A Book Every Board Member Is Sure To Treasure

Archive · #1 09-28-2005, 04:46 PM

Posted By: Bruce Dorskind

Stephen Wong has created a wonderful treasure. His brand
new book," Smithsonia Collections- Inside The World's Finest
Collections "(Amazon $20 + shipping) is a PSA 10++

I have been in the hobby for 30 years and have over 50 books
on baseball card and memoribilia collecting. After countless
articles and a few pretty good books (Kashmanian's book
and Baseball Archaeology were my personal favorites).

This beautifully written, wonderfully illustrated book is for the
serious, intelligent collector. The focus is on the best of the best
-the rare- the noteworthy- and the historically important.

No error cards or discussion about prices or collectors who
are too rich for the envious, outspoken and under-educated-
rather a great story on America's game and people who
have dedicated their time, energy and resources to buidling
truly world class collections

And best of all, there are profiles with photos of the country's
great collectors---so you'll finally get to put a face to the
legend.

Great job Stephen!!

Bruce

Archive · #2 09-29-2005, 11:09 AM

Posted By: joe

Couldn't agree more, Bruce. I just picked this up yesterday and almost passed out at some of the stuff in these collections.
I had no idea that the "Live Oak Polka" was written about a Rochester team - the Live Oaks. Yet another Rochester-related item I'll never own, along with the Brunner's Bread team pics that I recently found about. Oh, well.
One interesting thing in the book: One of the collections had a unique advertising piecefor the OLd Judge cards, but the cards pictured on the ad were hand-drawn, like the A&G cards. The technology to put photos on the cards obviously existed at the time - they're on the cards, after all - so why put hand-drawn examples of cards on the ads when the actual cards are so much better looking? Woouldn't you want to advertise the actual cards people would find in their pack of smokes?
Either way it's a beautiful piece that no one would ever have seen without this book.

Archive · #3 09-29-2005, 11:20 AM

Posted By: Jay Miller

Bruce--I'm kinda confused. In your statement "...or collectors who are too rich for the envious, outspoken and under-educated..", which group, if any, are you trying to insult?

Archive · #4 09-30-2005, 05:38 PM

Posted By: Michael Campbell

Yes, this is probably one of the best, if not the best book there is, that deals with memorablia. Deals with all aspects, games, posters, stadium relecs etc. etc.

Every baseball fan and collector alike, should own this book.It's a must. Love that picture on page three. (3)

Bruce which of your catagories do you think I fall in? Outspoken, or under educated?

Archive · #5 09-30-2005, 06:17 PM

Posted By: leon

Can I at least be one of the uneducated? Or maybe I am envious? Can I be both? Maybe since I want both we can throw in greedy too?

Archive · #6 09-30-2005, 06:39 PM

Posted By: Mike Campbell

Touche Leon... Bruce's comment is the kind of thing that is uncalled for. Can't information be passed without snide comments, sniping, innuendos or insults? And when did being rich become a sin? Some people work their butts off to get rich. Not a crime in my book. Enough. I will quit now, and behave myself.

Have a wonderful weekend Leon.

Archive · #7 09-30-2005, 08:19 PM

Posted By: Tom Boblitt

someone told me I was ignorant and apathetic and I told them I didn't know what that meant and didn't care.......

Archive · #8 09-30-2005, 08:23 PM

Posted By: zach

I just got it today, and let me say it is great ! Filled with wonderful pictures and info on the collections of many of the greatest collectors. Great read !

Archive · #9 09-30-2005, 08:49 PM

Posted By: bruce dorskind

I am astonished by the over reaction to my comments about "snide commentary."

The point I was making is that so many people in the hobby are always commenting
about prices or expressing jealously about upscale collectors.

I am all for capitalism and certainly believe that wealth is a wonderful attribute.
It is pleasure to see a book which focuses on historical significance rather than
the value of the cards.

I certainly had no intention to insult the wealthiest collectors--- though I must say
it is delightful to read a book which is clear and articulate. And to read hobby
and baseball history without the grammatical errors that permeate so many of the
comments that I see in the hobby press and on the Board.

I aI would appreciate it if those who express paranoia
study the words before attempting to articulate their point of view.

Bruce

Archive · #10 09-30-2005, 09:26 PM

Posted By: Young & Rubicam

If you worked for a PR company, and you used your presentation:
You would have been FIRED on the spot.
And - you still wouldn't get it.

But - go on with your story.

Joe P.

Archive · #11 10-01-2005, 01:46 AM

Posted By: bruce dorskind

Joe, baby...

I don't think so..

Remember this old proverb,

"You are what you pretend to be, so be careful
what you pretend to be."

Archive · #12 10-01-2005, 02:09 AM

Posted By: RC McKenzie

otherwise it's another book about baseball cards, not that there's anything wrong with that.

I was only offended about the part where Bruce cited his appearence in the book.. I want to read about Captain Ahab, not Bruce Dorkhind and his baseball cards... ). JK

Archive · #13 10-01-2005, 02:13 AM

Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

You know, usually I just sit back and watch the crude stuff roll but in this case I'm going to comment.

Bruce, that was nice of you to edit that last post. I just happened to catch it's original content and I think your choice to edit the post was a good move. I can't believe you posted what you did the first time but I figure you must have a little character since you removed the original content and replaced it with what you did.

Oh, by the way, for the umpteenth time, thanks for mailing the article you said you would mail to me (on a couple of occassions). You're last email to me was rather entertaining. I posted a similar comment in a previous thread and you quickly emailed me and told me that if you (or your staff) mailed it to me that you would expect an apology on this forum. Here's my apology in advance and don't bother sending the article - I think I can live without it. By the way, it would have really made my day if you would have sent it.

Best to you and yours (and from the edited post it sounds like you have a lot of "yours"),

Fred

Archive · #14 10-01-2005, 02:52 AM

Posted By: WasThatYourBest?

Anyone that knows me - knows that.

OTOH, Pretention appears to be your principality, and you wear the clothes well.

But please go on with your story.

Joe P.

Archive · #15 10-01-2005, 11:06 AM

Posted By: Michael Campbell

One final thought on this book, very little of it deals with cards. Uniforms, bats, programs. unique items. Original photos. Very interesting. Maybe 5 to 10 percent deals with cards. if that.

I was sitting out on my deck reading it, this morning in the warm sun. Fabulous combination. My wonderful wife even thinks it's great. "Nuff said". Check it out. You won't be sorry.

Archive · #16 10-01-2005, 11:23 AM

Posted By: MadisonAvenue

"My wonderful wife even thinks it's great. "Nuff said". Check it out. You won't be sorry."
*
*
Madison Avenue would buy that.

You're HIRED!

The other guy is FIRED!

Archive · #17 10-01-2005, 01:29 PM

Posted By: David Rosenberg

I listed it with a starting bid of $50. However, if someone from this board would like to trade for the book, I would be happy to make a deal. Also, if you desire to bid, I would include FREE shipping. Originally, this book cost me around $100 but willing to sell for less, since I have enjoyed it immensely. This book helped me out, before making substantial vintage card purchases.

Thank you Frank Slocum!

Regards,

David Rosenberg

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4579581962

Archive · #18 10-01-2005, 08:53 PM

Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

David,

This thread is about a different book that just came out. The one you have is great though and I highly recommend it to anyone who does not have a copy.

Greg

Archive · #19 10-02-2005, 01:07 AM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Bruce wrote: "I certainly had no intention to insult the wealthiest collectors"

What am I missing here? I'm looking for the sarcasm, but I'm not finding it.

Uh, Bruce, not sure if you intended it this way in your initial post, but your mention came across as critical of lower income collectors who are driven, in your opinion, by envy, outspokenness and lack of education to deride their wealthier collecting counterparts.

That's an offensive statement, and frankly, makes you look like an Alan Rosen-esque schmuck. (leon, can I say "schmuck"? If not, my apologies.)

If that's not what you intended to say, or you genuinely didn't get the insensitive and boorish nature of your comment, now would be a great time to clarify. Otherwise you've just needlessly blowtorched a lot of good will around here.

And please feel free to check my grammar for me. (Like most on the board, I suspect, I likely did not pay as close attention in my high school English class as you.)

Archive · #20 10-02-2005, 05:45 AM

Posted By: barrysloate

To shift this thread to a more positive note, last night Stephen Wong had a celebratory dinner for the book in Chinatown in NYC (just 10 minutes from my house if you're not sitting in Saturday night traffic). Since I wrote an article for it, I was honored to be invited. The food was flowing, everyone had a great time, I got to meet many of the collectors profiled in the book, and even got to do some signings. I implore everyone to treat yourself to this wonderful eye-popping volume. Even though baseball cards aren't the main focus, it's well worth it and I promise you will enjoy it.

Archive · #21 10-02-2005, 06:42 AM

Posted By: identify7

To shift this thread back to the statements of its initiator: "grammatical errors that permeate so many of the
comments that I see in the hobby press and on the Board".

Interesting tactic Bruce Dorskind. A continuation of insulting comments. Initially addressed to the vague "envious, outspoken and under-educated" now specifically addressed to the participants of this board.

I offer no suggestion Bruce Dorskind, I simply laugh at your folly. Please O - wise - one continue to entertain us.

Archive · #22 10-02-2005, 09:20 AM

Posted By: Daniel Bretta

Well, I must admit that when I read Bruce's statement the only name that came to mind was some guy from Iowa, and I seem to remember a whole lot of folks on this board chiding the owner of Iowa's best card collection for in fact exhibiting all of the characteristics that Bruce described. I certainly didn't find it insulting to anyone still posting here.

Archive · #23 10-02-2005, 11:20 AM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Edited to remove Bruce's offensive e-mail. If Bruce wants to refer to the posters on this board as a cadre of illiterate schmucks, then it's probably best to let his public statements speak for themselves and not sink to his level.

Archive · #24 10-02-2005, 11:24 AM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Daniel: See Bruce's reply. Apparently he meant to insult far more posters than some guy from Iowa.

Archive · #25 10-02-2005, 11:28 AM

Posted By: Jay Miller

Aaron--I see no threat in Bruce's email to you; just a request to keep it between him and yourself. I think if he wanted to post the message on the board he would have done so. Your posting of the email is wrong and, whether I agree or disagree with Bruce's points (I actually agree with most), this email should be deleted from the thread.

Archive · #26 10-02-2005, 11:34 AM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Hey, Jay.

Here's the threat: "Please note any violation of this will be treated accordingly." It's the last sentence of his e-mail.

Frankly I don't appreciate being insulted and threatened--especially when my original post was a very civil attempt to give him a way out of the hole he dug for himself.

Archive · #27 10-02-2005, 11:40 AM

Posted By: Bryan

This forum is for discussing vintage cards, not for back and forth bickering. Take it somewhere else. This forum is starting to sound like the game used forum (which is now basically dead because people got tired of the relentless bickering.)

This forum used to be a great source of info but recently has turned into a great source of annoyance.

Archive · #28 10-02-2005, 11:50 AM

Posted By: barry arnold

I,too, wonder when the ad hominem will cease.

Or at least, subside.

Generally, it is such a wonderfully wise place to be.

Barry

Archive · #29 10-02-2005, 12:05 PM

Posted By: Julie Vognar

was couched in such ambiguous diction that I wasn't sure I, or anyone else, was supposed to feel insulted. It seemed to me he was saying that the editor of the book he was praising, according to him, included NO DISCUSSION OF the..various categories of people, the listing of which we've all taken offence at.

Boy, I sure hope that makes sense...

Archive · #30 10-02-2005, 12:18 PM

Posted By: leon

Did I just say I agree with Julie? Wow....anyway, I too, was a little confused (as normally confused about stuff) with what Bruce first wrote. On the surface it did look like a slam against someone....or someone(s), just not sure who. It was such a great start in that first part of the post then it took a sudden left turn instead of continuing to go straight. If Bruce meant nothing by it then I will publicly apologize. It's kind of hard to tell exactly what those words were referring too. I guess it was referring to me? Heck, I don't know. I don't take any of what Bruce says as threatening....even in the personal emails, which will never be allowed to be posted on this forum. As far as the recent bickering on the board I agree...but am not going to stop it until it gets overdone, imo. So far it hasn't been....but that's my opinion and I know others would agree and disagree....regards...

Archive · #31 10-02-2005, 12:31 PM

Posted By: Julie Vognar

think Bruce was trying to insult ANYBODY, or refer to ANYBODY--he was just saying what the book DIDN'T take pokes at.

Leon, you have some quarrels to pick with me? Last time I counted, you were saying you thought the Peck and Snyders were cards...like I did.

Archive · #32 10-02-2005, 12:36 PM

Posted By: Daniel Bretta

Am I the only one that sees his statement as a blast against the Adam Moraine type of posters? That is exactly how it reads.

Archive · #33 10-02-2005, 12:47 PM

Posted By: leon

I have nothing against you and knew after I made the comment you would take it that way. Honestly sometimes you write things that I have no clue where they came from...and that was the reference.....Sorry about that.....I am sure some folks feel the same way about me too....'tis no biggie...it takes all kinds and I generally enjoy your posts....regards

edited to say that I am sure the book is great but doesn't sound like it has a lot of cards in it, relative to other things

Archive · #34 10-02-2005, 01:45 PM

Posted By: barrysloate

It's not a card book, although the Just So Young is pictured, but it is so beautiful that it's well worth $20. Admittedly the article Corey and I wrote about collecting 19th century is for the beginner, but you can have fun just looking at the pictures.

Archive · #35 10-02-2005, 02:02 PM

Posted By: ToSlamOrNotToSlam

When the unsophisticated PR pretender PSA 10+++ took the left turn, as feeble as it was, it was meant to be a slam.
Make no mistake about it, it was labeled, "To whom it may Concern."
Where I come from, he would have been eaten alive verbally in person.
It's gratifying to see that many saw it for what it was meant to be, and didn't turn the other cheek and go into denial.
The PR for this book was so badly undermined, that Mr Rosenberg wasn't clear on which book was being shilled.

Mr. Bruce D, about your PR application?

Don't call us!

We'll Call You!

Archive · #36 10-02-2005, 02:31 PM

Posted By: Ken Eccles

It's will never happen from me.As to the Book, I hope it turns out to be a Keepsake in History

Archive · #37 10-02-2005, 02:46 PM

Posted By: barrysloate

I'm trying to keep this thread on topic and express what a nice book it is and I feel like I am talking to a wall. Is this thread about Steve's book or are we having an intervention?

Archive · #38 10-02-2005, 03:39 PM

Posted By: Ken Eccles

As to the Book, I do plan on getting it to add to our collection, especially since it contents are more than just a few Baseball collections. But since this posting was made by Bruce and then his comments, I felt it never to necessary to support the poor and uneducated group of us here. I'm sure the book is Great, and I still learn something new about our past everyday, plus love History. As to any of these posting,Im sure they have no bearing as to the Book or Author, plus I'm glad to see him doing another one in a different area. Thanks Ken

Archive · #39 10-02-2005, 03:40 PM

Posted By: ToSlamOrNotToSlam

"I'm trying to keep this thread on topic and express what a nice book it is and I feel like I am talking to a wall. Is this thread about Steve's book or are we having an intervention?"
*
*
What price Hypocrisy?

For someone that has made it a practice of pirating, and Shanghaiing other threads with your TV trivia, I would put down that stone if I were you.

Are you fighting for this thread because you and the PR wannabee are in the book for beginners with pretty pictures?

If I recall correctly, once you hook yourself into your trivia, the thread never goes back to it's original topic.

What price Glory?

Archive · #40 10-02-2005, 04:04 PM

Posted By: Greg Ecklund

Eye hav this book, butt amm having a hard tyme reeding it - eye kneed Bruce to tel me wut sum of tha wordz meen.

Archive · #41 10-02-2005, 04:14 PM

Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Hoping not to upset Barry too much but does anyone know why Bruce posts here or even reads the board given his disdain for most of the members and overwhelming grammatical errors contained in posts?

Archive · #42 10-02-2005, 04:19 PM

Posted By: R.D.Cook

Yeeha!!!

My vote goes to the novice & illiterate collectors party.
I'm not paying retail for this book or anything that comes from a collectors supremacist group...
Will wait for a cheap used copy on eBay... the novice and illiterate way.

Archive · #43 10-02-2005, 04:19 PM

Posted By: barrysloate

Joe-Please don't say you are starting up with me again. It was so nice when you left the board on a self-appointed exile for a few months. Now you are back offering your cryptic posts that only you understand and you are actually back attacking me. Did you run out of your medication, or did you get just get bored?

Archive · #44 10-02-2005, 04:27 PM

Posted By: barrysloate

You don't have to pay retail for the book- it's already discounted on Amazon.

Archive · #45 10-02-2005, 05:59 PM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Grag, no neede bruce help wordz for you/ you make talk goode. me lern reid an rite good two. Bari, me like book picyures bigg goood.

Archive · #46 10-02-2005, 06:19 PM

Posted By: Aaron M.

Actually Barry, I purchased the book via Amazon and when shipping charges are factored in, the discount is nominal if buying it retail at your local book store.

I have to say while certain sections of the book were well done, the book fails miserably in actually taking you into the context of these great collections or profiling the individual collectors.

Marshall Fogel is a perfect example. The book briefly describes what one can only imagine is his magnificent display room, yet we are never shown a single photo of it (or Marshall). The entire article then read like a typical auction catalog describing various individual items in detail, but mentioning only a single tidbit of Marshall himself--12 pages into his 13 page chapter--or his collecting stories (he bought 1953 Topps packs as a kid).

The wasted space Stephen took up with his Giulilo Camillio story (which read like the irrelevant opening paragraphs of a flowery Mastro auction item description) was more than what was spent on Marshall himself.

The book basically is a nice auction catalog for memorabilia collectors (not for card collectors who won't find enough to interest themselves). It reminded me very much of the catalogs Lelands used to publish in the 1990's with a few neat photos of a few carefully arranged items grouped together. (But still, unfortunately, better than any other memorabilia book out there.)

I already have a collection of auction catalogs. What I would have preferred is a in-depth look at the collectors and how they shaped and display or store their collections. Without that the book resembles too much souvenir books from the Baseball Hall of Fame and the Baseball as America exhibit. Otherwise, thanks to Stephen for his efforts.

Archive · #47 10-02-2005, 06:37 PM

Posted By: barrysloate

Aaron- I think it's fair to say that some parts of the book are less interesting than others, and I think we each have areas of collecting that we prefer to read about. In my case, I think the first two chapters profiling the Corey Shanus and Mark Cooper collections transcend anything you will ever see in an auction catalog, because many of their pieces are one of a kind. Gary Cypres's collection is likewise monumental. I agree that some sections, especially those that feature T206 or 52 Topps don't really offer us anything we haven't seen before; and likewise not every bit of text may be to your liking. But at its best you will see many things that have never been published before and for me that is worth the price of the book. Nobody can like everything in it. Not trying to shill for Stephen, though I will say he worked himself to the bone these past two years and he is rightfully proud of his effort.

Archive · #48 10-02-2005, 07:44 PM

Posted By: SloatAlert

"Admittedly the article Corey and I wrote about collecting 19th century is for the beginner, but you can have fun just looking at the pictures."
*
*
Are you saying that the book is for beginners, and if you can't read, you will find pictures that will entertain you?

Those are your very own cryptic words.
If there is anyone attacking, it is YOU.
You're beginning to sound like our very own inhouse PR PSA 10+++.

Oh, and another thing Mr Sloat, if you're having trouble recollecting your cryptic TV trivia piracy, I might just be able to help you there also. - My advice - Don't press it.

Archive · #49 10-02-2005, 07:46 PM

Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

I had placed an order for the book on Amazon but I just cancelled it. Sounds like there maybe too much text for me and not enough pretty pictures. Actually as someone who does not care about anything but vintage cards in this hobby, I am not sure I would really appreciate the book.

Archive · #50 10-03-2005, 04:56 AM

Posted By: barrysloate

Joe- I don't want to do this anymore and I will no longer respond to your posts.

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