Saturday's Trade Deadline - The hobby lives!!

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Posted By: Dennis

My son (the one in red) and some other "General Managers" conducting business on a beautiful Saturday afternoon, which coincidentally enough was the MLB trade deadline. I couldn't help but listen in on these 16 year-olds as they negotiated their deals. I do know that there was at least one "blockbuster" deal involving game-used cards.



This scene brought back memories of my trading days as a kid. I'd jump on my bike, with my cards bound tightly by a rubber band and placed securely in my back pocket, and head to my buddies house. I'd usually write my initials in ink on the bottom border of the cards to make sure everyone knew they were mine. I still have some of those with the "DW" neatly written on them.

Just thought a nice photo depicting todays generation of collectors would be a nice offset to some of the negatives we face in our hobby today.

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Posted By: tbob

to see kids acting like kids and not pseudo gangbangers or punks. It made me relive those happy times from my youth when we used to drag out our shoeboxes full of cards and make trades, not based on what a card was worth monetarily, but based on favorite teams or players or "need him's."
Thanks for the great story and picture.

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Posted By: hankron

I live in a big city, and, from personal daily experience, have a positive impression of kids today. No matter how they dress or what section of the city your are in, most kids and teenagers are polite and nice and worth listening to ... There's a difference between watching cable news and actually meeting people

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Posted By: steve k

Very nice post Dennis. Great to see your son and his friends enjoying their baseball cards. That's what it's all about.

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Posted By: tbob

I live in a big city, and, from personal daily experience, have a positive impression of kids today. No matter how they dress or what section of the city your are in, most kids and teenagers are polite and nice and worth listening to ... There's a difference between watching cable news and actually meeting people>

Not sure if this comment was directed at my post or not, but having seen a huge rise in the number of kids as young as 12 using drugs (particularly methamphetamine), bringing fireams to school and resorting to violence, I'd say there's a helluva lot bigger problem out there than you think. I see these problems every day in my job and can only worry about the future for the other young people, most of whom ARE good kids, who have to deal with them. And no I don't watch cable news, I meet young people every day of the week and community activities.

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Posted By: hankron

I was only speaking from my personal interaction and was putting aside larger societal issues ... In general, I find most in person acquaintences, young or old, to be nice. Just my personal experience.

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Posted By: Rob L

Aah, the memories. Thanks Dennis.

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Posted By: leon

Yesterday I met some half sister relatives I never knew I had. One of the half sisters (no she is not half male, you know what I mean) has 2 kids. One is 12 and one is 13. They both acted like brats. The key to good kids is good parenting.....and, with the work I do at the Salvation Army, I can tell you that is the biggest problem in our society (again, imo); "bad parenting". .. Great pics of the kids swapping cards. Thanks.....we needed that....best regards.....ps ..and I know some good parents end up with brats but "in general" is what I am talking about...

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Posted By: Gary B.

One of my strongest childhood memories was with a kid I had just met, and he offered to sell me this huge group of cards for $6.00. I was very excited, and it took me a little while of saving allowances to come up with the bread. Later on when I finally did buy them from him, it seemed to me to be a LOT less cards than we originally agreed on, but he insisted it was the same grouping, so i went ahead with it anyway, always feeling like I got ripped off somehow. Only 8 or 9 years old, but it was my first time getting scammed! God knows that kid is probably on ebay today ripping people off for thousands...

Believe it or not - true story!

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

collecting and trading cards, reminded me of a particular fault of my own: whenever I see people handling modern cards, I get so uppity and look down on them--whatever their age--for not collecting vintage stuff! That is SO ridiculous. "What do we first covet?" "What surrounds us every day." You have to get into baseball and its players before you get into the history of the game, and the cards that go with that history.

Great picture!

"And some walk in darkness and others walk in light, and we see those in the light, but those in darkness, we don't see."--Bert Brecht, "Mack the Knife," The Threepenny Opera

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Posted By: Max Weder

Julie makes an excellent point about young collectors. I have often referred to this as the Rule of 12--our collecting interests as adults will be largely driven by what we collected when we were 12 years old.

This can explain the major market interest in Mickey Mantle by those collectors who are in their prime spending period. It may also explain my lack of interest in Mickey Mantle, as he had already retired by the time I hit 12. However, somehow I must have been the exception to the rule, as I harbour no interest in collecting the early 1970's--I blame my lack of interest resulting from me checking out from the library at that time Only the Ball Was White and Harold Seymour's first volume on the history of baseball, as well as spending many hours with Macmillan's The Baseball Encyclopedia, with its great references to past seasons and statistical leaders and its connection to baseball's past. Or maybe I just had an aversion to polyester.

Max

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

it's only when we get older that we develop an interest in the history of the game and its artifacts. That's--how we all got here!

In other words--I disagree with the "rule of 12"!


"And some walk in darkness and others walk in light, and we see those in the light, but those in darkness we don't see."--Bert Brecht, "Mack the Knife," The Threepenny Opera

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Posted By: Max Weder

Julie

I sit corrected as to the point of your post, and how a historical interest in collecting can be developed. (It's hard to read, being in the office on a glorious, sunny holiday in Vancouver, looking for any excuse not to finish work). However, I think the rule of 12 applies to the majority of collectors at large, but certainly not to the forum members. The point to determine is how many of us on the forum become so interested in cards and events which we cannot personally recollect.

[My only brechtian thought on this is that I played the role of Araki in the The Caucasian Chalk Circle. Another one of my recurring roles where all I was called on to do was to shout out lines in monotone.]

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Posted By: Dennis

for your inputs on this thread. Thanks for all of the compliments concerning the photo I posted. I especially agree with Julie concerning the fact that "kids gravitate to what surrounds them". I actually showed these kids some t205s and their response was luke warm at best. They don't know Walter Johnson from Magic Johnson or "Home Run" Baker from Dusty Baker. Neither did I when I was 16. The fact of the matter is that there is no one around that was alive when the great players depicted on the n172 OJs were playing. We've all ended up here, at the pre-war forum, because we've done just as Julie said. We were all drawn in by the magic of baseball that we experienced as kids and remained in as we learned more and more about the players and history of the game.

At the risk of sounding like James Earl Jones - there is something magical about the game of baseball. Something that only (to us) can be captured and relived by vintage baseball cards. To all modern day baseball card manufactures - "If you print it they will come" and it doesn't have to be super glossy or contain a chunk of Nomar's bat - it just has to true pure baseball.

Dennis

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

Bob's one line in "Woyczek" (Buechner)--"Hey, you have blood on your elbow." Night after night, "Hey, you have blood on your elbow." (Woyczek goes nuts because of his treatment in the army and his wife's infidelity, and kills her with an axe.)

Great discussion! (Don't mean the -laywrights).


"And some walk in darkness and others walk in light, and we see those in the light, but not those in darkness"--Bert Brecht, "Mack the Knife" Threepenny Opera

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Posted By: Max

...was the Marquis de Sade in the Marat/Sade, but don't tell the other forum members.

On the other hand, at 12, I gave up card collecting (when Julio Gotay is your favorite card, where can you go but down?) to concentrate on my baseball career. As is self-evident, thing perhaps would have turned out differently if I'd followed my coaches advice and opened my eyes when I batted.



I was a heavy hitting (.235 or so, no power, lots of walks, lots of Ks) star on a 1-19 team. I decided to grow 1/2 foot and play basketball the next year. However, I didn't abandon Fred Lieb and Harold Seymour.

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Posted By: Nickinvegas

I remember trading cards in my youth with my brother in-law. He was my sister's boyfriend at the time. Needless to say(now that I know better)the the trades were always very much in my favor.

Regarding the youth of today. As most of you know, I invested in a card shop a few years ago. I can tell you that the youth of today for the most part have little respect for anything that isn't on the "Billboard top 10" or that isn't brand spankin new! It is a rare site to see anyone younger than 25 come in and buy cards. Younger people will come seeking Magic,Yugi-Oh or what ever the flavor of the month is.

I preach to my kids the value of respecting all things that are old.

And yes, I tell them there are few things as beautiful as a baseball field under the lights. There is indeed something magical about the game of baseball...

Nick

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Posted By: Jeff S

...because I was 12 years old in 1992. And 1990-1992 has got to be just about the low point in card production. Lots of ugly cards, many new brands making ugly cards, some of these new brands starting to experiment with new-fangled inserts--which were ugly and worthless and uncollectible.

So I suggest the rule of negative 93. Works for me...

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Posted By: Julie

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Posted By: Jeff O

As someone who has had the pleasure of meeting Max on numerous occassions, I must say that the photo of the young Max is truly shocking! I'm disappointed... I would have expected hockey equipment.

And just so you all know I'm certainly not "throwing stones"... I wouldn't have the guts to put up a picture of myself as a 12-year-old!

Jeff
http://www.seattlehockey.net

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Posted By: Max Weder

Jeff

Consider how much better looking I seem because we always meet in the company of that third party, and both of us look grand in comparison (and I'll be sure to tell him that). While I played baseball at 12, it was basketball from 13 to 30, but two achilles tendon ruptures have made me a hockey player (less jumping in hockey). However, a picture of me in my hockey equipment at my current age is even more frightening than the 12 year old baseball photo.

And the ONLY card that my mother through away was my Bobby Orr rookie card--it is one card I would treasure finding, if only to gaze upon that youthful, scrubbed Bruin face again, and contemplate the wonder of my 12 year old artistic touch, having then added a goatee and glasses to Mr. Orr's card, as he was a member of the then despised Boston Bruins. Pro 7 perhaps but as Master Card says, priceless. Do others have similarly decorated cards from their youth (hopefully baseball)?

Max

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

It sure is good to see younger persons involved with sports cards. If faced with the current card market right now, I wouldn't know what to collect.

Back in the days there were less choices. And the rule of 12 applied to me. I was, and am, interested in the performances of all baseball players. Although when younger (and actually until the '70s) it was not apparent to me how to purchase cards of old ballplayers. But that sure did not prevent me from reading about them and constantly reviewing their statistics.

When Lipset started with his auctions - I spent a lot of time with his offerings, his newsletter and the annual Beckett. But too quickly, Beckett stopped listing their idea of the prices of older cards. Then the internet came (from heaven, I guess) and now I can buy anything, almost. Although it is not always real.

So here we are. How do we foster the continued involvement of youngsters with the hobby, and recruit new members? It is the current pre-teens who will support the card prices which we currently "enjoy".

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Posted By: Ben

The 66-67 Orr rc was also a dream card of mine as a kid, and I was never lucky enough to own it. Julie wanted me to post a scan of her Orr painting (she's exceeded her capacity again!). So here it is:

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Posted By: The Other One

or it would have been here yesterday. thanks, ben! (er, ben administrator))

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Posted By: The Other One

.......

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Posted By: Bill Kasel

Bobby Orr and Bobby Hull were my hockey idols growing up (even though it was the early 80's). After 7 years of getting creamed against the boards I traded in my skates for basketball shoes. An amazing piece of artwork.

Bill

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Posted By: The Other One

I didn't paint it! It hangs in my bedroom. Ben meant Julie's (possessed) painting, not Julie painted it.
Check out haiyan.gallery on ebay for other fine work!

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Posted By: Max Weder

Now I can't even remember which thread to post to. Orr painting is on this thread, so why did I post Sawchuk painting on the other thread? GAH!