Trimmed Green Cobb at National

[Snapolit1]

Rumor has it that a green Cobb previously returned to seller as trimmed suddenly reappeared at National with another seller and was dumped on a new unsuspecting rube.
Just reporting the rumor on the street. Not that there are any bad people there or anything.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Rumor has it that a green Cobb previously returned to seller as trimmed suddenly reappeared at National with another seller and was dumped on a new unsuspecting rube.
Just reporting the rumor on the street. Not that there are any bad people there or anything.

Any names or what green Cobb?

I heard there is a guy there that sells counterfeit cards with forged autographs on them.

[wondo]

Bizarre post - just sayin’.

[jason.1969]

Correct. Was an authentic. Went through Moser. Became a PSA/PWCC 2. Returned by buyer to Red Zone (where he purchased it) as doctored/"conserved." And now back in the wild on the National floor at Heartland as a PSA 2 like nothing ever happened.

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[Mark17]

Originally Posted by jason.1969

Correct. Was an authentic. Went through Moser. Became a PSA/PWCC 2. Returned by buyer and refunded by Brent as doctored/"conserved." And now back in the wild on the National floor as a PSA 2 like nothing ever happened.

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So does this mean Brent refunded on the card, admitting it had been altered, and then simply resold it? You'd think he would have defaced the PSA flip identifying the card as altered, at minimum, or broken it out of the PSA case so it would, at least for awhile, not be incorrectly labeled a PSA 2.

If the chain of ownership of that card, and what's been happening with it, can be clearly established, I do not think it would go well if introduced as evidence of misrepresentation (fraud) in court.

[jason.1969]

Originally Posted by Mark17

So does this mean Brent refunded on the card, admitting it had been altered, and then simply resold it? You'd think he would have defaced the PSA flip identifying the card as altered, at minimum, or broken it out of the PSA case so it would, at least for awhile, not be incorrectly labeled a PSA 2.



If the chain of ownership of that card, and what's been happening with it, can be clearly established, I do not think it would go well if introduced as evidence of misrepresentation (fraud) in court.

I had an error in my original response that I've now corrected. Brent/PWCC not in the resell loop. Main point is that card is back in the wild with some unsuspecting buyer sure to pounce.

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[Peter_Spaeth]

In a nutshell this is the problem with Sloan's position that buyers of altered cards should go to the seller not PSA. Indeed, it the card has gone up in price, it's just a profit opportunity for the seller. And even if not just put it back out there.

Good solution, Steve.

[jason.1969]

As the cards are already altered I would propose a scarlet letter "A" for altered embossed directly on the front and back of the card. Pretty much nothing else will protect the hobby from garbage, sad as the fact may be.

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[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

In a nutshell this is the problem with Sloan's position that buyers of altered cards should go to the seller not PSA. Indeed, it the card has gone up in price, it's just a profit opportunity for the seller. And even if not just put it back out there.

Good solution, Steve.

Exactly

PSA should hold the responsibility for buying back the card and paying the victim the difference.

PSA is a total BS company built on lies....they’re supposed to be the Police in this Meaning Authority In wether a Card is good or not....they’re as corrupt as the card doctors....

The registry is farce/BS marketing.... their pop report is bogus and their company can’t determine what is altered and what is not.....the Industry has been ripe for fraud since the Wagner....PSA’s OPINION is worthless

All the bitching and complaining is worthless if people don’t stop using them and buying their product....

I suspect after the dust settles PSA and the card doctors will continue this at even a more extreme clip....

Zero accountability no card doctors will be charged no responsibility and liability will be placed on PSA ....no change in this industry except for monetary value Of graded cards.

It’s going to Crash....when it does it’s going to be a big crash

[Rhotchkiss]

Jason, so Heartland (whoever that is), is currently selling the card? If so, I think a more effective header would be “Heartland at booth ____ is selling a green Cobb known to be altered. Beware”

Steve, thanks for pointing this out. We need to police ourselves.

[jason.1969]

There are many collectors who worship the slab so much that they value the plastic and the number more than the actual baseball card.

There are really two hobbies now. Some of us collect cards, and some of us collect grades. For the grade collectors it really doesn't matter how the grade got there. For them the scandal is actually a feature and not a bug.

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[jason.1969]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Jason, so Heartland (whoever that is), is currently selling the card? If so, I think a more effective header would be “Heartland at booth ____ is selling a green Cobb known to be altered. Beware”

Steve, thanks for pointing this out. We need to police ourselves.

Correct. I will be there today and look to see if it's still out or has been purchased.

I don't know that they know what they have, but one would think any dealer would check the lists before touching a $5K card these days.

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[RedsFan1941]

for what it’s worth, Heartland is Bill Goodwin’s new company, which he started after Beckett cut ties with him.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by RedsFan1941

for what it’s worth, Heartland is Bill Goodwin’s new company, which he started after Beckett cut ties with him.

shocking!!!! On facebook the guy who was considering purchasing this green cobb stated it was sold shortly after he decided to pass.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

shocking!!!! On facebook the guy who was considering purchasing this green cobb stated it was sold shortly after he decided to pass.

And an altered significant card re-enters the hobby. Good result, Steve.

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by RedsFan1941

for what it’s worth, Heartland is Bill Goodwin’s new company, which he started after Beckett cut ties with him.

From what I hear, Bill Goodwin is a real winner.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

From what I hear, Bill Goodwin is a real winner.

Legend of the hobby!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Legend of the hobby!

His prediction of the 55 Koufax in PSA 8 being worth 200K has not quite materialized.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Legend of the hobby!

Aren't they all.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

His prediction of the 55 Koufax in PSA 8 being worth 200K has not quite materialized.

Well he tried!!!!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Well he tried!!!!

I think the best he could do on that one was 80, and I would bet that was a fake sale like so many of PWCC's in that time period apparently were. There was one buyer in particular who was "winning" cards like that left and right in several of the AHs but not paying for them.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I think the best he could do on that one was 80, and I would bet that was a fake sale like so many of PWCC's in that time period apparently were. There was one buyer in particular who was "winning" cards like that left and right in several of the AHs but not paying for them.

Well im content with my raw g-ish koufax rookie in my hof binder!!

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by jason.1969

Correct. Was an authentic. Went through Moser. Became a PSA/PWCC 2. Returned by buyer to Red Zone (where he purchased it) as doctored/"conserved." And now back in the wild on the National floor at Heartland as a PSA 2 like nothing ever happened.

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That's PAR FOR THE COURSE

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

It’s going to Crash....when it does it’s going to be a big crash

No it's not.

[Johnny630]

[QUOTE=samosa4u;1905083]No it's not.[/QUOT


I think graded cards need to come down 40% for this to heal.....that would be my non recession crash predictions.

My biggest fear is with no crash that alteration and shill/no winning bids will become acceptable as the norm in this industry....

[Peter_Spaeth]

[QUOTE=Johnny630;1905096]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

No it's not.[/QUOT


I think graded cards need to come down 40% for this to heal.....that would be my non recession crash predictions.

My biggest fear is with no crash that alteration and shill/no winning bids will become acceptable as the norm in this industry....

Perhaps they already have.

[bnorth]

[QUOTE=Peter_Spaeth;1905107]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Perhaps they already have.

Some have, a while back I was debating on either a 52 Topps Eddie Mathews or a T206 Red Cobb. So glad I went with the Mathews(Thanks Ted). Prices are slightly up on Eddie. I have still been watching the Red Cobb and the prices are down from a few months ago.

[Snapolit1]

[QUOTE=Peter_Spaeth;1905107]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Perhaps they already have.

Id have a damm hard time spending more than $1000 on a graded card at this point. Unless I knew a whole lot about it’s history.