Grading questions (various) with photos

[Mesquite]

I've read through the PSA grading guidelines, and want to ask about the grading of some cards per their guidelines.

First up is a 1974 Rod Carew #50. Focus on the one in the lower left in the regular-sized photo of 6 cards and ignore the others (I'm photographing them in groups of 6 to save time). A digitally-zoomed front and back of that card is also shown:







If their centering guidelines are followed by the book, this card has essentially 99/1 centering (just a hariline of border on the right side). It doesn't even meet the 90/10 centering of a 1.5-FAIR grade.

Does that override all other considerations, and the card is a 1-POOR?
All aspects of the card that were controllable by me as the the card owner (corners, edges, gloss, etc) would seem to put this card at an 8 (1 or 2 corners with slight fraying) or maybe a 7 (does that seem about right, ignoring centering?).

So when they grade a card, do they create a composite grade, for example 3 parts "handling defects" and 1 part "manufacturing defects?" Manufacturing defects like centering (which are by all accounts just a random spread), shouldn't count as much toward the grade as handling defects. If they counted equally, that would imply the two categories of defects were equally controllable, but they're not.

So 3 parts handling and 1 part manufacturing would be: ((3*8)+(1*1))/4 = 6.25 grade. Is some composite grade like that used instead? Beyond the poor centering from the manufacturer, it's an otherwise very nice card.

Or is there some other way PSA would handle the grading on a card like this? It just doesn't seem right that this card should grade at a 1. If I had a true grade-1 1974 Carew card with perfect centering but rough handling, I can't imagine anyone would consider that the equal of this card.

[Bestdj777]

Not to sound dumb, but does it really matter what they grade it? Whether it is in a PSA 1 or a PSA 8, it is a drastically off-center (would likely be considered miscut as two backs are showing), stained 1974 Topps card with pretty decent registration and sharp corners.

[Mesquite]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Not to sound dumb, but does it really matter what they grade it? Whether it is in a PSA 1 or a PSA 8, it is a drastically off-center (would likely be considered miscut as two backs are showing), stained 1974 Topps card with pretty decent registration and sharp corners.

Just to clarify, my question isn't so much about the value of this particular card (which isn't much, even if it had good centering), it's about how poor centering is reflected in the grade on an otherwise nice card. I have quite a few cards that fall into that category, and this is just one where I had photos available.

[Mountaineer1999]

Love the cards! I cant help with your question though. I usually just guess the grade my cards might get by comparing them to Ebay listings. I do love the '74's, 2nd best set IMO of the 70s.

[begsu1013]

"(would likely be considered miscut as two backs are showing)"


have to agree w/ bestdj, here. don't think a card is considered oc when there are examples of another card on it, which this clearly does on the back.

you would mostly like garner the MC qualification. it would also get the ST qualification.

I've only seen a few examples but you might get this designation on the flip: 3(ST) and then "miscut" on the bottom line of the flip.

[swarmee]

A miscut is either when part of your card is cut off OR you have part of an adjoining card showing up. So this card, if it was an EX 5 otherwise, would get a 5(MC) grade and the stain would be ignored. PSA doesn't award or even mention a second qualifier on a card. For a registry set, cards with grades above 2 lose 2 grades for what they equate to, so this would be a 3 if you counted it towards a registry set. If the other card wasn't visible on the back, it would be a 5(OC). Same basic result. Most qualifier cards will be priced around the same as a card 2 grades lower, but since yours has multiple problems and is severely off-center, it might be valued four grades lower.

[swarmee]

Also, PSA doesn't tell you the subgrades of what each aspect graded (corners, edges, centering, surface/creases, registration, etc).

BGS will tell you the grades of each of those components, and their normal rule of thumb is not to give a grade higher than +1 of the lowest component score. They don't put this on their Vintage cases, though, and their dividing line is 1980.

Here's an example:

1981 Kellogg's 3-D Super Stars #5 - Mike Schmidt [BVG*9]
Courtesy of COMC.com

If the surface was a 4 instead of 9, the highest this card could get graded is probably a 5.

[Mesquite]

Thanks for the replies. Please excuse my ignorance on the lingo, but what does registry set mean?

swarmee: if you wouldn't mind explaining, could you describe what takes this card (ignoring the centering) down to EX-5 that you mentioned (I'm assuming that would be the grade you'd give it, ignoring the centering)?

There must be something I'm not understanding about the PSA description of corners. They use the word "fraying" down through grade 6, then they use the word "rounding" for grade 5 and below. Is that the key point here, and these corners would be considered rounded rather than frayed?

To me, the corners look more like they are slightly crushed (for example the card was set on the corners), whereas "rounded" would to me imply that some material has been permanently eroded away. So that was my thinking for them being more in the "frayed" category rather than "rounded."

Just out of curiosity, is there standard level of magnification that graders use?

[begsu1013]

Originally Posted by swarmee

A miscut is either when part of your card is cut off OR you have part of an adjoining card showing up. So this card, if it was an EX 5 otherwise, would get a 5(MC) grade and the stain would be ignored. PSA doesn't award or even mention a second qualifier on a card. For a registry set, cards with grades above 2 lose 2 grades for what they equate to, so this would be a 3 if you counted it towards a registry set. If the other card wasn't visible on the back, it would be a 5(OC). Same basic result. Most qualifier cards will be priced around the same as a card 2 grades lower, but since yours has multiple problems and is severely off-center, it might be valued four grades lower.

they most certainly do. it happens on rare occasions, but i have seen them definitely do a 3(MC) and will write "stain" on the bottom line of the flip. They will also do this if a card is simply assigned an "authentic" grade and will qualify the bottom line with mc, st or mk. it's not universally done by all the graders but they do pump out these every once in a while if that second qualifier is just as blatantly obvious...100%.

will let swarmee answer your questions addressed to him, but they use 10x magnification and that card wouldn't get a 5mc.

i don't buy cards w. qualifiers and if submitting request for straight numerical grade vs getting a higher grade w/ a qualifier, but here is an example:

[Mesquite]

Love the shifted Rose card begsu1013! So I assume this entire sheet was miscut...how did they not catch this?

Here's a strange one (1974 Jim Kaat #440). The (left-right) centering is 75/25 (I measured it with some calipers using the on-screen image), but there is some printing partially showing in the upper right. Would this be tagged as a miscut because you can see that, even though the centering is fair?

That must be some sort of printing serial number, not an adjacent card, so I'm not sure it counts the same way...