Diversity in the hobby

[JoeyF1981]

So I was having a discussion with a friend at work about the hobby and the first thing he said is "I dont think Ive met one black person who collects baseball cards besides you" lol...I was thinking about it and I can honestly say I know of only a couple. Ive seen many photos of the conventions and other functions and Ive rarely seen that much of a diverse crowd of people regarding race particularly african americans. Just wanted to see what other peoples perception is on this topic so I can argue this point with my co-worker.

[brewing]

I agree with your co-worker. In my opinion, the percentage of non-white males is less than 5%.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by brewing

I agree with your co-worker. In my opinion, the percentage of non-white males is less than 5%.

This has been my experience as well.

[JollyRoger]

You could tell your coworker about Dimitri Young

[bbcard1]

I would argue that there are older white males in all sorts of sizes and shapes.

[wonkaticket]

It's most likely because we are all racist old white guys like Michael O'Keefe outlined a few times.



Just look what we did to those poor guys Cobb & Edwards with their perfectly fine Wagner.

[Tim Kindler]

Without sounding like a total you know what, the thought of a collector white, black, brown, Old, young, male, female, fellow Catholic, Jewish, atheist, Muslim, American, citizen of another country, hetero, alternative, WHATEVER, shouldn't cross anyone's mind.
On this board at least, other than the folks I have met and can put a face with, I have no idea what they are in person and frankly I don't care, nor would ever care. I would hope no one would. And I'm not saying u are worried about it either, just stating my opinion that diversity hopefully is really a nonissue in our hobby and that we are all just HUMAN collectors. (except for those zombies I saw at the net 54 dinner last year)
Joey, not the least bit upset in my thoughts, just stating a thought with a fellow collector.

[Orioles1954]

I've known only a couple of African-American collectors. Conversely, I've known well over a dozen Asian and Middle Eastern collectors.

[4815162342]

Go back and look at one of the "Introduce yourself" threads and you'll see that Net54 members come from different locations, backgrounds, and all walks of life. Different colors of skin shouldn't be the only measure of diversity in a group.

[JoeyF1981]

Originally Posted by Tim Kindler

Without sounding like a total you know what, the thought of a collector white, black, brown, Old, young, male, female, fellow Catholic, Jewish, atheist, Muslim, American, citizen of another country, hetero, alternative, WHATEVER, shouldn't cross anyone's mind.
On this board at least, other than the folks I have met and can put a face with, I have no idea what they are in person and frankly I don't care, nor would ever care. I would hope no one would. And I'm not saying u are worried about it either, just stating my opinion that diversity hopefully is really a nonissue in our hobby and that we are all just HUMAN collectors. (except for those zombies I saw at the net 54 dinner last year)
Joey, not the least bit upset in my thoughts, just stating a thought with a fellow collector.

I totally agree and could care less about anyones race. The important thing is we all share a passion for the hobby. I was just making a observation based on what ive seen and heard from other people.

[JoeyF1981]

Originally Posted by brewing

I agree with your co-worker. In my opinion, the percentage of non-white males is less than 5%.

Thats what I was thinking too

[freakhappy]

Originally Posted by JoeyF1981

I totally agree and could care less about anyones race. The important thing is we all share a passion for the hobby. I was just making a observation based on what ive seen and heard from other people.

I think your observation was definitely fair...no big deal to bring it up. It's weird because sometimes these types of observations will come up no matter if you have ill intent or not. I've never thought about it before, but you are right, I cannot remember seeing many African American card collectors at shows or in general...weird if you think about it. I believe the 5% range is about right (someone mentioned it a few posts back).

All in all, it doesn't matter your ethnicity or human makeup, but it was an interesting observation.

[JoeyF1981]

Originally Posted by freakhappy

I think your observation was definitely fair...no big deal to bring it up. It's weird because sometimes these types of observations will come up no matter if you have ill intent or not. I've never thought about it before, but you are right, I cannot remember seeing many African American card collectors at shows or in general...weird if you think about it. I believe the 5% range is about right (someone mentioned it a few posts back).

All in all, it doesn't matter your ethnicity or human makeup, but it was an interesting observation.

Ya it was weird my friend said that outta nowhere which got me thinking about it. I remember watching some of the highlights of one of the baseball conventions on youtube a couple weeks ago and I cant recall seeing any african americans in any of the videos or that I personally know. I wonder why that is. I know when I was growing up I had alot of friends that were into the hobby but I guess they grew out of it.

[Bpm0014]

To play devil's advocate Tim, then why have we previously asked "Any women on the forum?" or asked Waz how old he was? It was a fair question that JoeyF had asked.

[freakhappy]

Originally Posted by JoeyF1981

Ya it was weird my friend said that outta nowhere which got me thinking about it. I remember watching some of the highlights of one of the baseball conventions on youtube a couple weeks ago and I cant recall seeing any african americans in any of the videos or that I personally know. I wonder why that is. I know when I was growing up I had alot of friends that were into the hobby but I guess they grew out of it.

It definitely is a question to ponder about. A hobby that is dominated by a small group of people, for no real apparent reason

[Tim Kindler]

Brendan,
As Joey confirmed, we both don't think this thread brings up any real issues and it was just a thought on his and his coworker's thoughts. My response and his back to me later in thread confirm the neither one of us is worried about this. That was the whole premises behind my post. I said I had no issues with him bringing it up (and he had no issues with my response), just that to me, and most I would say onthis board, that none of us really care about anything except for that we are all honest collectors. As for him bringing up the question, don't have a problem with it, I just never think about those things until someone brings it up. As for the any women thread, can't speak on that- didn't see it, and if I did- again I didn't pay attention to it. As for asking about age, well that is a question Leon probably has to know for legal reasons. No problem with you playing Devil's advocate, just there is nothing there to play with.
Take Care, Tim

[aabram23]

Wow never thought of this before but it does seem to be a fact. I guess this is one reason why I spend more time reading this board than many other sites. It allows me to escape the everyday struggle of majority vs minority ideals in the media.

In my mind I always thought you all were just old fat diabetic, 3 pack a day guys with no children on the verge of death getting ready to unload all of your collections at the same time and I was the only one who had a love for this "stuff" under 40. I guess I was wrong.

I guess it could be worse. I could be surfing the net behind my wife's back flirting with "college chicks" finding out they are old fat diabetic 3 pack a day guys.

It's amazing how the cyber space removes all preconceptions and prejudices until someone lays it out on themselves.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[71buc]

Diversity is important to me. It effects me personally as well as professionally on a daily basis However, when it comes to this silliness it is meaningless to me and I prefer to leave it that way. Ironically, my all time favorite team that I honor with my user name was the very embodiment of diversity.

[z28jd]

I think the odd part is that cards are popular all over the United States. If you look at the show calendar on the Beckett site, they are everywhere and if you've traveled at all, you know people are different all over the place, especially the locals. I've been to Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Boston, New York and Philadelphia multiple times for baseball. After a couple times, you could tell where you are just by talking to the people. Everyone has their own style, yet cards are popular at all places

I'm staying down south at my mother's house for the Winter and I really don't have a lot in common with the people here. They might be just as white as me(probably more since I'm part American-Indian), but we don't have much in common besides that. They do sell cards in the local Target/Walmart and other smaller stores here, plus there is a shop, so cards obviously must sell here.

As a side note. I do notice that the couple people I've met down here that are from NJ, I've instantly bonded with, even if I wouldn't talk to them up there

[drcy]

Baseball cards is one small area of collecting. If you look at collecting on a larger scale, you may find the diversity of collectors more represents the diversity of of Americans or people world-wide.

I mean, if you look at collectors of Viking artifacts, a way larger than normal percentage will be Sandinavian or ethnic Scandinavian.

[JoeyF1981]

I hope I didnt offend anyone and Im not trying to start anything negative on here. I just wanted to get peoples opinions on it based on a comment my co-worker said. I could care less about race or background. The fact that we all share the same passion should be enough for anyone. It does seem like others on here share the same opinion as me and no one really knows how many african-americans are collectors. Just based off of what Ive seen there doesnt seem to be alot

[prewarsports]

You should be allowed to talk about race and issues surrounding it as much as you want as long as you are not doing it with purposefully nefarious intentions. To not talk about it because you are scared you might offend someone is the reason why we are so uptight in this country. We should talk about it more (and before any of you get angry I said that because I am white, I have EIGHT adopted black brothers and sisters and I have found that talking about it openly is BY FAR the best option for any issues surrounding Race at all).

Having said that, I have only met a few African Americas in all the years of collecting in ANY area, Antiques, Sports Collectibles, Art Photography etc. Some of the ones I have met though are wonderful people and extremely passionate about what they love!

[howard38]

Perhaps fewer black people collect vintage because there are so few pre-war cards of black players available. Is the percentage of black collectors the same for post-war and/or modern cards?

[Tim Kindler]

Joey,
No problem with you bringing it up. You were just stating an observation brought on by a co-worker in a conversation. No offense was taken by me at least. And I hope none was taken on account of my remarks. My points in my threads were simply that I had never thought about anything like that before. I am not trying to disregard your thoughts with my responses, its just that in our hobby, my only concern has always been only sharing our collecting passions with each of us whom are honest collectors. Every other aspect of a person I never even think about.
Happy Collecting and Take Care,
Tim Kindler

[drcy]

Joey's post/observation was fine by me. Nothing offensive about it. I've thought about the topic before.

Of course, few women collect baseball cards also.

I don't have an answer to it all. Something to think about.

I wonder if there is a larger percentage of blacks who collect modern basketball cards-- where there clearly are a larger percentage of black players, stars and legends. I would imagine there are, but that's just speculation.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by prewarsports

You should be allowed to talk about race and issues surrounding it as much as you want as long as you are not doing it with purposefully nefarious intentions. To not talk about it because you are scared you might offend someone is the reason why we are so uptight in this country.... I have found that talking about it openly is BY FAR the best option for any issues surrounding Race at all).

100% agree. Talking about and trying to truly understand these issues is far more interesting and better than simply staying on the "right side" of that PC fence. Not to come down on PC rules and behavior, which are much better than some ugly alternatives, but I also think this "correctness" can make it really difficult to progress as a society and truly understand others' POV.

Not that I'd expect race to be an everyday conversation on a baseball card forum, but I have no problem Joey's question and think it's relevant.. and to take it a step further, I'd love it if baseball and the collecting community were to become more diverse with time. It would only help the long term health and outlook for both. Baseball really has some work to do. No doubt it's definitely grown internationally but domestically it has almost completely lost entire racial/socio-economical segments. It always bums me out to think of how many of the all time greats were urban kids/immigrants' kids/etc (Dimaggio, Lazerri, Gomez, Williams, Koufax, Greenberg, Heilman, etc)... now, in the days of travel ball, it seems it's becoming far more a sport of whose parents can fly their kids to year round tournaments and afford the best personal batting coaches, etc. Not that I hold a grudge against those who do this, but it doesn't seem like an even playing field. I do hope with better enforcement of PEDs/lower power numbers, coupled with hightening health/safety concerns with football that baseball will begin to attract more elite pure athletes... maybe begin to pull in some people who have otherwise turned away from it.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by aabram23

In my mind I always thought you all were just old fat diabetic, 3 pack a day guys with no children on the verge of death getting ready to unload all of your collections at the same time and I was the only one who had a love for this "stuff" under 40. I guess I was wrong.

old - Check
fat - Check
diabetic - Check
3 pack a day - Half Check (Actually 2 Pack a Day)
guys - Check
no children - Check
on the verge of death - Hope Not
getting ready to unload all of your collections - Takin em with me

5.5 Checks out of 8 possible - You must be psychotic...err psychic... What do I win?

[kcohen]

Okay, okay. Got it. Nobody meant any offense and nobody has been offended. This thread is putting me to sleep.

That said, to achieve true diversity, the hobby needs more old fat white guys with comb-overs.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Tim Kindler

............. (except for those zombies I saw at the net 54 dinner last year).............

Hey Tim, I'm sorry I missed you at the Net54 dinner this year. Maybe next year you can just by my table and say hello. You'll know me when you see me.
My avatar is misleading.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by kcohen

...That said, to achieve true diversity, the hobby needs more old fat white guys with comb-overs.

Already has that population. That's why Net54 shirt sizes start at 3XL, except for myself, of course

[Exhibitman]

Out of the two shows we've run so far in SoCal I'd say we had an attendee mix that was about 75% white, with the balance African-American, Hispanic and Asian. We also had far more women attendees than is the norm at many shows, which I ascribe to our free admission policy that allowed moms, significant others, and other people who weren't interested in collecting to tag along for free [I should probably ask whether charging a lot for women to be admitted is something the collectors favor ]. If you want to talk non-diversity, though, let's talk gender, as Bill Simmons wrote in 2011 on Grantland:

Q: Enjoyed your sports memorabilia piece. A question though: Were there ANY women there at all? I mean, if there is 'press box hot' what constitutes as 'sports memorabilia convention' hot?
— Torey, Pittsburgh

SG: I tackled this subject in 2009's photo essay, writing things like "There are sausage fests, there are mega-sausage fests and then there's the National Sports Collectors Convention. You have a better chance of meeting your future wife in an all-male penitentiary during a Gay Pride parade." Press Box Hot is a much higher caliber than NSCC Hot; I'd put NSCC Hot just below Female Prison Guard Hot. It's so bad that you're startled every time you see a woman under 40. Even pregnant moms pushing baby strollers get checked out. One collector had the bright idea of having a pretty women in her early 20s sit in his station with him; she was clearly hired for the event (like a convention escort), but the ploy worked. Guys in Hawaiian shirts were awkwardly wobbling by like they'd just seen a lunar eclipse. That's my suggestion to any major dealer out there: Hire a local Hooters girl or model to hang out in your booth for five afternoons and just flirt with customers. Pay her $200 a day. You'll make the money back.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Most of the other collectors I know are white. I'm hispanic.

[timzcardz]

Could it be that non-whites are smarter than to waste ridiculous amounts of money on little old scraps of cardboard?


All kidding aside though, I've never taken notice of the ethnicty of people who collected, or didn't.

[ullmandds]

Having been in this hobby for close to 4 decades now...it has always been and continues to be predominantly a "white" dominated hobby. Quan keeps pumping out kids...so I'm guessing the vietnamese subsect will be increasing in the future...and I hear the inuits are getting into it as well!

[wonkaticket]

Well as long as the Dutch don't get into the hobby I hate the Dutch!

Them and their little wooden shoes...ughhh...

[Texxxx]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Hire a local Hooters girl or model to hang out in your booth for five afternoons and just flirt with customers. Pay her $200 a day. You'll make the money back.

Can I have the booth next to yours?

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Well as long as the Dutch don't get into the hobby I hate the Dutch!

Them and their little wooden shoes...ughhh...

+1

And forget about the Hottentots...Yuck!

[ullmandds]

Hiring a hottie or 2 would actually be a very smart idea!!!

[kcohen]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Well as long as the Dutch don't get into the hobby I hate the Dutch!

Them and their little wooden shoes...ughhh...

Geez, Wonk! What did he ever do to you?

[JoeyF1981]

Originally Posted by timzcardz

Could it be that non-whites are smarter than to waste ridiculous amounts of money on little old scraps of cardboard?


All kidding aside though, I've never taken notice of the ethnicty of people who collected, or didn't.

Lol!!

[Rickyy]

Well..the stamp collecting world was turned upside down when Maria Sharapova confessed to liking stamps... perhaps we can recruit Kate Upton...

http://stampcollectingroundup.blogsp...sharapova.html

Ricky Y

[7nohitter]

This is a very interesting topic and would make a great research study!
I've actually never even thought about it, but since it was brought up I have a very tough time recalling seeing many African Americans (if any) at any of the shows/signings/events I've attended, or even seen reported on...

[CW]

I have to say, I really like the direction this thread took, and the discussion that took place here. Maybe there is hope for humanity after all.

Originally Posted by Adam with the brilliant suggestion

That's my suggestion to any major dealer out there: Hire a local Hooters girl or model to hang out in your booth for five afternoons and just flirt with customers. Pay her $200 a day. You'll make the money back.

Just wanted to point out the ingenuity of this idea!

[Jewish-collector]

At many of the previous Nationals, Memory Lane Auctions booth had some hot, young women passing out free brochures/catalogs. Also, some of the old, white, fat dealers have hot wives, girlfriends, or daughters helping them at their booths.

[zachclose21]

"It's an old wooden ship"
If you don't get it watch anchorman the first one

[glynparson]

in my 35 years in the hobby I have sold cards to more African American celebrities then African Americans from the general public. That seems odd but it may be true. I have sold many many cards to people of Latino and Asian descent as well as a fair number of women and even a few Indians. I could be wrong but I'd take the under at the 5% level. I have not sold much modern since the early 1990's and have no idea of the demographic breakdown of ebay customers over the years. I'm going strictly on my experience at Conventions and shows throughout the years. I have also been mainly a baseball card dealer (as opposed to other sports) which may also have an impact on the demographic of my customers over the years.

[mrvster]

the coolest thing is the cards/mem bring everyone together.....I bet there is more diversity then we know....I'm dutch, german, American indian, and irish....what a combo guess I'm a mutt???

Johnny,

we miss you in jersey....I love Fla., but would be tuf to live there