Getting tiny pieces of scrap tobacco off a T205?

[obcbeatle]

Hello ... has anybody ever soaked a T205 (or T206) Polar Bear card ... to try to remove tiny pieces of scrap tobacco? These would be two very tiny pieces of scrap tobacco that you can see ... AND feel by touch. My understanding is Polar Bear was scrap tobacco (pieces of chewing tobacco?) that commonly stuck to the card and often caused staining (because perhaps the card was loose in the tobacco pouch itself?). I don't want to try to gently push the two pieces of tobacco off using a fingernail or any other device as I believe it would tear the paper off. Thus my curiosity about soaking it to see if the tobacco pieces come off on their own in the water ... or perhaps trying to nudge them off gently while the card is soaking? I thought maybe someone has already tried this before? The card is not a HOFER or anything like that. It is just a Fair condition card that I'd like to increase the eye appeal a little since the pieces of tobacco are ill placed. So no worries about damaging an expensive card. I've only soaked a few old cards ... to remove paper that was glued to the back (scrap book paper). Soaking those worked very well. Thanks in advance! Jerry.

[Leon]

I don't think I have tried the Polar Bear scrap as far as getting it off the back of a card. My guess is that if it has been on there for a hundred years getting it off might reveal close to the exact same size stain.

Originally Posted by obcbeatle

Hello ... has anybody ever soaked a T205 (or T206) Polar Bear card ... to try to remove tiny pieces of scrap tobacco? These would be two very tiny pieces of scrap tobacco that you can see ... AND feel by touch. My understanding is Polar Bear was scrap tobacco (pieces of chewing tobacco?) that commonly stuck to the card and often caused staining (because perhaps the card was loose in the tobacco pouch itself?). I don't want to try to gently push the two pieces of tobacco off using a fingernail or any other device as I believe it would tear the paper off. Thus my curiosity about soaking it to see if the tobacco pieces come off on their own in the water ... or perhaps trying to nudge them off gently while the card is soaking? I thought maybe someone has already tried this before? The card is not a HOFER or anything like that. It is just a Fair condition card that I'd like to increase the eye appeal a little since the pieces of tobacco are ill placed. So no worries about damaging an expensive card. I've only soaked a few old cards ... to remove paper that was glued to the back (scrap book paper). Soaking those worked very well. Thanks in advance! Jerry.

[drcy]

I would think tobacco could cause staining that would be hard to remove.

[obcbeatle]

Thanks Leon/Drcy ... I hadn't even thought about the stain probably being as bad as the actual tobacco scrap sticking to the card. I guess I hadn't thought this through :-) So far this is the only "T" card I've ever owned that had actual tobacco scrap clinging to a card. I wonder how common that is? I guess more so for Polar Bear. Anyway ... thanks for the quick replies! Jerry.

[brob28]

Jerry, I've had some decent luck removing tobacco stains and small pieces. Its hard to completely remove them, but I think the results of this Willis soak show you can certainly improve the cards appearance.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by brob28

Jerry, I've had some decent luck removing tobacco stains and small pieces. Its hard to completely remove them, but I think the results of this Willis soak show you can certainly improve the cards appearance.

Bill's results are quite typical. Use a bit of patience and avoid a heavy hand during the dying process and you should be able to remove the heavy stains, leaving a lighter footprint. With a little luck, some stains will completely disappear. Realistic expectations are key. His Willis is not perfect after soaking but it sure looks a helluva lot better.

[brob28]

Originally Posted by Bocabirdman

Bill's results are quite typical. Use a bit of patience and avoid a heavy hand during the dying process and you should be able to remove the heavy stains, leaving a lighter footprint. With a little luck, some stains will completely disappear. Realistic expectations are key. His Willis is not perfect after soaking but it sure looks a helluva lot better.

Usually, I take notes on all cards I've soaked so I can refer back if I run into a similar card in the future. Unfortunately with this one either I lost them or forgot to take any so I can't share how long this one was under or if I used a Q-tip on any stains.

I assume you meant avoiding a heavy hand during the drying process, not "dying". I usually put card between paper towels and between stacked books. Do you use a different technique?

[obcbeatle]

Bill/Mike ... thanks for the replies. Bill ... thanks for sharing info. on your Willis soak. Definitely improved the eye appeal. I collect lower grade cards ... so I'm always on the lookout for Polar Bears because they often have a lot of tobacco stains ... which seems to cause a lot of buyers to shy away from them (at least commons). Thus they are sometimes a bargain ... but not always :-) Anyway ... I don't mind tobacco stains. Just wondered about this one card in my collection that still has pieces of scrap tobacco stuck to it. I'd never seen that before. So I may eventually trying soaking it. Thanks again for the information! Best regards. Jerry.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by brob28

Usually, I take notes on all cards I've soaked so I can refer back if I run into a similar card in the future. Unfortunately with this one either I lost them or forgot to take any so I can't share how long this one was under or if I used a Q-tip on any stains.

I assume you meant avoiding a heavy hand during the drying process, not "dying". I usually put card between paper towels and between stacked books. Do you use a different technique?

Typed that message pre-coffee...yes Bill, drying not dying...Yes paper towels and heavy books work fine...I, if I am only doing a couple, will dig out a couple screw downs. I still use the paper towels....The heavy hand is referring to blotting them dry when they first come out of the drink. It is easy to encourage flaking, especially if you try and "help" some of the stains........ I stay away from Q-Tips, opting for a cotton ball instead........

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by obcbeatle

Bill/Mike ... thanks for the replies. Bill ... thanks for sharing info. on your Willis soak. Definitely improved the eye appeal. I collect lower grade cards ... so I'm always on the lookout for Polar Bears because they often have a lot of tobacco stains ... which seems to cause a lot of buyers to shy away from them (at least commons). Thus they are sometimes a bargain ... but not always :-) Anyway ... I don't mind tobacco stains. Just wondered about this one card in my collection that still has pieces of scrap tobacco stuck to it. I'd never seen that before. So I may eventually trying soaking it. Thanks again for the information! Best regards. Jerry.

Post a scan of the card.....I bet it would benefit greatly from a dunk. I, or any of a few dozen guys around here, could talk you through it. It seems counterintuitive to put cardboard in water but trust me. It works....

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Bocabirdman

Post a scan of the card.....I bet it would benefit greatly from a dunk. I, or any of a few dozen guys around here, could talk you through it. It seems counterintuitive to put cardboard in water but trust me. It works....

My only concern with soaking tobacco is the possibility of tobacco stain "bleed" to other parts of the card. A Q tip and a bit of water might be a more conservative first try....

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by Leon

My only concern with soaking tobacco is the possibility of tobacco stain "bleed" to other parts of the card. A Q tip and a bit of water might be a more conservative first try....

Perhaps, Leon, if there is actual pieces of tobacco, a swab would be the first step. A scan would settle the mystery....

[obcbeatle]

Sorry it took me so long to provide a scan. So the two pieces I thought about removing are the piece on the front just below Neal's cap ... and the piece on the back covering "1910". Those two pieces feel raised when you rub your finger over them. The other two pieces (one between the "N" & "A" of NAP's ... front of card ... and the other in the top right corner of the back of the card) don't feel raised when rubbing with finger (although it would be nice to remove those too). But as Leon and others have mentioned ... removing the pieces doesn't remove the stain.

As an aside ... the piece below Neals cap I alway thought was part of his hair ... until I tool a closer look at another T205 Neal Ball card :-) BTW ... kind of neat too that Neal befriended Babe Ruth when Ruth was a young pitcher (I think around 1914). Plus I think Ball was the guy that is mentioned in an old (1908/1909?) letter that has survived ... from a NY writer suggesting that he allow the ATC/ALC to use his image on a T206! Neat stuff! Thanks for any help with soaking this card! Jerry.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by obcbeatle

Sorry it took me so long to provide a scan. So the two pieces I thought about removing are the piece on the front just below Neal's cap ... and the piece on the back covering "1910". Those two pieces feel raised when you rub your finger over them. The other two pieces (one between the "N" & "A" of NAP's ... front of card ... and the other in the top right corner of the back of the card) don't feel raised when rubbing with finger (although it would be nice to remove those too). But as Leon and others have mentioned ... removing the pieces doesn't remove the stain.

As an aside ... the piece below Neals cap I alway thought was part of his hair ... until I tool a closer look at another T205 Neal Ball card :-) BTW ... kind of neat too that Neal befriended Babe Ruth when Ruth was a young pitcher (I think around 1914). Plus I think Ball was the guy that is mentioned in an old (1908/1909?) letter that has survived ... from a NY writer suggesting that he allow the ATC/ALC to use his image on a T206! Neat stuff! Thanks for any help with soaking this card! Jerry.

The official verdict from Boca is a quick 5 minute soak in room temperature distilled water. STAY AWAY from a Q-Tip seeing as how you are dealing with a face and a tobacco wad directly on a number on the reverse. A Q-Tip could lead to a bit of ink loss in both places. If 5 minutes doesn't finish the job, give it another 5. The two wads of tobacco will break free quickly and the other two larger stains should benefit.....Good Luck.....

[obcbeatle]

Mike ... thanks for the recommendations. I do have one question. The last two cards I soaked (post-war 1950's cards) ended up a bit warped. What is the best way to prevent warping? What I currently do is put the card between a thin wash cloth ... immediately after a soak ... and put the card between two very heavy books ... the top book being the heavyist. The first day I replace the wash cloth with another wash cloth at least once ... sometimes twice. After that I replace the wash cloth about once a day for about a week ... or until I'm sure the card is dry. But the last two cards I did I noticed near the end of this process (of being between the books) the card started to exhibit a bit of a wavy warp. I used to use paper towels instead of thin wash cloths ... but I've had a few cards stick to the paper towel. Maybe I didn't get all the glue off the card. But now I don't want to use a paper towel as it means re-soaking the card to get the stuck paper towel off. Plus ... if it IS glue still on the back ... I can't see it and am afraid to try to rub it off as it soaks ... because it might tear the surface of the card. Just curious. Thanks. Jerry.

[drmondobueno]

Originally Posted by obcbeatle

Mike ... thanks for the recommendations. I do have one question. The last two cards I soaked (post-war 1950's cards) ended up a bit warped. What is the best way to prevent warping? What I currently do is put the card between a thin wash cloth ... immediately after a soak ... and put the card between two very heavy books ... the top book being the heavyist. The first day I replace the wash cloth with another wash cloth at least once ... sometimes twice. After that I replace the wash cloth about once a day for about a week ... or until I'm sure the card is dry. But the last two cards I did I noticed near the end of this process (of being between the books) the card started to exhibit a bit of a wavy warp. I used to use paper towels instead of thin wash cloths ... but I've had a few cards stick to the paper towel. Maybe I didn't get all the glue off the card. But now I don't want to use a paper towel as it means re-soaking the card to get the stuck paper towel off. Plus ... if it IS glue still on the back ... I can't see it and am afraid to try to rub it off as it soaks ... because it might tear the surface of the card. Just curious. Thanks. Jerry.

Jerry,

Prewar cards are made of a different cardboard than the post war stuff. I have soaked prewar cards and if you use reasonable precautions, your card shoud not warp. Mine did not, not a one.

The new cardboard stuff absorbs water like paper and the card is done. Forget soaking most postwar.


Keith

[conor912]

The washcloth is your problem...its too thick and leaves too much vertical space. Try parchment paper. Its got some absorbency (though not as much as a paper towel, so may require more frequent changing), but also has some silicone in it, which makes it non-stick.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by obcbeatle

Mike ... thanks for the recommendations. I do have one question. The last two cards I soaked (post-war 1950's cards) ended up a bit warped. What is the best way to prevent warping? What I currently do is put the card between a thin wash cloth ... immediately after a soak ... and put the card between two very heavy books ... the top book being the heavyist. The first day I replace the wash cloth with another wash cloth at least once ... sometimes twice. After that I replace the wash cloth about once a day for about a week ... or until I'm sure the card is dry. But the last two cards I did I noticed near the end of this process (of being between the books) the card started to exhibit a bit of a wavy warp. I used to use paper towels instead of thin wash cloths ... but I've had a few cards stick to the paper towel. Maybe I didn't get all the glue off the card. But now I don't want to use a paper towel as it means re-soaking the card to get the stuck paper towel off. Plus ... if it IS glue still on the back ... I can't see it and am afraid to try to rub it off as it soaks ... because it might tear the surface of the card. Just curious. Thanks. Jerry.

The card will come out of the book press just fine. Use the paper towels or the parchment paper as suggested. The wash cloth will not be sufficient. There is no comparison between tobacco cards and post-war cardboard. The Ball will be none the worse for wear. The tobacco clumps will come off. The stains will improve a bit. Keep the soak short for your own peace of mind................