My two-cents on "The Card"...boy did I enjoy it

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Posted By: Joe

Just finished reading “The Card.” Took me a few hours to read…couldn’t put it down. There have been some fine books written about the sports collectibles industry, namely Pete Williams’s “Card Sharks” and the incredibly under-appreciated “Operation Bullpen” by Kevin Nelson. But Michael O’Keeffe And Teri Thompson’s book has the potential to do to baseball cards what “Game of Shadows” has done to the steroids “hobby.” The reason for this is twofold, first: noted and respected authors as well as major league publisher, and secondly, like Barry Bonds in “Shadows,” we have a real-life villain in “The Card” in William Mastro.

I realize that some readers of this forum will take issue with some of the inaccuracies in this book—and there are a number of those--but you need to understand that this book is not written for you. Publishers would starve (and many are today) if they produced books for niche fields like us. Readers of this forum (which, by the way, makes a couple of appearances in the book) all know the story of the Gretzky T206 Wagner. Using this card as an example, this book is an attempt by two investigative journalists to expose fraud in a small but sexy industry. And they have kicked ass.

It’s basically a book about card doctoring, a practice—like steroids—everybody knew was going on but few did anything about—because everybody (including all the owners of “The Card”) was profiting from it. And while the authors essentially put the scalpel in Mastro’s hand, they could have been even harsher in their indictment of the industry titan. In fact, I thought they were more than fair in their accusations. For instance, they could have addressed the question of what has become of all the “restored” cards Mastro Vice President Ron Oser was selling 15 or so years ago. Nor did they speculate about Mastro’s reasons for changing his employment status at the auction house.


I loved this book. There’s a lot here, but I wanted more. We’ll all want more. Sadly, in the end, this really IS a book for us, because the problems of baseball card collectors amount to a hill of beans when it comes to fraud in American industry. But at least we can boo with a bit more confidence when Bill Mastro steps up to the plate.

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Posted By: leon

There are so many inaccuracies in it I am not sure we can tell anything....Sort of like saying many things outragously incorrect and then saying ....but everything is true, really......The author got his point across but so much of the info was wrong it is pointless...My wife thought it was a good read, as she is an English major (the writing was so so to her, like a newspaper guy wrote it) but she was unknowing of all of the things that were blatantly inaccurate and enjoyed it. It should do well with people that are ignorant of the hobby.....regards

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Posted By: ScottIngold

What i don't understand is. Why all the questionable activity by one of the hobby's biggest players ?

I have yet to read the book . But from the above post it seems that Mastro's ethics are being questioned yet again.

Usually where there's smoke.........

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Posted By: Dave G

So what were the major inaccuracies?

Can you give us a synopsis?

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Posted By: Joe

Here are a few, from a previous post by MARK. I suspect there will be dozens more as everyone reads the book. But again, remember, Upton Sinclair was not an expert on meatpacking:

....I have already found several errors that will really irritate vintage card collectors. At one point, they mention that three players in the T206 set were in the first class of the Hall of Fame - Wagner, Cobb and Johnson. Matty was left out. However, later on, they made it up to Matty by including him in the T204 set! Not only that, there are also, apparently, in existence T204 cards of Cobb, Young and Lajoie. What a scoop! You Ramly collectors have four more cards to find than you thought.


My favorite part, so far, is when they refer to Alan Rosen as the hobby's first celebrity. Whatever.

Oh, as a T3 collector, I have to throw this in. On page 40, it is stated that the cards were redeemed for coupons. I'm pretty sure it was the other way around.

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Posted By: leon

Joe has hit on some of them. In all honesty I am only half finished with the book. Also, no doubt, there is some truth in there....but so far nothing I haven't heard before. Through all of it, if I had to make an educated guess from everything I have seen and heard....I would say the card was cut from a sheet and then cut again after that.....That's my opinion at this time.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

The fact that the authors mistakenly thought that Matty was contained in the T204 set is not exactly the sort of mistake that would cause me to question allegations of fraud by Bill Mastro -- though can you imagine how cool that Matty card would look? I'd love to hear Mastro's response to the allegations.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I've not received my book yet...


What I'd like to see is an errata list. One that is succinct, without soapboxing.

It would list the page number, then what is said in the book, then what would be correct.


"We" could do that, guys.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I'll say it for the millionth time I guess....why would anyone believe a word of O'Keeffe after he blatently misrepresented what was said in Net54 about the two guys with the fake Wagner? Gosh! Don't you guys remember how most of us thought race played a role in that fiasco????

He's a tabloid trash writer who can't be bothered to check his facts. You guys are giving that low life your hard earned dollars???

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Posted By: Steve Murray

I agree wholeheartedly with Dan on this one. (Not to imply that I have ever disagreed with him on anything else )

Those of you who have spent money for the book and don't plan on making it a permanent part of your collection you should put it on the BST once you are finished. In this way we may minimize the rewards to the author.

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Posted By: RIch Klein

And does not want to keep it; I'll be happy to pay whatever you think is fair plus a shipping cost. It would be another nice addition for my hobby library collection.

Rich

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Posted By: leon

I definitely would NOT BUY this book....I got it for free from a board member and it's an unedited copy...I don't think any of the info changed but they had some poor grammar and misspelled words....I haven't mentioned those things on purpose as it is unedited. Once I am finished I will ask the person who sent it to me if he wants it back..and if not I will send it to another board member.....Once I saw all of the mistakes I quit reading it but I really should finish it. BTW, I am not taking up for anyone either....I definitely think there is a lot that is known that is still not being told.....by the insiders.....

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Posted By: Scott Elkins

Joe, I was "caught" by your statement of the restored cards Ron Oser sold years ago. I always loved the old Ron Oser auctions before he joined Mastro and have several of the old catalogs. It sounds like you are saying that Mastro was able to get a lot of these restored cards sold by Oser years ago into graded holders as unaltered and to keep Oser from saying anything about it, he is now VP at Mastro Inc. Anyway, just wondering if you had any specific examples of these restored cards? I was wondering b/c I have a bunch of old Ron Oser Enterprises catalogs and would love to compare images of the restored cards to some in holders being auctioned now. This would be rather easily done - to catch these restored cards in holders showing them as unaltered now. On my website, I have been able to post a few pics of before and after pics of cards sold by some auction houses and would love to be able to find some more. It is amazing how many of these are out there. However, I am certain some people simply don't want to know. However, this does need to be exposed, as it is nothing more than outright fraud! Thanks in advance Joe for any answers!

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Posted By: Jay

If you are around this hobby long enough you will hear horror stories about all of the major players, even those who are now being canonized. My feeling is that you can only judge from experience, not from one guy trying to denegrate another. My experience with Bill Mastro has only been positive. I consider him to be a good guy, someone who has helped build the hobby to where it is today, and, most importantly to me,a friend.

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Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

I've only seen bits and pieces of the book so far. Can I assume that Rob Lifson is the good guy in the book or is there somebody else.

Peter

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Posted By: Tom Boblitt

I kinda look at auction houses like the Chinese Buffet around the corner.....if you could see what goes on in the back room, you'd probably get sick. On the surface though it's pretty good and I always go back for seconds........

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Posted By: barrysloate

I only work out of one room...does that give me a free pass?

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Posted By: peter chao

Come on, how are you going to make back room deals if you only have one room.

Peter

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Posted By: Cobby33

Thanks for spoiling, in advance, my Chinese dinner.

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Posted By: leon

The back room deals are in the back of the one room....

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Posted By: peter chao

Can you imagine Kramer being pulled into the back of Barry's room...he'd be yelling and complaining that he couldn't make the deal because it wasn't really the back room...

Peter

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Posted By: Cat

I thought all of Barry's back room deals were done by phone? edited to add:

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Posted By: barrysloate

Cat- you're not Sparky, are you?

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Posted By: Cat

Barry, I wish I would have watched more Seinfeld, but I have probably seen about six episodes. Unfortunately, I am lost with the Sparky reference. Hopefully my attempt at humor was interpretted the correct way.... a reference to your phone auctions.

"Barry Sloate Auctions: Where You Never Have Bandwidth Issues"

Looking forward to your next one with great anticipation since I have already heard about a couple of key cards that you are going to have in your auction.

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Posted By: Steve Murray

Other than the nice e90-1 Jackson what else might be of interest? If you tell I can spend the weekend planning my strategy.

Everyone please have a safe holiday weekend.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Hi Cat- that Sparky cretin posts anonymously and criticizes me for being old fashioned because I still conduct telephone auctions. So when you mentioned the phone in your post, that was the reference.

And Seinfeld reruns will be aired forever so you can always catch up. Arguably, there are better ways to spend your time than watching TV.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Is it proper etiquette to discuss my auction on somebody else's thread?

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Posted By: Steve Murray

when asked.

Edit: I think that once twelve continuous posts to a thread are O/T to the main point of the thread that all is fair game.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Then I will be brief, and if Leon feels it is inappropriate, he has my permission to promptly delete it:

I have the bulk of Hal's fine collection of Hall of Fame rookie cards, including T204 Johnson and many other scarce ones. Plus, some very exotic T206 front/ back combinations, and some high grade cards from the 30's, again almost all rookies. And just to be different, instead of saying "...and much, much more..." I will say "and that's pretty much it." I will go into more detail when it's more appropriate and closer to the opening.

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Posted By: peter chao

Barry, looks like real good stuff...

Peter

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Posted By: Joe

Scott:

I in no way meant to imply anything untoward about Ron Oser's position at Mastro...I've no idea where that came from, perhaps I'm a lousy writer. I was just writing a review of a book about card doctoring. The villain of the book is William Mastro and as I was writing I remembered traipsing through the aisles of Fort Washington years ago and seeing these "restored" cards being sold by, as I recall, Ron Oser, who happens to be with Mastro these days. I was just wondering what has become of those cards. After I posted, I did a few minutes of looking and see that some cards ARE being sold as altered on eBay and elsewhere. But it's not a stretch to think that the "restored" tag has vanished from more than a couple of these cards.

Peter:

Yes, Lifson is absolutely the good guy and clearly the meal ticket source for the authors. The split between Mastro and Lifson is given short shrift in the book...unless you read very closely between the lines.

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Posted By: leon

The book portrays the whole hobby in a bad light. I am not defending Bill Mastro, or Rob Lifson, for that matter. The book sheds no new light on anything, is sensationalism at its worst, and is a piece of crap in my opinion. I hope O'keefe doesn't sell any of them.... The publisher should look to acquire the National Enquirer (supermarket tabloid published by American Media Inc) as there is more truth in it than this work O'keefe has put together...and "work" is a stretch in it's own right. I WOULD NEVER WASTE ONE PENNY on this piece of crap....I will get through with my FREE unedited copy and pass it along to the next person that doesn't want to waste their money on tabloid trash......All he does is embellish rumors like many of the people he used in getting his misinformation.....I love this board.....warm regards


edited to correct "it's" ...thanks Barry...I am sure it would have ruined the whole flavor of my thoughts....

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Posted By: barrysloate

Its

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Barry, when will you have a preview up? I am dying for an auction, seriously.

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Posted By: barrysloate

June 6 or 7. I suppose I could get it up sooner. Do you think that's a good idea? (not today, I mean a few days earlier than I planned).

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

I always feel the earlier the better as it will ensure that the maximum amount of people will be exposed to the items prior to the auction.

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Posted By: peter chao

Leon, Barry,

I know you both hate this book and think it's tabloid trash, but the unfortunate part of this is that tabloid trash sells well. Personally, I'll probably just look through it quickly in the book store and pass on purchasing it.

What's ironic about all this is that the Gretzky T-206 Wagner may become even more desireable of a card. After all it's probably the only card that has an entire book written about it.

Peter

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Posted By: barrysloate

Peter- where did I say I hate the book? I haven't even seen it or read it yet.

Jeff- maybe I will launch it earlier but it's still too soon.

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Posted By: Peter Spaeth

Once again, it must have been in the penumbras of your prior posts. It's (not its) deja vu all over again, Peter C. Why do you insist on misquoting Barry?

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Posted By: peter chao

Your right, Barry, Peter S., man...I read through these threads way too quickly at times. Thanks for correcting me.

Peter

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Posted By: barrysloate

Peter- you're an attorney. I expect you to read your legal documents more carefully than that!

And it's "you're right", not "your right". Come on Peter, get with the program!!

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Posted By: Peter Spaeth

For the hundreth time, by the way, "Your right" is not correct usage. It's "You're right." Sheesh.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Geez, I wonder how many lurkers are afraid to post because they might get slammed for poor grammar?

As long as you get the gist of the post what is the big deal?

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Posted By: Cat

Leon:

If no one is in line to receive your free copy after you finish reading it, I'll take it, read it, and then pass it on. I wouldn't even bother spending the money to ship it. I'll see you at the National if you still have it at that time.

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Posted By: peter chao

I'm starting to believe I can say almost anything I want on this Board but I better not make a grammatical error.

Peter

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Posted By: barrysloate

Doesn't everybody take pride in constructing grammatically correct sentences? Okay, I admit I can be a pain in the butt, but it's my training. I taught English composition at college, and old habits die hard.

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Posted By: Zinn

I doubt if there are many, if any.

The deal with Peter C. is that he's intelligent enough to know better AND he has been reminded many, many times.

As with Barry it annoys the heck out of me when I see the misuse of your or you're. Same with their and there. Same with its and it's. Same with too and to.

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Posted By: Peter Spaeth

Your right. Its an outrage. Good grammer is definately desireable.

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Posted By: barrysloate

How about "has" and "hs?"

And Peter S. got nearly every word wrong. That too is a talent.

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Posted By: Zinn

Smarty pants