BCCG question

[tonyo]

I posted this in the BCCG thread on the postwar side, but it was slightly off topic and ultimately undetected.


I've been wondering about this more and more so I'll try it again in a new thread

I prefer raw, but do like the extra security of buying more expensive cards (for me) in a slab just for the increased odds that I'd be buying an authentic unaltered card. Despite the difference in grading scales, is there any reason to think a BCCG card has any more chance of being a fake or altered than PSA, SGC, or BGS ?

[JamesGallo]

Perhaps, the grade is certainly worhtless. We are talking BSSG not BVG or BGS.

Since it is a high volume slab and not a strong I would think it is more likely something could slip through.

That being said why bother unless it is something specific you can't get any other way or a auto that has a JSA with it, I am not sure why you would buy a BSSG slab.

James G

[vintagetoppsguy]

I would think that the same graders that grade for BGS and BVG would also grade for BCCG. I could be wrong about that, but maybe Leon can help with that as he knows the graders.

[tonyo]

Originally Posted by JamesGallo

That being said why bother unless it is something specific you can't get any other way or a auto that has a JSA with it, I am not sure why you would buy a BSSG slab.

I expect cards in BCCG would sell for less than PSA, SGC, or BVG......so, If I subscribe to "buy the card, not the holder" I'm thinking I may get a better deal on a card in a BCCG slab. If there is some added security that an altered or fake card would be likely caught by the same tests as PSA, SGC, or BVG, then all the better.


Edit to add: I didn't want to push this thread to the top since the majority of the posts has to do with a misunderstanding.... , but incase anyone reads the thread later, I want to point out that after what I learned from Leon about BCCG no longer grading post war by rule, I realize this thread doesn't belong in the main forum!

I ebay searched BCCG and narrowed to pre-war and only got about 12 results, and only half of those were actual pre-war cards and all of that half were over priced buy-it-now's. So, Leon is right: BCCG should be a non issue for most pre-war collectors, unless you are like me and have a "good" prewar card that was apparently slabbed prior to the "no-prewar" rule by BCCG, which is likely a rare occurance.

T.O.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by tonyo

I posted this in the BCCG thread on the postwar side, but it was slightly off topic and ultimately undetected.


I've been wondering about this more and more so I'll try it again in a new thread

I prefer raw, but do like the extra security of buying more expensive cards (for me) in a slab just for the increased odds that I'd be buying an authentic unaltered card. Despite the difference in grading scales, is there any reason to think a BCCG card has any more chance of being a fake or altered than PSA, SGC, or BGS ?

It was undetected on that side? Why don't you just be truthful and say you wanted to post it here? The one over there had 39 replies and as of right now 789 views. That's undetected? Maybe your views on things need to be taken into account?

BCCG stands behind their product just as any other Beckett product. The grading scale, which has been discussed to death, probably should have been the same as their other ones. Point well taken. There is no more chance of there being a fake or altered one in a BCCG holder as any other holder from my experiences. Personally, I put BVG very close to equal with SGC, in terms of reliability. Let me say it again, I agree with everyone that their BCCG scale should have been the same as their other ones.

To answer another question, I don't know if the same graders grade BCCG as the other Beckett entities. I do know that ALL of what we care about, pre-war, is graded by a few of their most experienced graders. I have the utmost respect for them. As a matter of fact, if you ask some other industry graders in person, they will tell you the same thing. I know because I have had a many a discussions with them.

[tonyo]

Originally Posted by Leon

BCCG stands behind their product just as any other Beckett product. The grading scale, which has been discussed to death, probably should have been the same as their other ones. Point well taken. There is no more chance of there being a fake or altered one in a BCCG holder as any other holder from my experiences. Personally, I put BVG very close to equal with SGC, in terms of reliability. Let me say it again, I agree with everyone that their BCCG scale should have been the same as their other ones.

To answer another question, I don't know if the same graders grade BCCG as the other Beckett entities. I do know that ALL of what we care about, pre-war, is graded by a few of their most experienced graders. I have the utmost respect for them. As a matter of fact, if you ask some other industry graders in person, they will tell you the same thing. I know because I have had a many a discussions with them.

Thanks for your insight on the question I asked.

Originally Posted by Leon

It was undetected on that side? Why don't you just be truthful and say you wanted to post it here? The one over there had 39 replies and as of right now 789 views. That's undetected? Maybe your views on things need to be taken into account?.

Huh?
Not sure why my integrity was questioned,
Poor choice of words? ok maybe. Not truthful? No way....

Just asking a question that's all. Maybe I should have written: It was slightly off topic in the other thread and understandably received no response.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by tonyo

Thanks for your insight on the question I asked.



Huh?
Not sure why my integrity was questioned,
Poor choice of words? ok maybe. Not truthful? No way....

Just asking a question that's all. Maybe I should have written: It was slightly off topic in the other thread and understandably received no response.

NO response and there were 39 replies? Am I looking at the wrong thread or help me understand?

[tonyo]

Originally Posted by Leon

NO response and there were 39 replies? Am I looking at the wrong thread or help me understand?

The thread over there is about the BCCG grading scale. In post #36, yesteday afternoon, I asked about authentic/altered .... no one addressed my question and the "discussion" regarding grading continued. I realized I tried to change the topic a bit so I started a new thread on the main forum.

I thought I was doing the gentlemanly thing by not continuing to force my question on that thread.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Leon

It was undetected on that side? Why don't you just be truthful and say you wanted to post it here? The one over there had 39 replies and as of right now 789 views. That's undetected? Maybe your views on things need to be taken into account?

BCCG stands behind their product just as any other Beckett product. The grading scale, which has been discussed to death, probably should have been the same as their other ones. Point well taken. There is no more chance of there being a fake or altered one in a BCCG holder as any other holder from my experiences. Personally, I put BVG very close to equal with SGC, in terms of reliability. Let me say it again, I agree with everyone that their BCCG scale should have been the same as their other ones.

To answer another question, I don't know if the same graders grade BCCG as the other Beckett entities. I do know that ALL of what we care about, pre-war, is graded by a few of their most experienced graders. I have the utmost respect for them. As a matter of fact, if you ask some other industry graders in person, they will tell you the same thing. I know because I have had a many a discussions with them.

Leon,

Thanks for the kind words about the BVG vintage graders. I have over 200 of their graded T206s, which is about 3% of their total graded output. No one can make that claim for PSA or SGC. I also also have SGC and PSA cards, like everyone else here, but I was beginning to question the wisdom of my BVG investment. Because they are not sought after by many, I feel that I have gotten better deals on many of them. Buy the card, not the holder. Of course I haven't tried to sell any yet and until now I have never cracked a slab. I do not own any BCCG cards. I do not understand why they exist.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by tonyo

The thread over there is about the BCCG grading scale. In post #36, yesteday afternoon, I asked about authentic/altered .... no one addressed my question and the "discussion" regarding grading continued. I realized I tried to change the topic a bit so I started a new thread on the main forum.

I thought I was doing the gentlemanly thing by not continuing to force my question on that thread.

OK...then my apologies but I do think your choice of wording could have been a bit better. All I was looking at was the thread you started. It currently has 39 replies and almost 800 views. Now that you clarified then that makes more sense. And maybe I misunderstood the question but I just couldn't wrap my head around that many replies and views and you saying it was unnoticed. Now, to say you posed a different question at the end of the thread, and got no replies to that, then that makes more sense. I wasn't trying to question your integrity but people do some strange things on the board and sometimes I get a bit peeved. Please carry on. Any question pertaining to the hobby is fair, per our board rules. Your questions are certainly fair and your participation is appreciated. best regards

[tonyo]

Originally Posted by Leon

OK...then my apologies but I do think your choice of wording could have been a bit better. All I was looking at was the thread you started. It currently has 39 replies and almost 800 views. Now that you clarified then that makes more sense. And maybe I misunderstood the question but I just couldn't wrap my head around that many replies and views and you saying it was unnoticed. Now, to say you posed a different question at the end of the thread, and got no replies to that, then that makes more sense. I wasn't trying to question your integrity but people do some strange things on the board and sometimes I get a bit peeved. Please carry on. Any question pertaining to the hobby is fair, per our board rules. Your questions are certainly fair and your participation is appreciated. best regards

No worries, but to be clear....I wasn't the OP on the thread on the Postwar side. My first post was #36.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by tonyo

No worries, but to be clear....I wasn't the OP on the thread on the Postwar side. My first post was #36.

Ouch...then my bad and double apologies. I did think you had posted the thread. I guess I should have learned my lesson after more than 6000 posts. We all make mistakes.

Back to the original question. BCCG is for venues such as The Home Shopping Club and QVC. It is not a product that we should even encounter though there are some earlier graded, older stuff in those holders, they are not allowed anymore. I will continue to buy BVG as I think it's a very good product. And if I am not mistaking, BGS is very well respected in the newer markets. best regards

[tonyo]

Originally Posted by Leon

It is not a product that we should even encounter though there are some earlier graded, older stuff in those holders, they are not allowed anymore. I will continue to buy BVG as I think it's a very good product.

Hmm, I always assumed I don't see many prewar cards in BCCG holders because it was intended for bulk grading, not because it is no longer allowed -didn't know that.


I own a 33 Goudey Ruth in a BCCG 5 slab - bought last january on ebay - I had already learned "buy the card, not the holder" back then and knew about the grading scale, but didn't really know why BCCG existed. Since then, I've 'kept my fingers crossed" that it is authentic/unaltered. It passed all the visual tests I knew to apply after 1-1/2years reading this board and collecting 33 goudey hofers.

Sounds like I don't need to be any more concerned about it's authenticity than if it were in a BVG slab or PSA or SGC for that matter.

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Leon,

Thanks for the kind words about the BVG vintage graders. I have over 200 of their graded T206s, which is about 3% of their total graded output. No one can make that claim for PSA or SGC. I also also have SGC and PSA cards, like everyone else here, but I was beginning to question the wisdom of my BVG investment. Because they are not sought after by many, I feel that I have gotten better deals on many of them. Buy the card, not the holder. Of course I haven't tried to sell any yet and until now I have never cracked a slab. I do not own any BCCG cards. I do not understand why they exist.

I agree with you Frank- I don't have a whole lot of BVG graded T206's, but I have no problem buying one if it's a card I want.The ones I do have are graded right on the money IMO. From my limited experience, I find their grading to be similar to SGC in the sense of accuracy......I think they are better graders than the ones at PSA (just my opinion).

Sincerely, Clayton

PS- BCCG's grading scale sucks, but as Leon said, this has been gone over many of times........