Could be the first 1955 Mascot Dog Food Cards of Mantle and Berra. Any Info?

[chuckw]

Can anyone help provide information on the 1955 Mascot Dog Food Cards? I was lucky to pick up the Mickey Mantle and Yogi Berra from this set and from what I have found out, these may be the first of these two cards to ever be found/seen. In fact, I have not been able to find any cards from this set come up for sale. The big vintage price guide has a photo of a Robin Roberts card with information that there appear to be 8 cards in the set from the back of the card but there is no price list. The back of the Berra is the same as the Roberts in the price guide, but the back of the Mantle references 11 cards. It really seems like I may have the only known cards of Mantle and Berra to be found. Any information on this set and the rarity of these cards would be much appreciated!!!

[Neal]

wow, those are nice!
Never seen those before

[chuckw]

it seems like the grading companies haven't seen the Mantle or Berra before either - in fact I'm not sure any have been graded. It really seems like the Robin Roberts was the only other card from this set that was known because it was shown in the big vintage guides. Maybe anyone who got one of the cards mailed it in for the deal described on the back (an autographed 8x10, member card, pin, and full postcard set). If they would have fulfilled that offer, you'd think we'd see some of those items periodically, so maybe the dog food company didn't last long. Very cool to think that it could be the rarest Mantle card out there! ... and Yogi too. I figured this would be the place to ask for help with any information on this set or these cards (thanks in advance!).

[quitcrab]

Very cool... Never seen that before and I have been playing with baseball cards for 46 years !

[stlcardsfan]

Could be an incredible find, Chuck! Care to share the story behind these cards?

[chuckw]

I got the cards recently from an antique dealer friend in Pennsylvania. Another antique dealer purchased them in an estate - the cards were stored in an album of antique photographs for 50+ years (it looked like the album/cards were never touched in years). The back of the cards indicate that Mascot Dog Food was out of Philadelphia, not far from where the cards were found. Makes sense to see a Philadelphia Phillies player as the only known example. It would be great to find out more information about how long Mascot Dog Food was in business. Do you think these are so rare because anyone who had them would have sent them in for the great redemption package they offered or because the dog food company may have gone under? Maybe both, and maybe they were limited to begin with. In my research I have not found any cards other than the Roberts in the price guide and I have not found any of those other redemption items. Somewhere there must be information. I did find a couple web blogs where collectors indicated that it is a regional set they'd love to find, so some collectors must know about them. I never thought I would stumble upon a one of a kind Mantle card from the 1950s!

[Stonepony]

Great find! You need to get it authenticated as there are so many questions.

[GasHouseGang]

Originally Posted by chuckw

I got the cards recently from an antique dealer friend in Pennsylvania. Another antique dealer purchased them in an estate - the cards were stored in an album of antique photographs for 50+ years (it looked like the album/cards were never touched in years). The back of the cards indicate that Mascot Dog Food was out of Philadelphia, not far from where the cards were found. Makes sense to see a Philadelphia Phillies player as the only known example. It would be great to find out more information about how long Mascot Dog Food was in business. Do you think these are so rare because anyone who had them would have sent them in for the great redemption package they offered or because the dog food company may have gone under? Maybe both, and maybe they were limited to begin with. In my research I have not found any cards other than the Roberts in the price guide and I have not found any of those other redemption items. Somewhere there must be information. I did find a couple web blogs where collectors indicated that it is a regional set they'd love to find, so some collectors must know about them. I never thought I would stumble upon a one of a kind Mantle card from the 1950s!

The redemption doesn't say you have to mail in the card. It just says to mail in 25 cents and a label from the dog food to receive the various items. Regardless, you've found two very rare cards that don't appear to be cataloged.

[kvnkvnkvn]

I collect 1990 Fleer so don't listen to me, but you might be on to something here...Great cards buddy...

[chuckw]

Looks like Mascot Dog Food and Mascot Pet Supply were out of East Orange, NJ. I was able to find an old Mascot Dog Food can label! Makes sense that the three cards that were found so far are Phillies (Roberts in the price guide) and Yankees (my Mantle and Berra), as those teams are near East Orange. Since there are no other examples known (so far) I'm guessing the other cards in the set could include Ashburn, Ford, ... and maybe some Dodgers (since the cards are likely from 1954-1955 and they left Brooklyn after 1957). I really find it interesting that the Roberts and Berra indicate a redemption program that includes 8 cards, and the Mantle indicates 11 cards - so I wonder if they may be from 2 different years.

[stlcardsfan]

I can't believe no one on this board (so far) has even heard of this issue.

[sflayank]

ive heard of the issue
its listed
i know who has the robin roberts

[glynparson]

I was lucky enough to see these in person at Chuck's shop yesterday and I can say they are really freaking cool. I don't get excited about cards very often anymore but these are exciting cards.

[swarmee]

Great cards, but what is going on with the Mantle facsimile signature?

[AustinMike]

Great find! Very cool to see.

[glynparson]

Swarmee I am not an autograph guy, but I know Mantle's early signature is vastly different than his later signature. I believe this is a facsimile of his early autograph before it got fancy.

[whiteymet]

Cool! Always great to see stuff you have never seen before. In my case in over 50 years.

Fred

[whiteymet]

Just read the Standard Catalog description. It says the cards are glossy. Chuck's do not look glossy.

Is it me?

Chuck, glossy or not?

Please advise.

Thanks

Fred

[Bestdj777]

It looks glossy to me but hard to tell from the picture.

[HRBAKER]

Looks to be a great find!
Congrats, neat stuff!

[chuckw]

I wouldn't call them really glossy. I'm trying to get in touch with the person who owns the Roberts to compare notes. I will let provide an update if I get more information. Thanks to everyone who has provided information and has reached out. Because the backs are a little different (redemption information), I guess they could be from 2 different years or series.

[Volod]

Originally Posted by chuckw

I got the cards recently from an antique dealer friend in Pennsylvania. Another antique dealer purchased them in an estate - the cards were stored in an album of antique photographs for 50+ years (it looked like the album/cards were never touched in years). The back of the cards indicate that Mascot Dog Food was out of Philadelphia, not far from where the cards were found. Makes sense to see a Philadelphia Phillies player as the only known example. It would be great to find out more information about how long Mascot Dog Food was in business. Do you think these are so rare because anyone who had them would have sent them in for the great redemption package they offered or because the dog food company may have gone under? Maybe both, and maybe they were limited to begin with. In my research I have not found any cards other than the Roberts in the price guide and I have not found any of those other redemption items. Somewhere there must be information. I did find a couple web blogs where collectors indicated that it is a regional set they'd love to find, so some collectors must know about them. I never thought I would stumble upon a one of a kind Mantle card from the 1950s!

My question is - are these actual cardstock, or are they, as the promo blurb states, "printed on the label." If the "cards" are simply printed on can labels, it's more understandable that collectors would send them in for redemption and thus render them scarcer over time. But, the images of the cards you posted look like usual cardstock, so I'm curious. The puzzle of the number of cards in the issue: 8 vs 11, reminds me of the 1951 Topps Current All-Star set, with three cards with Philadelphia connections withdrawn from publication due to contractual concerns. I wonder if perhaps Mascot had poor sales, leading to early cancellation of the promotion, however, reading the label ingredients, the stuff sounds a lot more nutritious, if not tastier, than some of the MRE stuff I gagged on in the service.

[quitcrab]

What are the difference in the redemption info. On the backs? Your saying your Mantle and Berra are different from the Roberts or is your Mantle different from your Berra ? These are really interesting !

[glynparson]

The berra has the same offer as the roberts the mantle has an offer for 11. they are on a normal card stock, they are not glossy per se but they aren't dull either. They are not on the labels. These are pretty cool and Chuck may have hit the lotto. One of the first "new" things I have seen in years that i could genuinely say was cool.

[Volod]

Originally Posted by glynparson

The berra has the same offer as the roberts the mantle has an offer for 11. they are on a normal card stock, they are not glossy per se but they aren't dull either. They are not on the labels. These are pretty cool and Chuck may have hit the lotto. One of the first "new" things I have seen in years that i could genuinely say was cool.

Thanks for that info, Glyn. I agree that it is a great find. But, I'm still wondering - what does "printed on the labels" refer to then, if the cards are all on cardstock?

[glynparson]

From what I have been told they (any known copies)are on card stock as is the roberts from the catalog, according to my source. The individual i immediately sent photos too stated he believes they are authentic. this individual is in my opinion the most knowledgable individual on odd vintage sports cards in the world. I trust his opinion absolutely, as would most who know him. To be honest when i first saw pics my gut said no good but i wasn't positive. my friend has me convinced the other way now and after having seen them i believe they are vintage as well.

[darkhorse9]

Originally Posted by Volod

Thanks for that info, Glyn. I agree that it is a great find. But, I'm still wondering - what does "printed on the labels" refer to then, if the cards are all on cardstock?

It means you get the cards of the stars that are listed on the label. Apparently the checklist was written there so you know who was included.

[bswhiten]

If PSA will grade these you hit a major jackpot if you are looking to sell. Sweet pieces. Congrats!!!

[Volod]

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

It means you get the cards of the stars that are listed on the label. Apparently the checklist was written there so you know who was included.

Yeah, I guess you're right. I was thrown off by the label image that ChuckW posted, thinking it was from the redemption deal, but it was apparently from a non-redemption can. Plus, the ungrammatical wording "photos of stars printed on label."

[sflayank]

Confirmed owner of roberts also has a mantle
Needs berra

[chuckw]

PSA told me they would only grade the cards if they had a checklist for the set and they don't have a checklist. I've never heard that before - anyone else? I thought they'd love to have their name on rare cards like this and would do a little research if it's something they've never seen.

I've talked to many vintage, Mantle, and regional collectors and there is very little known about this set and these cards. I will keep everyone posted as I find out more. I also appreciate the many generous offers for the cards (especially the Mantle), but if I sell them it will be via auction. Right now, I'm just focused on finding out more information regarding the cards (a checklist would be great but that may be very unlikely). Thanks again everyone!

By the way - the Mascot Dog Food Label that I posted was just from a label I found doing an internet search - it was not from the year of these cards.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by chuckw

PSA told me they would only grade the cards if they had a checklist for the set and they don't have a checklist. I've never heard that before - anyone else? I thought they'd love to have their name on rare cards like this and would do a little research if it's something they've never seen.

I've talked to many vintage, Mantle, and regional collectors and there is very little known about this set and these cards. I will keep everyone posted as I find out more. I also appreciate the many generous offers for the cards (especially the Mantle), but if I sell them it will be via auction. Right now, I'm just focused on finding out more information regarding the cards (a checklist would be great but that may be very unlikely). Thanks again everyone!

By the way - the Mascot Dog Food Label that I posted was just from a label I found doing an internet search - it was not from the year of these cards.

One would think that any TPG could look at the previous cards, compare, and grade these. I understand they want to be careful but if they can hold one of these in their hands, with all of their equipment they have and not be able to tell if it is real or not, then I am not sure what to say. Pathetic?

[stlcardsfan]

I would also check with SGC and Beckett.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by Leon

One would think that any TPG could look at the previous cards, compare, and grade these. I understand they want to be careful but if they can hold one of these in their hands, with all of their equipment they have and not be able to tell if it is real or not, then I am not sure what to say. Pathetic?

They are finicky about grading new items for some reason. I have one card that is catalogued (it's a multi sport set) in a legitimate hockey card guide and they refuse. The kicker is that the photo of my exact Mantle card was even used as the illustration in the book. It's frustrating to say the least, especially when it makes such a substantial difference in the price of the item to the general market.

[Rich Klein]

Back in the day when I was at Beckett, there would be cards that PSA would not grade until Beckett listed them. It had to do with information paucity.

Personally, I would contact Joe at PSA (or whomever you are comfortable with) and send a link of this thread so they have a ton of relevant information.

Believe it or not, most of the people involved in the hobby in positions such as that do not read and memorize every single thread on Net 54

Rich

[chuckw]

Beckett's vintage graders were able to do research, grade the cards, and add the cards and brand to their catalogue and database!! Also, there is a lot of speculation that these cards were made in 1951 or 1952 (Beckett labeled the cards as "1950s Mascot Dog Food" cards). Check out the Yogi Berra card - it is the photo that was used to create the 1950 Bowman Yogi Berra card! Thanks Beckett!

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by chuckw

Beckett's vintage graders were able to do research, grade the cards, and add the cards and brand to their catalogue and database!! Also, there is a lot of speculation that these cards were made in 1951 or 1952 (Beckett labeled the cards as "1950s Mascot Dog Food" cards). Check out the Yogi Berra card - it is the photo that was used to create the 1950 Bowman Yogi Berra card! Thanks Beckett!

Now that you got Beckett to slab them are you going to try to cross them over to PSA?

[swarmee]

Great update. Congrats on getting them authenticated by Beckett.

[chuckw]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Now that you got Beckett to slab them are you going to try to cross them over to PSA?

I don't think I will cross them over. I'm happy that they are slabbed and since I appreciate that Beckett did work to research and catalogue them, they deserve to be in Beckett holders for a while! I'm also pleasantly surprised to hear that they may be from 1951 or 1952, which would really make the Mantle even more amazing. A first to the market Mantle card from his Rookie era!

A lot of people have been making very nice offers, which are sincerely appreciated, but if anything, the two cards would go to auction. I will keep everyone posted.

[bswhiten]

The Mantle image looks like the same one used on the 51 Wheaties premium... I believe I read the image was taken from the 52 world series, but someone else may know more about that.

[chuckw]

Originally Posted by bswhiten

The Mantle image looks like the same one used on the 51 Wheaties premium... I believe I read the image was taken from the 52 world series, but someone else may know more about that.

Good catch Ben - the Mantle is the same pose as the 1951 Wheaties Premium. It looks like the Mascot Dog food card is the original photo, and they added pinstripes to his jersey for the Wheaties premium card (old school Photoshop work! ... hand drawn back then). So the 2 Mascot Dog Food cards that I have were the original photos used to make the 1950 Bowman Yogi Berra and the 1951 Wheaties Premium cards. This helps direct me to think what I heard from Beckett - that they believe the Mascot cards are most likely from 1951 or 1952. Has anyone seen the Mascot image of Robin Roberts used in another card from the early 1950s? The Roberts card was the image I showed from the think vintage catalogue from SCD.
Thanks Ben.

[paul]

The same Roberts photo also appears on the 1950s Macgregor Advisory Staff Photo of Roberts. Unfortunately, to my knowledge, it is impossible to pinpoint the date of Advisory Staff Photos.

[sflayank]

1955 is correct for the robin roberts

[MattyC]

Let’s get these bad boys on the auction block; my bidding finger is ready!

[stlcardsfan]

I think that is disappointing that Beckett stabbed them as "1950's" as opposed to a specific year. Theses companies are so called experts. Come on Beckett do some research! Chuck, it sounds like you did much more work than they did. Weak effort by Beckett in my opinion.

[AustinMike]

Congratulations on getting the card slabbed.

Kudos to Beckett for slabbing it.

But more importantly, a big round of applause to Beckett for labeling it "1950s."

As mentioned earlier, the photo used on the card was taken during the 1952 World Series, on October 6, 1952. I've attached the photo and the back of the photo. So the card cannot be from 1951 and it is extremely unlikely that it is from 1952. It is most likely from 1953 or later. Whoever labeled the Mantle Wheaties issue with a 1951 issuance date has done collectors a huge disservice. And I definitely applaud Beckett for not going down that rabbit hole.

As far as saying Beckett should do some research and criticizing them for their "weak effort," how much research and effort did they put in to this card? I don't know, so I can't criticize them. I'm just happy they didn't follow PSA's lackluster performance and call this a 1951 issue thereby perpetuating and enforcing a definite error. I do agree it would be nice to have a definitive year for this card. But that would probably take many, many hours of effort and a definitive year may still not be found. And they would get paid how much for all that time? Whatever they charged to slab the card. And in the meantime, they hold on to the card to wait to slab it until they can find a definitive issuance year?

[Leon]

It is sort of funny that the original poster (hi Chuck) came to me about putting this thread with the rare cards on the front page. I believe I said let's try it in the correct spot first (the post war forum) and see if it gets attention. I think it has garnered enough attention to be brought back to the front page. This is a very cool and interesting story to me. Congrats to Chuck on some great cards...

[CW]

From one Chuck W to another, congrats!

[Bored5000]

I love the obscure and impossible to find, so this thread has been fascinating to read. With how hot Mantle cards have been the last few years, it seems the sky would be the limit for that card in an auction like REA.

[T205 GB]

Originally Posted by glynparson

Swarmee I am not an autograph guy, but I know Mantle's early signature is vastly different than his later signature. I believe this is a facsimile of his early autograph before it got fancy.

You are 100% correct about that. I have had several from his time with the KC Blues. Auto's are identical. So is the Berra auto.