Sales Tax?

[pencil1974]

So I just got an email starting June 1, that Heritage will be charging Illinois (where I live) sales tax on their auctions. Is this happening across all auction houses and states? As that is adding close to 10% on top of the 20% most auction houses charge for their fee. I see myself not bidding as often as most items I typically by it would add hundreds to the total.

Just wanted to see if this was a universal change for everyone or if Illinois was just getting screwed. This sucks as I think this is where Leon is going to be selling his collection this summer and now I have to really think on what/if I want to bid.

Sorry if this has been discussed before.

Brad

[Jobu]

I am new to paying attention to auction houses and still have not won a lot though I have bid. I now live in Wisconsin and I can tell you that sales tax would have been part of my purchase had I won anything from BST Auctions (located in WI).

[Taxman]

Have it shipped to a trusted friend that lives in another state.

[Sean1125]

.

[vintagetoppsguy]

How does Heritage charge Illinois sales tax when they are based in Texas?

[atx840]

I'm working on a fairly large trade with Johnny (who lives in NJ) and the card I'm sending him was recently won in REA (also in NJ). Canadian customs wanted to charge me $550 for taxes on the card and then for me to send it to Johnny would cost him another 7% NJ tax. On top of this another 7% on the cards he is sending me.

Even if REA sent it direct to Johnny or he picked it up they would still charge same state tax of 7%

Got to pay your taxes.

[4815162342]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_tax

[Taxman]

Individual to individual trades could fall under the "casual sale" transaction and thus sales/use tax would not be due.

[CW]

Many states are now pushing online retailers to charge sales tax for their state. This is being heavily pushed to be imposed for all states.

Not to be a Debbie Downer, but if you live in Illinois you should've been paying a "use tax" on all goods purchased online.

http://tax.illinois.gov/individuals/faqs-use-tax.htm

You owe Illinois Use Tax if you purchase an item:

- for use or consumption in Illinois, from an out-of-state retailer who charges no Illinois Sales Tax or charges sales tax at a rate lower than the Illinois rate, and on which sales tax would normally be collected if you bought it from a retailer in Illinois.

Examples include: purchases from an internet site that does not charge Illinois Sales Tax, catalog purchases from an out-of-state retailer who does not charge Illinois Sales Tax; purchases through an out-of-state home shopping television network that does not charge Illinois Sales Tax; and items purchased while you were in another state from a retailer who charged sales tax at a lower rate than the Illinois rate or in a foreign country.

[dstudeba]

Heritage used to collect taxes in Texas, New York, and California because they have offices in those locations.

Looking at the rules from their National 2014 auction Rule 25 states that

"Lots delivered to you, or your representative in the States of Texas, California, New York or other states where the auction may be held, are subject to all applicable state and local taxes...."

However in their May 2015 Auction Rule 25 has been changed to

"Lots delivered to you, or your representative are subject to all applicable state and local taxes....

[Bliggity]

This happened to me yesterday for the first time on eBay. I bought a high-dollar item from a seller in Utah and it automatically added NC sales tax. Our legislature has been pushing this lately too. I was able to find the same item from a different eBay store that didn't add the sales tax, so I just bought it there instead. But it seems like the sales-tax train is picking up steam pretty quickly.

[pencil1974]

Yeah it sucks and I know its an evil that we all have to pay (at some point) but it just eats at the price when you are talking almost 30% added to what ever your final total is.

Now I know you can just say well bid less but then there is a competitive advantage for someone that does not have to pay the sales tax versus people that do (if that makes sense).

[pawpawdiv9]

This recent one, i have 0 in sales tax in GA.
But i found this on the site:
Sales Tax Information

Lots delivered to you, or your representative are subject to all applicable state and local taxes, unless appropriate permits are on file with Auctioneer. Bidder agrees to pay Auctioneer the actual amount of tax due in the event that sales tax is not properly collected due to: 1) an expired, inaccurate, or inappropriate tax certificate or declaration, 2) an incorrect interpretation of the applicable statute, 3) or any other reason. The appropriate form or certificate must be on file at and verified by Auctioneer five days prior to Auction, or tax must be paid; only if such form or certificate is received by Auctioneer within 4 days after the Auction can a refund of tax paid be made. Lots from different Auctions may not be aggregated for sales tax purposes.

Note: You will be billed for sales tax unless you have the appropriate documentation on file at and verified by Heritage five days prior to the auction. This documentation consists of a Resale Form (download now) and a legible copy of your state issued license or permit issued in your name and/ or the name of the business for an appropriately related category of merchandise. If you do not have this documentation on file with Heritage, you have 14 days from the date of the sale to complete the form and send/fax a copy of your license or permit to receive a refund for the tax. Lots from different Auctions may not be aggregated for sales tax purposes.

[Edwolf1963]

Curious if this is as a result of all states getting caught up on this and will be coming soon to an REA, Goodwin, Goldin, etc theater near you? Did anyone else get the Heritage letter for June 1st or just Illinois residents? Reason I ask is I haven't received any other AH notification of Sales Tax but HA. Did HA build a brick and mortar location here which is driving this now?

[pencil1974]

Yeah that was my question too on the other AH's. If others don't charge then I would be looking harder at their listings versus others. I don't think Heritage has a place in Illinois now and if they do they never announced it that I had seen.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by atx840

Got to pay your taxes.

Chris, I can tell that you aren't an American.

[Bigb13]

Originally Posted by Taxman

Individual to individual trades could fall under the "casual sale" transaction and thus sales/use tax would not be due.

Do up know up to what amount is considered a casual sale?

[calvindog]

Lots of discussion about committing tax fraud on this thread, probably not the best thing to do on a public forum.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Lots of discussion about committing tax fraud on this thread, probably not the best thing to do on a public forum.

Hysterical.

[pencil1974]

as soon as taxes start going to something useful then I'll worry about tax fraud. Since that will NEVER happen back to getting around the sales tax. I've got a buddy of mine in another state that said he'll bid for me for Heritage so I'm good there now until his state is added to the list.

[TipTopBread]

RE: TAXMAN
Having the item ship to a friend in another state, I think won't accomplish anything! When the card is "picked up" by the purchaser and brought into Illinois, a USE TAX is then due the state same rate as the sales tax, NO ESCAPE!

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by pencil1974

as soon as taxes start going to something useful then I'll worry about tax fraud. Since that will NEVER happen back to getting around the sales tax. I've got a buddy of mine in another state that said he'll bid for me for Heritage so I'm good there now until his state is added to the list.

Good thinking. You should also keep in mind that if someone turns you into the IRS for fraud, they'll get a piece of what you are forced to pay upon being audited. You can use as your defense that taxes don't go to anything useful and you shouldn't be required to pay.

[barrysloate]

Whether or not the taxes are used for something useful is not relevant. The law says you have to pay them. When you bid, simply work that into your calculation.

[pencil1974]

Yep alright I'm going to pay all taxes from here on out... just because you guys said too. Now I feel bad for all those years I'm sure I've under paid. So just please disregard any mention of fraud, evading paying taxes, because I've seen the light my friends.

Also pretty sure I'm not getting audited for an opinion on a baseball card board. I know we all want to believe we are more important than what we are but got to say it will never happen because of our thread here. I know stranger things have happened, but lets get real shall we?

[edjs]

A couple things about this:

1. You guys are doing your math wrong. If the tax is 10% and the BP is 20%, it is not 30% more you are paying, because they will tax the BP too. Example, you buy a $100 item, you are then taxed on $120, which is a total of $132.

2. Did any of you notice that PWCC moved to Oregon from California? They no longer have to collect sales tax on any items they sell, as there is no sales tax in Oregon. They used to collect tax from me on items I won.

[barrysloate]

I pay sales tax all the time. It's added to most of the purchases I make. I don't have a choice. Baseball cards are no different than any other purchase. I know it sucks, but I have to do it.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by pencil1974

Yep alright I'm going to pay all taxes from here on out... just because you guys said too. Now I feel bad for all those years I'm sure I've under paid. So just please disregard any mention of fraud, evading paying taxes, because I've seen the light my friends.

Also pretty sure I'm not getting audited for an opinion on a baseball card board. I know we all want to believe we are more important than what we are but got to say it will never happen because of our thread here. I know stranger things have happened, but lets get real shall we?

Can I give you some free advice? Compounding the suggestion you're going to break the law with stubborn stupidity doesn't make you bullet-proof. All it takes is one person on this board to contact the IRS and tell them that you buy and sell cards and don't pay capital gains or sales tax and there is a decent chance you get audited -- which is like having a tooth pulled through your ass. But you know better because of your vast experience in dealing with Revenue Agents.

[pencil1974]

Well see that is where we differ Barry as the only AH that had ever charged sales tax to me was Legendary since they are in Illinois. All others have never added in sales tax.

[pencil1974]

Jeff I already tell the IRS that I buy and sell cards so I do pay taxes on that or at least my accountants tell me and then tell me who to write checks to. Enough said and please don't call me stupid that is just you being a self absorbed ass. But thanks for the free advice are you sure its free or is there a tax on that as well? I'm kidding, were all friends here.

[pencil1974]

And that will be my last comment on this as the thread has gone from one thing to another and I personally don't care for that.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by pencil1974

Jeff I already tell the IRS that I buy and sell cards so I do pay taxes on that or at least my accountants tell me and then tell me who to write checks to. Enough said and please don't call me stupid that is just you being a self absorbed ass. But thanks for the free advice are you sure its free or is there a tax on that as well? I'm kidding, were all friends here.

I'm not a self-absorbed ass for pointing out that you're an idiot to openly discuss evading the tax laws on a public baseball card board. As for charging you for advice, I don't take on clients who nickel and dime the IRS so you've got a freebie on this one.

[pencil1974]

Well I guess we are entitled to our own opinions of each other. I'm sticking by mine and I'm sure you are too.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by pencil1974

Well I guess we are entitled to our own opinions of each other. I'm sticking by mine and I'm sure you are too.

Difference is that if anyone calls the IRS on me nothing will happen. If you piss someone off here, they'll get a piece of whatever the IRS takes out of your ass as I'm certain you're not complying with all the laws -- no one could be who is clearly so ignorant or arrogant about the laws could be. But keep it up, I'm sure there's no one on Net 54 who deals with the IRS every day.

[cammb]

You must be afraid of the boogey man or a demoncrat.

[pencil1974]

Good thing I'm a nice guy and don't piss anyone off or I would be nervous.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by pencil1974

Well see that is where we differ Barry as the only AH that had ever charged sales tax to me was Legendary since they are in Illinois. All others have never added in sales tax.

We don't differ at all Brad. I'm not suggesting you volunteer to pay sales tax if it is not due. You were charged sales tax by Legendary because the law said they had to collect it from you. You didn't pay sales tax to other auction houses because legally they weren't obligated to charge you. It's not a game, it's how the law works.

And for the record I never paid sales tax on baseball card purchases. You know why? Because I bought and sold baseball cards full time and was therefore issued a NY State resale number. If I bought baseball memorabilia for resale then I was not charged sales tax. But I did have to collect it from my New York customers. That was the law.

If you don't want to pay sales tax that is your choice, but you do understand you can get into an awful lot of trouble. That's up to you.

[Peter_Spaeth]

[QUOTE=pencil1974;1413595]


Also pretty sure I'm not getting audited for an opinion on a baseball card board. I/QUOTE]

Sounded more like an admission to me. Jeff is giving you well-intentioned advice, whether or not you think it's ridiculous.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Can I give you some free advice? Compounding the suggestion you're going to break the law with stubborn stupidity doesn't make you bullet-proof. All it takes is one person on this board to contact the IRS and tell them that you buy and sell cards and don't pay capital gains or sales tax and there is a decent chance you get audited -- which is like having a tooth pulled through your ass. But you know better because of your vast experience in dealing with Revenue Agents.

LOL, Jeff. I know that you are speaking in generalities within this thread, and not specifically giving legal advice. However, the replies you have received from people who are serving up potential evidence in a tax evasion suit are quite entertaining.

Best regards,

Eric (who pays all of his tax obligations to the IRS)

[Bigb13]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

Do up know up to what amount is considered a casual sale?

Does anyone know how high you can go and still be a causal sale from person to person?

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by Bigb13

Does anyone know how high you can go and still be a causal sale from person to person?

I think it is $4.99

Lonnie (who also pays all of his due tax to the amazingly wonderful Internal Revenue Service)

[deucetwins]

How long are you put on hold before you actually speak to a live person at the IRS?

I think that the Internet truly represents (ed) a free market economy where interstate commerce is not hampered by taxes. However, I can see the states' point of view that they are not getting the revenue that is due them. Brick and mortars are at a disadvantage unless they have an Internet site. Of course it also depends on what % of their business is done over the Internet. Internet retail tax in every state will do a couple of things: 1) shrink the interstate market place back to a local market place, and 2) drive shoppers off the Net entirely. Currently in my state, it's cheaper for me to buy a book off Amazon than it is for me to go to the bookstore. When the 2 sources become the same price/tax wise, then the decision on how to buy will change to another factor.

Ok, economics gurus, please weigh in. By the way, the flat tax idea is kinda growing on me. Can't remember which candidate is pushing it though.