Clay Kershaw and Steiner

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Simon

For those of you who don't know that major star, Clay Kershaw, he has pitched a grand total of 9 2/3 innings in the major leagues in two games. He is a touted rookie pitcher who was a #1 draft choice.
He just signed an autograph deal with Steiner. Now the Steiner name is beyond reproach when it comes to authenticity and I commend them for that.
However, they are charging $99 for a Clay Kershaw autographed 8x10. Damn, what will happen when he has 50,75 or 100 innings pitched in the majors.
And considering how he looked last night against the Mets it might take him a while to achieve those innings numbers. Many, many Hall of Famers autographed photos are available in the market for $15-25. How can they charge $99 for a rookie with 9 2/3 innings experience?
----

I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
Unknown author
--
We made a promise. We swore we'd always remember.
No retreat baby, no surrender.
The Boss

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Kershaw has a pretty incredible curveball. That being said, I'll wait until his career ERA gets below 5 before I pay $100 for his autograph.

[Archive]

Posted By: DJ

I was thinking the exact same thing when I saw that a few days ago Richard. It's people buying on the potential and jumping on the bandwagon without using logic behind their purchase. Even if he turns out to be Johan Santana, it still won't be a $100 ball. Santana's signed baseballs aren't even $50 baseballs.

This is a company that is doing a signing with Big Brown's jockey, who is basically a $3 signature and they are charging three figure prices on the hype.

This is what Steiner does. Hey, at least the stuff is good unlike many companies that exist out there that profit on a lack of education. This is simply a different kind of lack of education. Did you see those Koufax prices? They start at like $900 and go to $1,100! But at least its real.

DJ

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

This is one of the main reasons I do not deal in modern garbage--all the speculation and stress is akin to playing the stockmarket. I'll take established greats from the game's past over this junk anyday. For every Derek Jeter there are 100 Ron Kittles.

Edit--For a typo that sounded too ebonic.

[Archive]

Posted By: Ejm1

Steiner is a crook.

[Archive]

Posted By: DD

Will they take 5 - $20 Shane Spencer rookies for one auto? I am sure the same newbs who purchased those also buy overpriced chazerai from Steiner.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Woolf

Jodi makes a great point in that contemporary sports being a speculative market. From a business standpoint I've always loved that aspect because I understand sports much better than I do the stock market, so I've been able to do pretty well with buying players when they are "cold" and selling when they are "hot".

From an investment standpoint, I would never recommend investing in contemporary autographs for the long haul. Even if Kershaw becomes the next Sandy Koufax, he's got decades ahead of him to sign tens of thousands of autographs. Thus, there will be an abundant supply of authentic autographs on him.

Kershaw does have an amazing pitch in his arsenal, but this hype seems eerily familiar to another prospect I remember from seasons past.

Anyone remember Brian Taylor? Beware!

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

Funny, I was thinking of using Brian Taylor in my example in place of Ron Kittle! Exactly.

Also, Jeff's point of the overabundance of modern-day players' signatures is well-taken. I would much rather handle an autograph like Jack Chesbro's. He's a popular HOFer whose signature is incredibly rare. He died ages ago, and, I recently discovered, HATED to sign autographs! You heard that here first. This tidbit has not been known to the collecting public until now. I'm sure it will interest quite a few of you. A friend of mine (who is a Net54 "lurker") wrote a letter to Chesbro's niece more than 50 years ago. She replied that her family no longer had any Happy Jack signatures left, and that he was not fond of signing while still alive. There's one mystery solved.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

Also, to expand a little on another of Jeff's thoughts, "...he has decades ahead of him to sign tens of thousands of autographs...". I'd like to add that, even if this Kershaw were to be struck by lightning (like Geremi Gonzalez last month) and die instantly, his autograph would still be plentiful for years to come. As many of you likely know, one area of collecting that has always fascinated me is that of players who passed away at the height of their careers. For example, take a guy like Herman Hill, who played in a handful of games over two seasons with the Twins, only to drown while swimming off the coast of Venezuela during the winter of his final MLB season. His autograph is exceedingly rare (I've encountered perhaps 7 or 8 examples over 22 years). If Hill was playing and passed away in this day and age, he would have already signed 500-1000+ minor league insert cards, another 100-1000 major league insert cards as well as a ton of other material. The point I'm trying to illustrate is that any modern-day autograph will NEVER have the opportunity to be "rare". There are too many entrepreneurs out there to let that happen.

[Archive]

Posted By: Max Weder

I wonder how much Brien Taylor's autograph is going for nowadays.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Woolf

I read a sad article about Taylor in S.I. about a year ago. He had blown through all of the money he made in baseball (about $2.5 mil) and was living out of a trailer in the southeast with his mother. I think they said he worked some type of manual labor construction.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

What's wrong with these athletes? I can understand some of these people thinking that their money will never run out. People like Michael Jordan can do whatever they want--they will never be destitute. Someone like Taylor, who knew full well that he would never pitch again, should have been much more careful. If just slightly frugal, he could have lived on $2.5 million for the rest of his life. I think that figure is too low. Think of all the endorsement deals he had at the time. I can recall one with Nike (if I'm not mistaken). You know that contract had to be worth a great deal of money.

[Archive]

Posted By: howard

I believe Brien Taylor lives with both of his parents in the house he built for them w/his bonus money.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Woolf

Jodi - He probably grossed about 10 mil or so, but you got to keep in mind that about 40-50% goes to the government, plus agents, plus business managers, etc., etc..

Howard - you might be right on those details. I just remember that they said that he was still driving this late 80s early 90s model Firebird that he bought in his peak. A car that is probably worth $2,500-$3,500 now.

I'm not being mean spirited in saying this, but I bet he could still make a couple of grand over a weekend if he showed up to some shows in the tri-state area and charged like $10 or $15 an autograph. In some respect, I think seeing him would evoke a lot of fond memories of the "hay day" of the sports memorabilia business for collectors.

[Archive]

Posted By: DJ

I think $10 Million is a little far fetched. His signing bonus at the time was a whopping $1.5 million and last known, he was laying brick. I'm also not sure you would want to put Brien Taylor whose fame comes at being basically worthless, on any premium Yankee items. When he was hot, I remember selling his Topps Gold signed insert card for $150 and getting multiple calls for more.

Like everything (especially Kershaw), attitudes change for these kids about signing once they realize that signing their name equals money. You think Kershaw will be happy to sign for free now? As a part time chaser (loser), I see it all the time, especially on the minor league level. Players (in the minors)like Phil Hughes telling people that he's not allowed to sign the sweet spot of balls because he had a deal with an autograph company and seeing Joba Chamberlain avoiding signers like we had the plague.

The day after Johnny Cueto pitched brilliantly, his stock rose and one ball sold for $50. They were about to put him in the Hall Of Fame it seemed. At 4-5, the hype has dimmed down. I also remember getting Ryan Anderson of the Mariners (the Space Needle, who would replace Randy Johnson) on two balls and selling them for $110. And then there was Drew Henson and Ruben Mateo and Alex Escobar and D'Angelo Jiminez and Juan Rivera and Chad Mottola and Bam Bam Meulens and so on and so on and so on. People who pay $90 for Kershaw when they could get an Aaron or Mays at that price simply needs to be drug tested.

DJ

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

OK, let's say that, after all bills had been paid, Taylor wound up with $3 million. If he had the proper foresight, he would have never had to work another day in his life. Drink a Budweiser instead of Crystal. Eat at Cracker Barrel as opposed to Morton's. Let the interest build up in your bank account and live off of that. Drop all the "people" that propel you to lose all your money through embezzlement and poor investment advice. There is no excuse for blowing that kind of cash in such a short period. My only wish is that an arrogant blowhard like Manny Ramirez will one day find himself cleaning toilets next to Spinks.

[Archive]

Posted By: Tom Hufford

Back to the topic at hand, yes, in my opinion $99 is a bit much for a signature of ANY active player on ANYTHING.

I haven't seen the photo being sold, but I have seen Kershaw's signature, and unless the photo has a caption with his name on it (or shows the back of his jersey, with his name on it), the buyer can look forward to showing his new prized purchase to his friends and being greeted with "Who is it?"

Regardless of the price being paid, is it really too much to expect that the promoter ask the celebrity/player signing to provide a legible signature?

214 players or managers made their major league debuts in 2007. I have autographs of 213 of them (I keep forgetting to write the other guy). I just went through them, and could make out a grand total of 7, without looking to see the name I'd penciled in on the back! I also have the autographs of all 70 of the 1933 rookies, and my wife can read them all (although she doesn't know who they are).

I understand that most players could care less if their signatures are recognizable, but just compare a recent team-signed ball with one signed even in the 1980's, and you'll wonder why there is any market at all for the recent autographs.

I know, I digress, I'm off the subject - I'm getting old.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

I'm in total agreement with the above. Oh, how Sharpies make me cringe!

And, as to your thoughts of a mass-produced illegible scrawl only serving to glorify one man's ego, I couldn't agree with you more!

[Archive]

Posted By: J Paul

Kershaw has a pretty incredible curveball.

Well Barry Zito has and incredible curveball too, but he seems to forgotten how to keep it in the ballpark.

[Archive]

Posted By: davidcycleback

Steiner has high prices on many things, so it's not that they haven't singled out this player. When Steiner was selling game used Yankees jerseys for the Yankees, many game used collectors were aghast at the prices. Evidently, there are Yankees fans out there who will pay these prices. In Steiner's defence, they have a strong reputation for offering authentic items.

If one is 'speculating' in prospects, it defeats the whole purpose to pay Hall of Famer money. Even if he becomes the next Tom Seaver, it defeats the investing purpose, considering Tom Seaver's autographed baseball sells for a lot less than $99.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jodi Birkholm

It's a given that Steiner takes a loss on many up-and-comers. They paid Melky Cabrera a nice chunk of change to sign a pile of shiny stuff, then were forced to wholesale the majorlity of it to various NYC-area dealers. I guess a company that big can always use a healthy write-off anyhow.

[Merv Williams]

This is only a guess on my part but why don't you send him a ball with the correct postage on the return package? I think he will sign it free of charge for you. Unless he signed a contract with Steiner.

[danc]

Wow Merv, way to bring up a thread that dates back to June. Honestly, I don't see why not. Players have white USPS boxes full of mail sitting by their locker and how they choose to approach it, depends on them. Many times, they let the clubhouse manager deal with it (throw away, send back items or include the dreaded 'I'm too busy letter" and pre-print) or an assistant of some sorts. But I know of people who have had success in sending balls and what do you have to lose? $12 for the ball and maybe $8 return shipping/supplies and since it's a ball, thye will probably send it back. I mean, the guy isn't Pujols. He's barely .500. Or you can go on eBay and shell down $40-50 for an authentic one. There is a Tri-Star signed ball in a Buy It Now for $45.

DanC

[BigMeek]

Wonder how people feel about him now🤔

[bjerome]

I bought my first Kershaw signed baseball using mail-in from Tristar following his 1st Cy Young Award when he did an appearance at the Tristar Houston Show. The autograph was $40.

[perezfan]

Even though he panned out and met/exceeded expectations, his signature is far too ugly for me to want it.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by perezfan

Even though he panned out and met/exceeded expectations, his signature is far too ugly for me to want it.

+1 Agreed

But wow what a career.

[egri]

Originally Posted by Archive

Posted By: DJ

Even if he turns out to be Johan Santana, it still won't be a $100 ball.

DJ

I understand being skeptical of current players until they have a proven track record, but wow, this aged poorly.

[GaryPassamonte]

I agree on the autograph. If I can't read it, it doesn't interest me. I do have this Kershaw gamer. It would be nice to have a legible autograph on it.

[perezfan]

What a beauty. You sure don’t see many of those!

But I would definitely leave it un-signed, haha.

[4reals]

Originally Posted by Archive

Posted By: DJ

It's people buying on the potential and jumping on the bandwagon without using logic behind their purchase. Even if he turns out to be Johan Santana, it still won't be a $100 ball.

DJ

I was diggin in the archives and came up on this thread and chuckled when I read this. Boy, time sure flies. Seems like yesterday when he first came up.

[jpop43]

Met him at the 2013 ASG...Kershaw is a genuinely good and decent guy...couldn't be happier for him and the success he's achieved over these many (and yes, unbelievable) years.

www.dugouttreasures.com

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by jpop43

Met him at the 2013 ASG...Kershaw is a genuinely good and decent guy...couldn't be happier for him and the success he's achieved over these many (and yes, unbelievable) years.

www.dugouttreasures.com

Great picture, Jonathan!

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by jpop43

Met him at the 2013 ASG...Kershaw is a genuinely good and decent guy...couldn't be happier for him and the success he's achieved over these many (and yes, unbelievable) years.

www.dugouttreasures.com

He is a good and decent guy…..but I still wouldn’t pay 100 bucks for his autograph. In fact, I wouldn’t pay one cent for the autograph of any stinkin’ Dodger!