Problems with VCP and the Hobby

[ezez420]

So as all of you know the market has cooled off tremendously since the National and will cool off further until the end of the year. And if you think otherwise that's too bad. Did people see this coming? Of course some of us intelligent ones on here did. Were people warned, of course you all were. I will commend Peter S. for telling it how it was months ago when people were laughing. He was right and some of you knew he was right.

However, a real big problem is VCP here which is hurting the hobby.

So during this few months span there were a group of a$$holes who thought they were "pushing" the market yet they never paid for some high dollar items so they can record in VCP. Yes create a fictitious market so the bottom would drop. I am not posting to get into that or explain. But you can see on things like the Rose Rookies, Ryan Rookies, Clemente Rookies, Aaron Rookies... you get the point.

However, I am very curious though why VCP continues to present these closed prices when cards are NOT paid for or turn out to be fakes. Yes houses did sell cards in fake PSA holders. I will not elaborate any further but this is happening. Also why the auction houses that do report to VCP do not state that the items were not paid for. This is bullsh&t and needs to be taken care of.

[drcy]

It's always been the cases with that there is shilling in auctions and you can't tell which items were actually paid for at the winning price, etc. Interpreting data is always as important as data itself.

[ezez420]

Shilling is one thing that is harder to control. However, a sale that is completed or not paid for by a winning bidder to an auction house is easy to control.

Wanting to do it is another thing.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by ezez420

...I am very curious though why VCP continues to present these closed prices when cards are NOT paid for...

I understand your point, but how is VCP supposed to know which auction items are paid for and which are not?

[Snapolit1]

I'd be happy if VCP even listed all the recent sales. I bought a number of higher end cards in the last year -- a few off ebay -- and they are listed nowhere. Pretty inexplicable.

[ezez420]

How? VCP pulls data from houses if they permit. You can see which houses permit. I think to help the hobby, they can help by sending data to VCP of cards that are not paid for. VCP can do a better job of making sure there data is accurate. Especially on cards that do not sell often.

[packs]

VCP is just a data mine. All of the information on VCP is information available to you as well if you search for it. You wouldn't know anything beyond a sale price unless you spoke to the buyer or the seller. I don't think it's fair to put that initiative on a service like VCP.

[Beastmode]

Originally Posted by packs

VCP is just a data mine. All of the information on VCP is information available to you as well if you search for it. You wouldn't know anything beyond a sale price unless you spoke to the buyer or the seller. I don't think it's fair to put that initiative on a service like VCP.

++ Don't kill the messenger (VCP). I love VCP and consider it a great resource. I also use POP reports, ebay completed sales, and if available, an AH"s archieves.

There at lots of outliers in VCP you need to ignore, (from the "buying-group" especially). It's not all subjective either. You need to see the trends and get a feel for demand, scarcity, and your own gut.

Always stay within your budget and you will never have to worry about shilling. This is a hobby, learn to enjoy coming in second.

[ezez420]

Good points. Smr is put out by PSA and technically can put whatever info on value of cards. SMR is just a guide. Same as Beckett. VCP is supposed to be actual real sales data. And if the sales data is not correct or falsified how does someone know besides the auction house. Especially on rarer issues that do not sell often?


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[botn]

Originally Posted by ezez420

Good points. Smr is put out by PSA and technically can put whatever info on value of cards. SMR is just a guide. Same as Beckett. VCP is supposed to be actual real sales data. And if the sales data is not correct or falsified how does someone know besides the auction house. Especially on rarer issues that do not sell often?


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If some of the data that is reported by auction houses is not correct, it would still not be correct even if VCP were not collecting such data. VCP is simply recording final results of sales. Responsibility is with the ebay seller or auction house to omit, when applicable, items not paid for or items which they know were manipulated and that is not going to ever happen.