S-Corp or sole prop. or anything like that setup. I don't get 1099's from Paypal or eBay to report sales income. I've actually done some research on this over the last few years, and per IRS standards, I would actually most likely fit the "collectibles / hobby" description for what I do when I sell, which unfortunately is the least advantageous category when you report income from this kind of thing. My collecting and selling activity at the moment (something I'm trying to change) is basically a rob-Peter-to-pay-Paul scenario. For example:

John sees a random prewar card he wants (happened the other week). Foolishly probably, just buys it and gets the credit card points, then comes home a week later and to pay for it, I find a Mantle to sell. Am I the only one who (at least sometimes) operates in this broken manner? In any event - I don't maintain dealer stock, and I don't have a group of cards set aside at home that I'm secretly planning to sell for a profit. It just sometimes happens that I need to move something to get out from being underwater on what I just bought.

How would CIS see that scenario? I rarely sell a truly "big" card to me - say north of $1,000. But the last few times I have, I have only paid the USPS for signature confirmation, on the premise that if whatever it is got lost in the mail, I would be covered under my CIS policy. If this is not true, it kinda sucks because postal insurance anymore is pretty expensive.

Ugh. I need to just quit selling cards...


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