51 Bowman Mantle Crossover or Bump Help

[investinrookies]

Looking for some thoughts on this particular card and it’s chances for a cross over to PSA or bump at SGC. Originally I was just going to have it reholdered at SGC upon purchasing the card. Once I received the card it appears much nicer and worthy of a bump or crossover so now reconsidering what may be the best option. Do I stand a chance with either or is it just a waste of money with a card of this caliber? The corners and edges are what really stands out to me for being better than the grade with 3 out of 4 being very good.

Thanks in advance for your suggestions.







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[JollyElm]

Don't have a true opinion on crossing it over, but you'd have to research PSA's view on how much 'out-of-registration' (magenta plate?) would affect the grading of this Mantle. But, man, that's a sweet card!!

[lowpopper]

Reholder with SGC then send to PSA to cross. Bingo

!

[investinrookies]

Originally Posted by lowpopper

Reholder with SGC then send to PSA to cross. Bingo

!

Very intriguing thought, that does seem like a good option. Assuming you have had some luck doing it that way? Worst case scenario I get the new SGC holder which is a vast improvement over the current holder.

[AGuinness]

That’s a sweet card, congrats.
Would the purpose of the crossover be for registry, value increase, slab preference or other?


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[investinrookies]

Originally Posted by AGuinness

That’s a sweet card, congrats.
Would the purpose of the crossover be for registry, value increase, slab preference or other?


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Thanks, I’m really happy with the card. I like the look of the new SGC holders and this card would look sweet in the new case with the black flip. That being said, Ive been second guessing myself not attempting to cross it over to PSA for a value increase especially if it went over to a 6, but not sure thats possible without cracking out.

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by investinrookies

Thanks, I’m really happy with the card. I like the look of the new SGC holders and this card would look sweet in the new case with the black flip. That being said, Ive been second guessing myself not attempting to cross it over to PSA for a value increase especially if it went over to a 6, but not sure thats possible without cracking out.

If you are inclined to sell it sometime, I think crossing to PSA could make sense (assuming the TPG hierarchy remains the same), although I’m not up to speed on the fees for a card like this. If you will keep it in your PC and won’t plan on selling it, I think the new SGC flip is the way to go. Reholdering is pretty inexpensive, at least.


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[AustinMike]

If you really want "bump help", send it to PWCC. With Moser's help they can probably "conserve" it to an 8 or 9.

[jchcollins]

SGC is by far my TPG of choice, so if I were keeping it in my collection I would just re-holder. If you are looking to flip it and maximize profit, then unfortunately I would have to concur that PSA is still the best choice. As shady and underhanded as I believe them to be, their bubble has not burst yet.

Gorgeous card, good luck either way. As mentioned earlier - I can see where it has the slightest of registration problems, but it is very minor and does not affect eye appeal much. You see that so bad on some cards where the player has two sets of eyes, lol.

[KCRfan1]

If you are keeping the card for your PC, why even mess with sending the card in the mail and having someone else crack the card for you just to get a shining new holder?

Things can get lost or damaged in the mail, cards can get dinged during the reholder process and all of us can go on about bad things that can happen to a card out of our possession.

It's not my very expensive card, but I would leave it alone and just enjoy it.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

Things can get lost or damaged in the mail, cards can get dinged during the reholder process and all of us can go on about bad things that can happen to a card out of our possession.

I can understand the desire to get a card like that in the newest version of the slab. If it's worth it to him to properly insure, there should be no problems. I absolutely hate sending cards that I'm keeping for my PC off to be graded, though. Always feels like a family member is missing while they're gone...

[Smanzari]

Nice card!

IIRC, the new SGC owners are Re-Grading everything sent for reholder (due to new ownership)

If you are trying to crossover, may want to just send directly to PSA instead of going through twice...

[samosa4u]

What a beautiful card.

Have you ever seen the ones with very white borders? Yikes! A lot of them have been given chemical baths and yours is not one of them. Yours has off-white borders and this is the way it should be. It also doesn't suffer from print lines or bleeding. I do see a very faint wax stain on the reverse, but it's not as bad as the others I've seen. And finally, the centering looks great as well.

Just one question: do you have other cards from this set? Have you tried measuring this Mantle with one eye closed? Is it the correct size? Did you compare it to the others?

I wouldn't mail it out, but if you are ever in California, then why don't you just take it to the PSA building? I have a friend who does that with his expensive cards.

[investinrookies]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

What a beautiful card.

Have you ever seen the ones with very white borders? Yikes! A lot of them have been given chemical baths and yours is not one of them. Yours has off-white borders and this is the way it should be. It also doesn't suffer from print lines or bleeding. I do see a very faint wax stain on the reverse, but it's not as bad as the others I've seen. And finally, the centering looks great as well.

Just one question: do you have other cards from this set? Have you tried measuring this Mantle with one eye closed? Is it the correct size? Did you compare it to the others?

I wouldn't mail it out, but if you are ever in California, then why don't you just take it to the PSA building? I have a friend who does that with his expensive cards.

You listed several reasons why I bought the card, it has a natural look to it, appears full size and the centering isn’t bad for the issue. I noticed the little bit of the registration being slightly off but 90% of them are and it doesn’t hurt the eye appeal much. I think the best bet is just to reholder it with SGC and enjoy it!

[Johnny630]

Keep SGC just reholder.

Beautiful Card Bud

[investinrookies]

Mailed the card off to SGC for reholdering without review. Just having this card in the new holder will present much better. I dont plan on flipping the card so likely will just leave it in the new SGC 6 case. Will post an updated pic once it returns from SGC. Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by investinrookies

Mailed the card off to SGC for reholdering without review. Just having this card in the new holder will present much better. I dont plan on flipping the card so likely will just leave it in the new SGC 6 case. Will post an updated pic once it returns from SGC. Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

That’s exactly what I would do. Good Job :-) enjoy your beautiful Card.

[investinrookies]

Fresh back from SGC, looks very nice in the new holder. That being said it still appears very worthy of a bump with the corners being so nice.




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[AGuinness]

That’s a gorgeous card and it’s looks great in the new holder. Congrats and enjoy!


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[ALBB]

I think that little bump when you crossed over..really did you right...

[investinrookies]

Originally Posted by ALBB

I think that little bump when you crossed over..really did you right...

Was a SGC 6 already just Reholdered it?

[jchcollins]

A 6 for a 68 year old card is what my mother would describe as a "mighty fine" grade. Let alone on a card bearing the significance of that one. Leave it alone and enjoy the heck out of it...

[murphy8276]

Originally Posted by Smanzari

Nice card!

IIRC, the new SGC owners are Re-Grading everything sent for reholder (due to new ownership)

If you are trying to crossover, may want to just send directly to PSA instead of going through twice...

Wow, what a sad rule by SGC.

I bet they haven't been contacting people that their card bumped higher for free during re-holder... So you have a chance to get holdered at equal grade or lower only during a re-holder. Do they call you first before ruining your card?

This is what a "sports card guarantee" is nowadays? Charging the submitter for the cost of their new ownership.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by murphy8276

Wow, what a sad rule by SGC.

I bet they haven't been contacting people that their card bumped higher for free during re-holder... So you have a chance to get holdered at equal grade or lower only during a re-holder. Do they call you first before ruining your card?

This is what a "sports card guarantee" is nowadays? Charging the submitter for the cost of their new ownership.

Can this be verified somewhere? I've heard absolutely nothing about a re-holder at SGC being anything other than just that. And have seen no complaints about reholders being downgraded en masse on this forum or any other.

[IgnatiusJReilly]

Originally Posted by investinrookies

Fresh back from SGC, looks very nice in the new holder. That being said it still appears very worthy of a bump with the corners being so nice.




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Geez that looks amazing! Great card! I would agree with most here that you should keep it in the SGC holder if it’s a PC card. If you’re planning to sell in the next 2-3 years, then a crossover might be a good move. Your card has great eye appeal so it should get a strong buy regardless of holder. What’s the difference in realized prices for an SGC 6 vs a PSA 6 for this big boy?


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[GasHouseGang]

PSA 6 is $16,959 and SGC 6 is $13,250 on the website that tracks auction/sales prices.

[murphy8276]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Can this be verified somewhere? I've heard absolutely nothing about a re-holder at SGC being anything other than just that. And have seen no complaints about reholders being downgraded en masse on this forum or any other.

#18 in their terms was adjusted to include lingo that will cover their previous ownership's over-grading. There are several threads across the forums where people went through this. SGC regraded without even telling them and when they were questioned they said they do not guarantee their previous ownerships grading. It is assumed that SGC over-graded some things in the past, but the new SGC will never contact someone to tell them they were auto-upgraded. lol!

18. In the event SGC, in SGC’s sole and absolute opinion, determines that an item within an SGC holder is fraudulent, tampered with, or is not accurately described, then SGC is authorized, without further notice to Customer, to remove the item from the holder. In addition, if an item has been previously graded by SGC and placed in a holder, and such item is subsequently damaged due to Customer’s lack of care, then SGC reserves the right to remove the item from its holder, and is under no obligation to re-grade such an item.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by murphy8276

18. In the event SGC, in SGC’s sole and absolute opinion, determines that an item within an SGC holder is fraudulent, tampered with, or is not accurately described, then SGC is authorized, without further notice to Customer, to remove the item from the holder. In addition, if an item has been previously graded by SGC and placed in a holder, and such item is subsequently damaged due to Customer’s lack of care, then SGC reserves the right to remove the item from its holder, and is under no obligation to re-grade such an item.

I guess it depends on how much detail you want to read into their 18-B. What does "not accurately described" really mean? Is that with respect to the grade, or is it more along the lines of if they put a 1962 Clemente in a slab that says 1963?

Agree with you that the escape clause seems to be there if they want to re-grade. Regardless, I have not heard an infusion of complaints about this in the past year or so.

[murphy8276]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I guess it depends on how much detail you want to read into their 18-B. What does "not accurately described" really mean? Is that with respect to the grade, or is it more along the lines of if they put a 1962 Clemente in a slab that says 1963?

Agree with you that the escape clause seems to be there if they want to re-grade. Regardless, I have not heard an infusion of complaints about this in the past year or so.

I do not think they have been rampantly doing it, but there have been a few threads about it and the warning should be out there. I will see if I can find one if they included any searchable key words. I remember an original poster stating that the owners told them, "we didn't grade this the last time so we had to re-assess it to see if it met our standards". That would be the equivalent of PSA saying, "one of our old graders got a new job, and now we force a review of anything he graded".

I find it interesting that somehow they do not guarantee the previous grade's accuracy, yet it is in their name. I guess that is why they spelled it wrong in the name-- "Guaranty" .

[Peter_Spaeth]

Months after they removed it, I still don't see any guarantee on the website. Am I missing it? I was told when I inquired (months ago) that they were just reviewing the language in light of recent events and that it would be back up shortly, but I don't think it's happened.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by investinrookies

Very intriguing thought, that does seem like a good option. Assuming you have had some luck doing it that way? Worst case scenario I get the new SGC holder which is a vast improvement over the current holder.

How about you just leave it and enjoy it. This is what is wrong with the hobby, poor perception.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

How about you just leave it and enjoy it. This is what is wrong with the hobby, poor perception.

Or sell it.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1951-Bowman...EAAOSw1pBdlQBD

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by investinrookies

Thanks, I’m really happy with the card. I like the look of the new SGC holders and this card would look sweet in the new case with the black flip.

Originally Posted by investinrookies

I think the best bet is just to reholder it with SGC and enjoy it!

Originally Posted by investinrookies

I dont plan on flipping the card so likely will just leave it in the new SGC 6 case.