New Grading Company - CSG

[Leon]

I just received some news I am not going to make public yet but will say I cannot be more pleased with how the new grading company, by CSG, is going. I think there will be great things in the future from them.Most likely I will have my collection cracked out of their crappy, current TPG cases and into the new company ones. At least I will respect the grading which I don't do currently with at least 2 of the 3 top ones. A grading company that knows how to authenticate and not just be a lemming. And they will use science AND common sense. What a concept. My first cracks could be...

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[maniac_73]

If you are endorsing them Leon and putting those cards on the line that is Huge. Will be interesting to see this play out and I hope they are successful!

[Leon]

Originally Posted by maniac_73

If you are endorsing them Leon and putting those cards on the line that is Huge. Will be interesting to see this play out and I hope they are successful!

Eventually I hope to have my whole collection in their holders. I am tired of seeing known mistakes (especially strip cards) be incorrectly labeled on purpose.

These are such stupid flips they make me angry every time I look at them. For the record, Ray Charles could see these aren't hand cut. NO W575s that aren't trimmed are hand cut.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Leon

I just received some news I am not going to make public yet but will say I cannot be more pleased with how the new grading company, by CSG, is going. I think there will be great things in the future from them.Most likely I will have my collection cracked out of their crappy, current TPG cases and into the new company ones. At least I will respect the grading which I don't do currently with at least 2 of the 3 top ones. A grading company that knows how to authenticate and not just be a lemming. And they will use science AND common sense. What a concept. My first cracks could be...

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So Leon...will you be paying for this service? Or will it be on the house?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

So Leon...will you be paying for this service? Or will it be on the house?

First off that question is quite condescending but I will answer it anyway. I have always paid all fees for all of my grading at any company (as far as I can remember). I don't expect anything free BUT I guess if they offered a discount I would consider it. My guess is that other known collections have gotten discounts on large crack outs before, no?
I have never been given a favor of anything pertaining to grading nor would I want or accept one.

And Actually this incorrectly labeled group of cards will be the first crossed over if I decide to go that route. They are wrongly labeled so why not? ( And the pack they came in. )

and btw Pete, what say ye about this? I guess this is part of their new rules about grading....sort of CYA...

"3. Customer acknowledges and agrees that SGC’s owners and employees shall be permitted to submit items for grading and/or authentication without limitation. Furthermore, SGC’s owners and employees may buy, sell, and trade SGC authenticated or graded items without limitation."
Ref: https://gosgc.com/terms"

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[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Leon

First off that question is quite condescending but I will answer it anyway. I have always paid all fees for all of my grading at any company (as far as I can remember). I don't expect anything free BUT I guess if they offered a discount I would consider it. My guess is that other known collections have gotten discounts on large crack outs before, no?
I have never been given a favor of anything pertaining to grading nor would I want or accept one.

And Actually this incorrectly labeled group of cards will be the first crossed over if I decide to go that route. They are wrongly labeled so why not? ( And the pack they came in. )

and btw Pete, what say ye about this? I guess this is part of their new rules about grading....sort of CYA...

"3. Customer acknowledges and agrees that SGC’s owners and employees shall be permitted to submit items for grading and/or authentication without limitation. Furthermore, SGC’s owners and employees may buy, sell, and trade SGC authenticated or graded items without limitation."
Ref: https://gosgc.com/terms"

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Condescending? certainly wasn't intended to be? As the owner of one of the most prolific prewar sites on the WWW it certainly would benefit a new company to have an endorsement from you? Why not throw you a bone? This may be considered a very smart business move on their part?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Condescending? certainly wasn't intended to be? As the owner of one of the most prolific prewar sites on the WWW it certainly would benefit a new company to have an endorsement from you? Why not throw you a bone? This may be considered a very smart business move on their part?

My apology if my response was too harsh. But yes, I guess it would be good PR for them......I am not 100% my whole collection (kind of small collection but still...) will be crossed as of yet, but I will definitely submit the group of 20 erroneously labeled cards (some shown) as long as their fee and wait times are in line... AND the new company will have to grade them correctly or I won't do it, why would I?

[jchcollins]

So what will set the new company apart - more accuracy in authentication? Better turn times? Can reliably tell the difference between 70/30 centering and 90/10 centering?

Not to be skeptical but just legit curious as to what a new player with scale will do to fix some of the TPG ills we've long complained about on sites like these. Holders that do not allow cards to slosh around inside?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

So what will set the new company apart - more accuracy in authentication? Better turn times? Can reliably tell the difference between 70/30 centering and 90/10 centering?

Not to be skeptical but just legit curious as to what a new player with scale will do to fix some of the TPG ills we've long complained about on sites like these. Holders that do not allow cards to slosh around inside?

Hi John

I think all of these things will be addressed and more. I don't know any specifics whatsoever except for a new hire of theirs. I am sure we will see more in the near future. They are a smart and well funded company. They have a great name in the hobbies they are currently in and I expect the same in ours.

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[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Leon

Hi John

I think all of these things will be addressed and more. I don't know any specifics whatsoever except for a new hire of theirs. I am sure we will see more in the near future. They are a smart and well funded company. They have a great name in the hobbies they are currently in and I expect the same in ours.

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Ah, that was my next question. Congrats! Sorry if I missed that earlier.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Ah, that was my next question. Congrats! Sorry if I missed that earlier.

No, it looks like I hadn't mentioned it. But their team of graders looks to be starting out with a bang. And isn't that the meat of a TPG's company?
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[Throttlesteer]

Just out of curiosity, the E90-1 Young in the PSA holder looks GREAT for a 7. I can see why you want to crack and submit with the new group. But why would you crack the SGC 5? Don't get me wrong, it's an amazing card........but the grade is probably on the generous side of accurate.

I totally understand if the point is putting up some of your favorite cards, regardless of their previous grades.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Leon

No, it looks like I hadn't mentioned it. But their team of graders looks to be starting out with a bang. And isn't that the meat of a TPG's company?
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So what's your new title?

[Jay Wolt]

Originally Posted by Leon

No, it looks like I hadn't mentioned it. But their team of graders looks to be starting out with a bang. And isn't that the meat of a TPG's company?
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Leon who are the new graders?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Throttlesteer

Just out of curiosity, the E90-1 Young in the PSA holder looks GREAT for a 7. I can see why you want to crack and submit with the new group. But why would you crack the SGC 5? Don't get me wrong, it's an amazing card........but the grade is probably on the generous side of accurate.

I totally understand if the point is putting up some of your favorite cards, regardless of their previous grades.

Depending on how the new company looks and performs I will consider my whole collection. I guess the 7 Young is to make that point. As for the SGC 5 I could care less what the number grade is. I know what the card is and love it. It could be a 4 and it would be fine. I tend to pay more for cards I find aesthetically appealing irrespective of their technical grades. I just don't have a ton of respect for the current TPGs with all that has been seen and is going on.

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[luciobar1980]

Not a big fan of the labels, I must say. A label IMO should be as subtle as possible. Those.. are not.

[Exhibitman]

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...ading-division

This was in the news about 2 months ago. It is a division of CCG, which is the big rival to CU.

I hope they do a good job, with good holders and smart people working there. Maybe even people who review research materials and have the stones to grade oh, I dunno, football and boxing Exhibit cards, maybe even Fro-Joy cards. Or, echoing Leon's post, can tell the difference between a hand cut strip card and a factory cut insert card.

[Frank A]

Their label is pretty aggressive. Not sure it won.t take away from the card.

[Exhibitman]

I like it a lot...I can read it.

[Jobu]

I believe that somewhere they said the label would be updated before launch.

[packs]

No opinion on any one company but the only reason I have my cards graded is to maximize sale price. Any new company will need to prove the purchasing power of their product. This is a good time to do it though. Sales are up.

[Throttlesteer]

Is it me, or does the logo look like a copy of SGC?

[Tyruscobb]

Originally Posted by Leon

I just received some news I am not going to make public yet but will say I cannot be more pleased with how the new grading company, by CSG, is going. I think there will be great things in the future from them.Most likely I will have my collection cracked out of their crappy, current TPG cases and into the new company ones. At least I will respect the grading which I don't do currently with at least 2 of the 3 top ones. A grading company that knows how to authenticate and not just be a lemming. And they will use science AND common sense. What a concept. My first cracks could be...

.

Nice cards, Leon. Be careful. The grass is not always greener. It is possible that CSG could find evidence that those cards were altered, and slap them with an A tag. You could be slitting your own throat...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Tyruscobb

Nice cards, Leon. Be careful. The grass is not always greener. It is possible that CSG could find evidence that those cards were altered, and slap them with an A tag. You could be slitting your own throat...

I am confident they are fine.

And for everyone posting in this thread, remember the rule at the top of every page please, concerning names. thanks

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[HRBAKER]

You mean you wouldn't want to know if you had altered cards in numbered holders?

[maniac_73]

Originally Posted by Tyruscobb

Nice cards, Leon. Be careful. The grass is not always greener. It is possible that CSG could find evidence that those cards were altered, and slap them with an A tag. You could be slitting your own throat...

I'm pretty sure Leon would be able to identify if his cards are altered better than any grader lol

[Leon]

Originally Posted by maniac_73

I'm pretty sure Leon would be able to identify if his cards are altered better than any grader lol

Thanks, I am ok but nowhere near the best graders. Not in the same ballpark.
I know a little about a lot of type cards .

**And to answer a few other questions.

I don't want to be the one to say who the new hire is but I am supportive. It will be out soon I am sure.

I have no intention of going to work there. They seem like a good company from what I read.

And yes, I always want to know if my cards are altered.

Was that all?

[glynparson]

Originally Posted by maniac_73

I'm pretty sure Leon would be able to identify if his cards are altered better than any grader lol

I like Leon but this made me laugh out loud.

[jchcollins]

I actually like the flip design, but the pics of the slabs I have seen do not appear to have recessed corners. Assume this is something that will be corrected before go-live?

[sportscardpete]

There is a massive moat built by the current TPG, whether we like to admit that or not. It will take a lot of patience for a new entrant to work. Hopefully they have the pockets to build the business.

[xplainer]

Well, lets see what they bring to the table.
I am a SGC person myself.
However, I am certainly open to a new company.
Obviously, they will have something new and different to offer.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by sportscardpete

There is a massive moat built by the current TPG, whether we like to admit that or not. It will take a lot of patience for a new entrant to work. Hopefully they have the pockets to build the business.

I am sure they will be fine. They are a part of the CGC company which is huge in other hobbies. With a built in reputation their growth would be faster than a start-up from scratch.

CGC grades comics,
but has the following:
NGC - Coins
PMG - Paper money
ASG - Stamps

The only issue that I can think of is that they also have CCS which is a comic book restoration company. Some may believe that if they are willing to clean up comics then grade them they could be willing to do the same for sports cards. I would hope they would know the hobby enough to understand that isn't accepted in this hobby, but it could be hard for others to trust a company that does it in another hobby.

[Stampsfan]

Question for Leon. Their promotional video flagged on the other thread says they are only grading Pokémon and Magic cards, yet you’re sending in your vintage.
Are they currently grading vintage and other cards?

[Rich Klein]

I'm going to say based on this comment by Leon they have hired at least one sports person (if not more)

"I don't want to be the one to say who the new hire is but I am supportive. It will be out soon I am sure."

Regards
Rich

[BRoberts]

Originally Posted by Leon

These are such stupid flips they make me angry every time I look at them. For the record, Ray Charles could see these aren't hand cut. NO W575s that aren't trimmed are hand cut.

Why not just remove the cards from the holders?

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by BRoberts

Why not just remove the cards from the holders?

Exactly. No 3rd Party validation is needed. Unless you plan to sell them (still not needed, but for the Sheeple)

[HRBAKER]

Originally Posted by Leon

Thanks, I am ok but nowhere near the best graders. Not in the same ballpark.
I know a little about a lot of type cards .

**And to answer a few other questions.

I don't want to be the one to say who the new hire is but I am supportive. It will be out soon I am sure.

I have no intention of going to work there. They seem like a good company from what I read.

And yes, I always want to know if my cards are altered.

Was that all?

I assumed you would. My question was directed @ those who offered caution, it infers they would not.

Jeff

[sportscardpete]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

I'm going to say based on this comment by Leon they have hired at least one sports person (if not more)

"I don't want to be the one to say who the new hire is but I am supportive. It will be out soon I am sure."

Regards
Rich

They will need to hire a bunch. It is going to have to be a positive feedback loop - you need capacity to grade, which will put more of their cards out on the market, which is free advertising, which will make them money, for them to hire more folks to grade even more cards.

If you are going to make yourself a player in the market you have to have huge investment into this business. You can’t really start with a few or some marquee graders and expect them to lead the way. That’s why I’m really hesitant about new grading companies, UNLESS they are more technologically advanced (remains to be seen).

Those flips are uglier than sin. Just my opinion -Dan Hicks

[mrvster]

I will own one someday.....

general grading,

specializing in vintage freaks

I already have cherry picked a team

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by Stampsfan

Question for Leon. Their promotional video flagged on the other thread says they are only grading Pokémon and Magic cards, yet you’re sending in your vintage.
Are they currently grading vintage and other cards?

That video is for their CGC grading that was doing comics but will now include TCG.

CSG is going to be their spin off that will grade sports cards:
https://www.cgccomics.com/news/artic...-card-experts/

[bswhiten]

Since I like to have my slabs in binders with 4 pocket pages, the slab size alone kills it for me. Why so tall?
Hopefully the design gets more thought. The PSA and SGC proportions and labels are much better imo.

[whitehse]

And people complained about the new SGC flips.... Not a fan of this one to be sure.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Their gaming card flips turned out OK, and don't seem to be crazily over-sized.

[Tyruscobb]

Although competition generally benefits consumers (e.g. lower prices, better service, etc.), I’m skeptical that any new third-party grader will help solve the hobby’s biggest problem - altered cards receiving numerical grades and over-grading.

The reason is the vintage fee structure. Most TPGs do not have a flat fee. Instead, the fee varies depending on the card’s value. This creates a subconscious financial incentive (and, unfortunately, probably a conscious one for some TPGs) to over-grade. Over-grading increases the card’s price, which, in turn, increases the fee. An increased fee increases the company’s profitability, which, in turn, may increase the grader’s pay. The current vintage fee structure has too many interest conflicts that have created the current problems.

Removing the financial incentive to over-grading is what needs to happen to fix the problem. TPGs should charge a flat fee to grade a 1956 Mantle. The fee should not vary depending on whether the card comes back a Poor 1 or gem 10. So, unless any new grader uses a flat vintage fee, the problem will continue.

A new TPG will make the existing TPGs improve their services and fees, as well as reduce turnaround times. However, any new TPG that uses the same vintage fee is equivalent to putting a bandage on a bullet wound - it will not cure the underlying problem. It may temporarily improve the situation, but eventually even a new TPG’s actual graders will fall victim to the above-referenced dilemma - increasing the company’s bottom line.

I’ll pump the brakes on my excitement until I see the vintage fee schedule for any new TPG. * This post does not mention any specific TPGs, and presents general issues. *

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by mrvster

I will own one someday.....

general grading,

specializing in vintage freaks

I already have cherry picked a team

When you do I would like to get one of your early test slabs to add to my oddball slab collection.

Would also like to get one of the very early slabs from this new company when they start grading baseball cards. One of their test slabs would be amazing.

[UKCardGuy]

Good news. As CSG have offices in London, I'm hoping that they'll offer grading locally.

The hassle with shipping to the US and worrying about customs charges is too much for overseas collectors.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

Those flips are uglier than sin. Just my opinion -Dan Hicks

After seeing that sample, I agree.

Apparently they're not into test marketing. If they get off the ground, all you can do is hope they don't quickly realize the packaging (flips) are not what consumers would like and then change them.

Not sure how a company that is into grading is going to crack the code and survive in this PSA dominated market. They could get a foot hold in pre-war but the $$/volume seems to be in newer cards.

I remember when GAI started out, they seemed good, then all the altered cards started getting slabbed.

Best of luck to a new TPG venture because the hobby needs something it can trust.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Fred

After seeing that sample, I agree.

Apparently they're not into test marketing. If they get off the ground, all you can do is hope they don't quickly realize the packaging (flips) are not what consumers would like and then change them.

Not sure how a company that is into grading is going to crack the code and survive in this PSA dominated market. They could get a foot hold in pre-war but the $$/volume seems to be in newer cards.

I remember when GAI started out, they seemed good, then all the altered cards started getting slabbed.

Best of luck to a new TPG venture because the hobby needs something it can trust.

Regarding the part in bold.... It will be difficult, but is much needed for the integrity of the hobby. All three of the current TPGs are corrupt in their own ways.

If the FBI ever decides to come down on PSA for the thousands of "mistakes" they've made, the window of opportunity could open up a bit more for this new venture. Hopefully that will be the case, although they will still need to tone down that garish flip.

[T205 GB]

This is awesome news! What an original concept.