1965 Topps High Series SPs

[Kevvyg1026]

Having reached a standstill on the search to establish the complete sheet for 1966 Series 7 cards, I decided to attempt the same for the 1965 Topps high numbers. This project should be considerably easier since one of the half sheets is known, meaning that the cards in each of the 7 distinct rows are well-established. So the "only" task is to establish the pattern Topps used on the 2nd half sheet.

The first half sheet is shown as one of the attachments. It has the pattern: A, B, C, D, E, A, F, G, B, C, D, E where row A is headed by Gaines (594), row B is headed by Downing (598), row C has Wyatt, row D Twins Rookies, row E Hiller, row F Smith, and row G Broglio.

I have found a number of miscuts which strongly suggest that the Downing row (row B) is at the top of the 2nd half sheet AND that row G is at the bottom of the 2nd sheet.

What I could use help with is to determine whether row C (Wyatt) is above the row A (Gaines) at some point. If it is, then the pattern on the 2nd half-sheet is most likely: B, C, A, F, G, B, C, D, E, A, F, G. This would mean that the SPs are those cards contained in rows D, E, F, & G.

Thus, I am looking for any miscuts that involve either the cards below: 590, 574, 546, 525, 584, 575, 595, 560, 561, 523, or 558

-or- the cards above: 594, 540, 541, 580, 532, 530, 530, 562, 567, 563, 564, or 588.

1965_series7.jpg

1965_7th_series_listing.JPG

1965_row_C_strip.jpg

[Kevvyg1026]

The green coloring in the spreadsheet I posted simply identifies the SPs that are commonly listed in price guides. As can be readily observed, the SPs do not always align with a specific row (i.e., 540, 560, & 580 are most likely not SPs but simply high demand cards, whereas 549 is most likely a SP).

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Kevvyg1026

The green coloring in the spreadsheet I posted simply identifies the SPs that are commonly listed in price guides. As can be readily observed, the SPs do not always align with a specific row (i.e., 540, 560, & 580 are most likely not SPs but simply high demand cards, whereas 549 is most likely a SP).

I think there's probably three or four abbreviations that might be helpful in these cases:

SP=cards that are truly short-printed, almost always from a full row
DP=cards that appear more than SP's over the press sheets (XP might also apply for "Xtra" Print)
PS=Production short print like the lower right corner where 549 sat
HD=High Demand cards once iD'd as SP's in the guides and old hobby pubs.

[Kevvyg1026]

The XP designation rather than DP designation does seem more appropriate for cards issued from 1959 to 1968. For example, the first series printings from many of those years contained 109 unique cards printed in ten unique rows across the 264 card sheet (24 rows of 11 cards each). The unique card number is 109 rather than 110 because the 1st checklist was printed in two different rows.

This printing meant that four rows were printed 3x each (12 rows) and 6 rows printed 2x each (12 rows). Sometimes, price guide refer to cards printed in the rows printed 3x as DP when, in fact, they are only 1.5x, e.g., Mantle in 1966.

Obviously, some of the earlier print runs (before 1958) may have contained the same card printed in different unique rows, so the DP designation could apply. Same thing goes for releases like the 1964 Topps Giants.

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Kevvyg1026

The XP designation rather than DP designation does seem more appropriate for cards issued from 1959 to 1968. For example, the first series printings from many of those years contained 109 unique cards printed in ten unique rows across the 264 card sheet (24 rows of 11 cards each). The unique card number is 109 rather than 110 because the 1st checklist was printed in two different rows.

This printing meant that four rows were printed 3x each (12 rows) and 6 rows printed 2x each (12 rows). Sometimes, price guide refer to cards printed in the rows printed 3x as DP when, in fact, they are only 1.5x, e.g., Mantle in 1966.

Obviously, some of the earlier print runs (before 1958) may have contained the same card printed in different unique rows, so the DP designation could apply. Same thing goes for releases like the 1964 Topps Giants.

EC for Extra Checklist? I do think the delineations matter in some ways, just never seen much beyond SP and DP over the years.

Agree DP and XP could mean two things, OP as well for Overprint like that row in 1967 that begat a zillion cards.

[Gorditadogg]

Miscut 65s are a lot harder to find than 66s or 67s. I went through a couple thousand commons, found one miscut side-to-side but nothing top-to-bottom.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by Gorditadogg

Miscut 65s are a lot harder to find than 66s or 67s. I went through a couple thousand commons, found one miscut side-to-side but nothing top-to-bottom.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

Up to 1965 the cards were cut from the sheets in Brooklyn. 1966 brought the move to Duryea and new personnel (and probably equipment).

[Kevvyg1026]

It is hard to find miscuts. I have found approx 20 on ebay for 1965 highs. But they usually confirm what I already knew I did find 4 or 5 from the downing row that had sheet markings though