An eye-opening experience at the Card Grading Station

[Tennis13]

***This may be a miscast thread, please feel free to move it to the appropriate silo****

I'm relatively new to the modern method of card collecting. I have some vintage cards I collected back in the early 1990s, but until yesterday, I had never submitted anything for grading. Yesterday, though, at the Cow Palace in San Francisco, I finally submitted some things. I submitted a lot, and because of that, it took me about an hour to go through and line-item the inventory.

Nobody stole my stuff while I wasn't looking. Nobody gave me an exceptionally great or terrible experience. This isn't one of those types of posts. It's one of those posts where if you sit down for a while, you learn some stuff.

What did I learn? A lot of stuff, but this isn't a business case study, so I'll stick to the good stuff. I learned there's a lot of fake stuff out there. I would venture to guess that in the hour I sat there, I heard of approximately 5 to 7 items that were picked up and deemed either "unpassable" or "not real." I don't remember what they say, but basically, they don't authenticate it, and they give you a handout that explains it.

I had just returned from a trip to Asia, and I was jetlagged and foggy, so I didn't even comprehend what was going on around me until I was telling a co-worker about it tonight, when he asked how the show went. I started telling him, and then I was like "Dude, there was a lot of fake stuff there" and then I recalled 2 specific instances:

1) A Stephen Curry signed autograph 8 x 11. They wouldn't authenticate it. The guy said he ordered it directly from Stephen Curry mail order BEFORE he signed with Fanatics. I may have the company wrong, but the gist of it was "No way this is fake" and then I immediately switched ahead to the old President robo-signers from the 1950s and 1960s, and I'm not saying anything at all, but I'm just pointing out that the means this guy claimed to take to get the autograph, if true, raised my eyebrows (briefly, because as I said, I completely had forgotten about this until tonight). One of 3 things happened and the best possible outcome is that PSA had their b-team grader there and he just didn't pass an obvious autograph. I have my doubts, and I don't think it was that choice. The other 2 are the guy was lying about how he got it, or we have a President Curry robo-signer from back a few years ago.

2) A 1951 Tigers signed team ball. I could have the year wrong, because I wasn't too focused on it. All I heard was this: "We verified them all as good except for the Cobb." I don't know who was on the 1951 (or thereabouts) Tigers, but I have to assume the majority of that ball's value is centered around ole Mr. Cobb. I don't collect Cobb at all, but pardon my historical mental timeline when I just assumed he was dead by 1951.

Needless to say, despite my hazy recollections of the entire hour, I concluded there's a ton of fake stuff out there. So much so, that when I heard a guy coming to pick up his 2014 Giants World Champion signed team ball, I held my breath. I think it passed, but I lost my focus, so I can't recall with certainty. There was, however, enough un-verifiable merchandise in that hour that makes me weep for honesty in this world.

Anyone have any experiences like this?

[bdk1976]

I don't dabble in autographs for a variety of reasons, but I do know Ty Cobb lived well past 1951 (died in '61).


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[swarmee]

Feel free to read articles about Operation Bullpen, Eli Manning, Mastro Auctions, and Hauls of Shame. There are definitely fraudsters in this hobby.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Feel free to read articles about Operation Bullpen, Eli Manning, Mastro Auctions, and Hauls of Shame. There are definitely fraudsters in this hobby.

63 charges and convictions
◾Seizures exceeding $4.9 million including 5 homes, cash, bank/investment accounts, jewelry, a Ferrari, a boat, and a Harley Davidson motorcycle.
◾18 forgery rings dismantled.
◾Over $300,000.00 in restitution paid to over 1,000 victims and continuing.
◾$15,253,000 in economic loss prevented in the seizure of tens of thousands of pieces of forged memorabilia through 75 search warrants and over 100 undercover evidence purchases.

I often wonder, how if they seized 5 million in assets, how they only pay a fraction of that in restitution.

It always makes me feel like the government stole the stolen proceeds from the thieves, gives some of it back, as justification that they did something good. If you were a victim, wouldn't you want to sue the government for not giving back all of the seized proceeds?

[Yankees1964]

After living through card shows of the 80's and knowing people who faked autographs it is really difficult for me to buy any high dollar autograph today. I know that most of the authenticators are true experts in the hobby, but they are also human. If I don't know the person that got it signed, I do not buy it.

[Kingcobb]

I don't buy any autograph's of living players unless I have them signed in person. I saw a segment on ESPN that 85% of autographed material of players that are alive are forged.

[drcy]

I don't deal or am an expert in autographs, but, as an art and artifacts expert, my saying is "It's easy to make a forgery. It's hard to make a good forgery."

I assume the 85% includes a whole lot of bad forgeries.