Who is the rightful single season MLB Home Run Champ?

[Piratedogcardshows]

This was a interesting topic of conversation at my work the other day.With all the asterisk talk from the steroids to Maris' extra games I wanted to see what the consensus was here on Net54.The choices are as follows:Babe Ruth,Roger Maris,Mark McGwire,or Barry Bonds.This should be interesting.My vote goes to Barry Bonds.

[vintagerookies51]

What about other? Josh Gibson would've broken it if he was allowed in the major leagues. There were also other African-Americans that would have a shot in the 50+ years they weren't allowed in the big leagues. For the options shown, however, I chose Ruth.

[Piratedogcardshows]

Originally Posted by vintagerookies51

What about other? Josh Gibson would've broken it if he was allowed in the major leagues. There were also other African-Americans that would have a shot in the 50+ years they weren't allowed in the big leagues. For the options shown, however, I chose Ruth.

I honestly thought about adding him as the 5th choice due to that big season but decided to keep it as a record done against strictly MLB talent.He can be a write in for those so inclined!

[irishdenny]

Maris!

Gibson's Story breaks my heart... His passing at such a young age only makes me want to give him my vote... Sorry Roger

(edited due to me being half asleep (& not on steriods), thought we were discussing the full Season King.

***I consider the Negro League as the Majors(MLB)! Heck, the Negro League All Stars whooped them when they played, why not consider their Numbers...

Josh Gibson fir sure!!!

[Brendan]

Originally Posted by vintagerookies51

What about other? Josh Gibson would've broken it if he was allowed in the major leagues. There were also other African-Americans that would have a shot in the 50+ years they weren't allowed in the big leagues. For the options shown, however, I chose Ruth.

He could have? So could a lot of people. With all due respect to Josh Gibson, he didn't play in the major leagues so he certainly doesn't hold the MLB homerun record. If baseball was around in 1,200 BCE I'm sure we would have someone who hit more than seventy-three homeruns. Maybe there was some ancient man who had all the skills of a great homerun hitter, but since baseball didn't exist he couldn't play in the major leagues. Is he the rightful single season MLB homerun champ? Of course not. We can always make these little excuses about why someone should/shouldn't hold the record. In my mind, look at who has the most homeruns in a single season- Barry Bonds with 73. I don't care how he did it as long as he hit 73 homers. All other information is immaterial.

[novakjr]

Sorry, some of you might not like this, but it's Bonds, plain and simple. He has the record. Every person on this list who has held the single season's record has some sort of flaw to it. Maris' feat was the least flawed though. Ruth, clearly wasn't playing against the best possible talent. Maris, took more games than Ruth, but was playing against a little more rounded of a field of competition. McGwire and Bonds obviously have their ties to steroids, but so does their competition, on top of being against pretty much the best of the best from around the world.. Now, if you wanna count out Mcgwire and Bonds, then Sosa needs to be included in this list...Because, while he never held the single season record, he would have had it not been for McGwire and his steroids. Now while I know that Sosa's been tied to steroids, I don't think there's been any definitive proof against him either(at least during that season)...So his name at least belongs in the mix.

[Big Ben]

Marris without a doubt. I also enshrine Marris into the HOF based on his merits and a slap in the face to all the steroid boys of the recent eras.

[Piratedogcardshows]

First to 100 is the Majority Net54 Single Season Home Run Champ and that opinion is good enough for me.

[vintagerookies51]

Bonds may hold the record, but the topic is the RIGHTFUL home run king. I don't know why you went all middle ages on me, but professional baseball was around when Josh Gibson played. I didn't say he could have broken the record. I said he did. I just stated my opinion, which is what the topic states. By the way, are you the "Brendan" from FCB as well? The one who got kicked off multiple boards?

[Jcfowler6]

Maris beats out bonds+steroids.

[jcmtiger]

Maris for me, Bonds from 185 lbs to 220 lbs or more. Steroids

Joe

[xdrx]

It's Maris for me.

Aaron is the all-time HR king (most HRs ever), and Ruth is simply the greatest home run hitter that ever lived (not a stat, an opinion).

The more time that passes from the height of the steroid era the more ill will I seem to feel toward the likes of Bonds, McGwire and Sosa. I would have guessed the opposite would have occurred, but apparently I am holding a grudge, and it is growing. I hope they never see the inside of the HOF (I wouldn't even let them in with a ticket).

[Brendan]

Originally Posted by vintagerookies51

Bonds may hold the record, but the topic is the RIGHTFUL home run king. I don't know why you went all middle ages on me, but professional baseball was around when Josh Gibson played. I didn't say he could have broken the record. I said he did. I just stated my opinion, which is what the topic states. By the way, are you the "Brendan" from FCB as well? The one who got kicked off multiple boards?

Did he break the major league baseball single season homerun record while playing in major league baseball? We can state our opinions all we want. That's the point of a forum. In my mind the rightful MLB single season homerun champ is whoever has the most homeruns in a single MLB season and everything else doesn't really matter. I don't believe I'm the Brendan you're talking about.

[Fred]

Ruth hit 60 in a 154 game schedule, Maris hit 61 in a 162 game schedule.

McGwire and Bonds did it in a 162 game schedule, but with a little help. I selected Maris but Bonds still hit 73 in a 162 game schedule. He actually only appeared in 153 games that season. I'm not sure how/why McGwire gets acknowledged in this poll.

I think the next poll should be:

Which of the following players do you think will be elected to the HOF?

Barry Bonds
Mark McGwire
Raphael Palmiero
Sammy Sosa
Roger Clemens
Pete Rose

I'd pick Charlie Hustle over any of the other guys listed. Yes, we could list a few other A-list PED users for the poll. Sad part is Bonds would have hit 500HRs even if he didn't use PEDs.

[sando69]

hmmm... i suspect that numerous net54 members have achieved the same goal without the assistance of steroids!

[barrysloate]

Maris has the most in a season among noncheaters, and is still the AL king. But I picked Bonds because until and unless his records are expunged, 73 in a season is still the record, as distasteful as it may be.

[thekingofclout]

Originally Posted by sando69

hmmm... i suspect that numerous net54 members have achieved the same goal without the assistance of steroids!

Now that is funny Mark.

[7nohitter]

Maris

[CharleyBrown]

Fred, might as well add Joe Jackson to that list.

[Joe_G.]

ESPN's take on Roger Maris:

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=7040052

[tbob]

Roger Maris will always be the legitimate holder of the single season home run record and Hank Aaron the career home run record.

[MacDice]

Like it or not it is Barry Bonds. The bottom line is what he was taking at the time was not banned by MLB. MLB knew about it but they were to busy making money to do anything about it.

[HRBAKER]

Isn't it interesting how these folks that were not doing anything that was banned by MLB still won't admit what they were doing that wasn't banned?
The shine is off the record.

[ChiefBenderForever]

Originally Posted by MacDice

Like it or not it is Barry Bonds. The bottom line is what he was taking at the time was not banned by MLB. MLB knew about it but they were to busy making money to do anything about it.

Hate to say it but it is true and the powers to be did everything they could to praise McGwire and Sosa as the saviors of baseball, then stabbed them and everyone else in the back when they decided enough was enough. If Bonds wasn't so anti social and such a prick you have to wonder how much different everyone would think of him and the whole situation. Bottom line is they didn't break any rules at the time so it is what it is, a giant cluster F*&^

[rhettyeakley]

Originally Posted by novakjr

Ruth, clearly wasn't playing against the best possible talent.

This is NOT clear to me and many others, what are you referring to here? 16 total MLB teams with 5 man rotations= 80 total MLB starting pitching spots available at the major league level at a time when ALL kids played baseball in the US. Compare that to todays watered down league post expansion and many great athletes never really playing baseball as they specialize in a number of other sports from an early age.

[oldjudge]

Babe Ruth. Throw out Bonds and Mac, they were cheating jucers. Maris only beat Ruth because the season was expanded by eight games. If Ruth had played in a 162 game season in 1927 he probably would have hit more than 61.

[mark evans]

I agree with those who believe the "shine is off the record." In reality we need three different records:

Most homers in 154-game season (Ruth), most homers in 162-game season w/out use of PED (Maris), most homers in 162-game season w/ use of PED (Bonds).

Not so clean and neat as the old days.

[Rob L]

It has to be Bonds, unfortunately!! Sentimentally, it's Raja.

[Vol]

Originally Posted by Big Ben

Marris without a doubt. I also enshrine Marris into the HOF based on his merits and a slap in the face to all the steroid boys of the recent eras.

Amen.

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

This is NOT clear to me and many others, what are you referring to here? 16 total MLB teams with 5 man rotations= 80 total MLB starting pitching spots available at the major league level at a time when ALL kids played baseball in the US. Compare that to todays watered down league post expansion and many great athletes never really playing baseball as they specialize in a number of other sports from an early age.

At the time, there were definitely some better latino and black players than many of the guys that were allowed to play at the time. But I do understand where you're coming from in regards to the number of teams and number of total starting pitchers. If anything, expansion has equalized the overall talent level in comparison to when the game was segregated.

[hunterdutchess]

Great post, I had to go with Maris on this one and I believe Aaron is still the all time champ. My reasons are selfish because it keeps me more interested in hoping I will see 62 or 756 by a player some day. I have no hate for what Bonds did and it is hard hard for us "mortals" to understand why you need a edge when you have that type of talent to begin with but it obviously made a difference when you see the HR numbers in today's game. Also Bonds paying the college tuition for the children of the man who got beat within a inch of his life was a very noble jester.

[Rob L]

Originally Posted by hunterdutchess

Also Bonds paying the college tuition for the children of the man who got beat within a inch of his life was a very noble jester.

Really, I didn't hear this. That is finally something I can positive about for Bonds. Being a huge Angels honk, I love to see the Dodgers fall on their face. But what happened to Brian Stow -still makes me cringe!!

[ullmandds]

Babe Ruth no doubt changed the game and is the greatest home run hitter and all around ball player(pitcher, fielder, hitter, runner) there ever was!

When Maris broke Ruth's record an asterisk was placed due to the increase to 162 games for the season.

So now there may as well be an asterisk next to Barry Bonds...who IS the single season home run king...for now!

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by tbob

Roger Maris will always be the legitimate holder of the single season home run record and Hank Aaron the career home run record.

+1. I give Bonds and McGwire credit for being the best of their era, in which literally hundreds of players were juicing (see the book written by Kirk Radomski, the Mets' clubhouse attendant, who was supplying them!), and by all accounts, those two were the hardest working (it takes more than just injecting the juice to maximize the results). But the fact remains that what they were doing was a felony offense under the laws in effect at the time (although it was seldom policy to prosecute illicit users, as the criminal justice system focused upon dealers), and the fact that major league baseball had no rules against it is totally irrelevant. That having been said, for any of us who have, like me, stood out there at the plate, 60'6"
away with bat in hand from even a good college pitcher, or former pro throwing 90+ and good breaking stuff, it is readily apparent that the achievements of Bonds and McGwire were truly amazing, regardless of the tools employed. But by no means do they stand on an equal footing with Maris and Aaron.

It is also interesting to note that Roger Maris and Babe Ruth had an almost identical number of plate appearances: Maris had 590 at bats plus 90 walks, for a total of 680, while the Babe had 540 at bats and 138 free passes, for a total of 678. I don't know the number of HBP's or sacrifice flies, but would think that would not make any significant difference. Maris also faced one heckuva lot more pressure than the Babe in accomplishing his feat, since the Babe was only surpassing his own previous record of 59.

Finally, the Babe was clearly the GREATEST homerun hitter of all time, despite the fact that his totals have been surpassed (Aaron, as fabulous as he truly was, had more than 3,000 more at bats than the Babe, by my recollection).

Josh Gibson was certainly great by all accounts, but remember that in the days of the Negro Leagues, these teams also played a number of games each year against semi-pro teams. His greatness simply cannot be ascertained with any degree of certainty at all, and must consequently be based on speculation and conjecture.

Just my $2.00 worth!

Interesting thread, as it will probably always be.

Best wishes,

Larry

[batsballsbases]

I think My Avatar says it all for me! And Jeff thanks for keeping my old Avatar alive! I see you finally won one! Or is that mine? If not good for you! Al

[Anthony S.]

1961 was an expansion year. The American League expanded from 8 teams to 10 teams. Does anybody care that there were more than 20% new pitchers in the league in 1961, who weren't good enough to be in league in 1960?

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Anthony S.

1961 was an expansion year. The American League expanded from 8 teams to 10 teams. Does anybody care that there were more than 20% new pitchers in the league in 1961, who weren't good enough to be in league in 1960?

But the major leagues drew from a far larger population base in 1961, including the best blacks and hispanics available (thank goodness, Branch Rickey and the sheer heart and soul of Jackie Robinson!). Thus the talent level should have been significantly higher in 1961 despite expansion than in the Babe's time.

Regards,

Larry

[quinnsryche]

Originally Posted by tbob

Roger Maris will always be the legitimate holder of the single season home run record and Hank Aaron the career home run record.

I agree 1000% Bonds is a cheat, always was, always will be. Anyone who votes for Bonds cares nothing for the game only numbers.

[martyogelvie]

My vote was for Maris.
I don't think there is a better story, at least a better HR story than Maris'.

I certainly do not begrudge what Bonds and big Mac did. But its just not as great a feat as Maris'.

61 forever!

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by Jcfowler6

Maris beats out bonds+steroids.

+1 Pretty much sums it up for me. Also, imagine what Maris could've done if he were on PED's- he probably could've beat Bonds. Just look at what Maris did without them.

Sincerely, Clayton

[tedzan]

I was in the Air Force during the 1961 season stationed at a B52 bomber base in Bangor, Maine. That September, I followed the day-by-day HR contest
between Mantle & Maris. First, it looked as if Mantle was on track to break Ruth's record. When Mickey became sick, the pressure shifted to Roger Maris
to break the record. When Roger hit his 61st HR, I was really excited. It was a tremendous time to be a Yankees fan.

But in this poll, I voted for Babe Ruth. Simply because of the difference in the # of games played. Ruth was unbelievable in September of 1927. He hit an
unprecendented 17 HR's to achieve his 60. Given 8 more games with the momentum he had, Ruth might have hit 70 HR's that year.

Having said all that....let's not forget that Roger's 61 HR's are still the best in the American League. All those "steroid dudes" with more than 61 HRs were
in the NL.


TED Z

[Runscott]

I can't stand cheaters, but unless MLB revokes some of Barry's 'steroid era' capybara-balls (much bigger than gophers), he's the champ. Before that it was Maris - he hit 61 homers, which is one more than 60.

If the question had been, "who do you think was the greatest home run hitter over a single season?", then I would have said "Roger Maris". Maris had more pressure on him than Ruth, and he still performed.

[Piratedogcardshows]

Well,it looks like the Net54 majority consensus is Roger Maris.I get all the points mentioned in all posts.To tell you the truth Bonds did alot better than I anticipated on this poll.MLB made this mess and its a shame Bonds has become the scapegoat for there greed and mismanagement.Just my opinion and it might have to do with I grew up loving the Pirates and an exciting rookie named Barry Bonds.Thanks to everyone who voted I learned alot from this poll! Jason Wells

[Doug]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Maris has the most in a season among noncheaters, and is still the AL king. But I picked Bonds because until and unless his records are expunged, 73 in a season is still the record, as distasteful as it may be.

Same here. As long as MLB recognizes him as the record holder I guess I have to agree (although I don't have to like it).

[howard38]

.

[D. Bergin]

I voted Bonds. Baseball isn't the NCAA where you can just pretend something didn't happen because you don't like how it was done.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

I voted Bonds. Baseball isn't the NCAA where you can just pretend something didn't happen because you don't like how it was done.

Dave, the gendarmes that guard the sanctity of track and field, as well as Olympic records do that all the time--remember Ben Johnson? If major league baseball doesn't do it, we can each do it within the domain of public opinion. If I remember correctly, the original question was who do we "consider" to be the "rightful" HR king. There's a reason why even the best Bonds cards are going down in value, while the Aaron rookie seems to be on a steady, although not spectacular climb. I personally don't know even a single baseball fan that believes any of Bonds' totals are entitled to any significant degree of respect in comparison to non-juicers.

All the best,

Larry

[steve B]

Originally Posted by ls7plus

Dave, the gendarmes that guard the sanctity of track and field, as well as Olympic records do that all the time--remember Ben Johnson? If major league baseball doesn't do it, we can each do it within the domain of public opinion. If I remember correctly, the original question was who do we "consider" to be the "rightful" HR king. There's a reason why even the best Bonds cards are going down in value, while the Aaron rookie seems to be on a steady, although not spectacular climb. I personally don't know even a single baseball fan that believes any of Bonds' totals are entitled to any significant degree of respect in comparison to non-juicers.

All the best,

Larry

The big difference being that track and field and most other sports follow the Olympic rules-currently via WADA, and PEDs of various types have been specifically forbidden since the 60's. Ben Johnson tested positive at the Olympics and his medal was rescinded as soon as possible - 3 days- which included lab time. He later confessed to using banned PEDs in earlier events and was stripped of his medals and records for those events.

McGwire took a substance that would have been banned under the rules of nearly every other sport. But baseball had no ban or testing program in place.

Sosa and Bonds probably took something banned, but as there was no firm policy till 2006 the didn't break the rules of baseball.

So the question to me is a hard one. McGwire and Bonds should count because they hit the most under the existing rules. Maris had an incredible season, and should probably be considered the "clean" season champ. (maybe- I don't know if he took anything for the stress, some of those medications are low level PEDs, currently banned, but not in 61- amphetamines were also common in athletics at the time)

Ruth was someone special and would be in any era. Maybe he hit against spotty competition, but so did eveyone else and very few of them even came close. He also had no modern training whatsoever. No weights, no off season gym, no dieticians, no computerized data on pitchers tendencies.....Hard to imagine what he could have done with even a bit of that. And his ab/hr was by far the best until the steroid era.

I'll go with Ruth, with a nod to Josh Gibson, who I think could have had a solid shot at the record had he been in the majors.
Also Joe Bauman, who hasn't had a mention yet.

Steve B

[tedzan]

In the Winter of 1925, Ruth realized he was a physical wreck. His weight had "balloned" to 254 and his performance that season reflected the
poor physical condition that he was in. That winter, Ruth started a rigorous physical training regimen at Artie McGovern's New York City gym.

By the start of the 1926 season, Ruth had lost 44 lbs and was as fit as he was when in his young 20's. Ruth continued this physical training for
the remainder of his BB career, and it really paid off for him. From 1926 - 1935, Ruth's performance actually exceeded that of his first 11 years.
This is evident when comparing his stats for these last 10 years with his previous year's stats.





TED Z

[jp1216]

I want to say Maris, but that 2001 season (minus 9-11) was all Bonds. The intentional walks, the homers - simply amazing. The rules are the rules. I don't like Bonds, but will always remember the 2001 season.