Location of m101-4/5 Gimbels: Milwaukee

[nolemmings]

Until last night, I had not been able to determine with any degree of confidence the store location where m101-4/5 Gimbels cards were distributed. The department store had three major locations in 1916: Milwaukee, Philadelphia and New York City, yet the cards rank as somewhat difficult to find among the various m101 advertising backs. Now I have found ads in both the Milwaukee Journal and Milwaukee Sentinel Newspapers showing that these cards came from the Wisconsin store, the first (oldest) of the three major locations. The ads found thus far are not spectacular but provide enough information to show the cards were first available on April 15, 1916, and offered Saturdays in groups of twenty for ten weeks, with prior weeks’ offerings available if you missed them. I have not yet found ads for all ten weeks but it seems as though the bargain changed, with the first cards free, then being sold for 3 cents per group of twenty, then, at least in week seven, kids could obtain the entire 140 for the cost of a boy’s suit. The first series was offered free again in week two if you missed it, which is somewhat ironic since that series is now the most difficult to find. Curiously, the ad for series 8 notes that prior series were still available except for series 2(which had Cobb). Anyway, here is the first ad, appearing in the Journal on 4/14/1916.

This does not rule out the cards also being available in Philly or New York, as the ad on the card backs is quite non-specific, but given the size of those markets one might expect a larger population of Gimbels cards to exist than is presently known. At least we know that some came from Milwaukee. Sorry if this has been posted before--I don't recall seeing it. Please share if you have further information.

[shernan30]

Thanks for the research Todd!!

[Leon]

Hi Todd
Very good information on what was my first back-collecting set endeavor in the hobby. I wonder if the 3 types of Gimbels font could represent each of the locations? And we know there are degrees of difficulty with the variations, which could mean something, I am just not sure what, besides less traffic at those locations (at least during the distribution periods). Thanks for sharing. It is appreciated. Hope to see you at the National too, btw.

ps...I just wanted to add it is interesting that it was a 1 day giveaway, per the ad, and is a possible reason these backs are so scarce.

[jerseygary]

Nice bit of research! Just for the heck of it, did you find how much a boy's suit cost? It would be interesting to calculate what the cost would be in today's money.

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by jerseygary

Nice bit of research! Just for the heck of it, did you find how much a boy's suit cost? It would be interesting to calculate what the cost would be in today's money.

Gary, the "Gimbel Special Suits" were $3.95, and the "Adamant 2-Pant Suits" were $5.00. About the same as now if you move the decimal points.

Leon, I do not believe the three backs reflected the three locations. The block-lettered Gimbels you posted, both large and small, appear to be limited to cards #1-20 and are all lined up with m101-5, as far as I know anyway. Cards #21-200 are slanted or italicized and match up with m101-4. Each series of cards was apparently first available on a Saturday, but I don't know if or why you couldn't get them the other days as well. I might have thought they underestimated demand and had a short supply for the first day, thus explaining the scarcity of the block-lettered low numbers, but Series 1 was offered again in week two and every week thereafter--apparently only series 2 eventually sold out. For every question answered it seems a new one arises.

[ValKehl]

Todd, fantastic stuff - well done! New discoveries like this is one of the things I like most about collecting vintage cards. And, thanks Todd for letting me know that I don't have to look for any Gimbels-WaJos with block letters.
Best,
Val

[TheBig6]

Nice research Todd
For my curiosity, How many Mall theater backs are known to exist.

[nolemmings]

Thanks guys. Jerry, I've confirmed 17 Mall Theatres, including one Rucker.

So Gimbels was the last to give up her location, at least to me. For those who did not know, or who just want the info in one place, here is the location of the advertisers for the various m101-4/5 backs:

Altoona Tribune: Altoona, PA
Blank (Mendelsohn): Chicago, IL
Block & Kuhl: Peoria, IL
Burgess-Nash: Omaha, NE
Everybody’s: El Paso, TX
Famous & Barr St. Louis, MO
Gimbels: Milwaukee, WI
Globe: Harrisburg, PA
Green-Joyce: Columbus, OH
Herpolsheimer: Grand Rapids, MI
Holmes to Homes: Washington D.C.
Indianapolis Brewing: Indianapolis, IN
Mall Theatre: Cleveland, OH
Morehouse Baking: Lawrence, MA
Sporting News: St. Louis, MO
Standard Biscuit San Francisco, CA
Successful Farming: Des Moines, IA
Ware’s Basement: New Rochelle, NY
Weil Baking: New Orleans, LA

Blank-backed full sheets:

Bucyrus Brewing: Bucyrus, OH
Chicago Examiner: Chicago, IL
Furniture City Brewing: Grand Rapids, MI

Edited to change Holmes address to Washington DC.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

Thanks guys. Jerry, I've confirmed 17 Mall Theatres, including one Rucker.

So Gimbels was the last to give up her location, at least to me. For those who did not know, or who just want the info in one place, here is the location of the advertisers for the various m101-4/5 backs:

Altoona Tribune: Altoona, PA
Blank (Mendelsohn): Chicago, IL
Block & Kuhl: Peoria, IL
Burgess-Nash: Omaha, NE
Everybody’s: El Paso, TX
Famous & Barr St. Louis, MO
Gimbels: Milwaukee, WI
Globe: Harrisburg, PA
Green-Joyce: Columbus, OH
Herpolsheimer: Grand Rapids, MI
Holmes to Homes: Arlington, VA
Indianapolis Brewing: Indianapolis, IN
Mall Theatre: Cleveland, OH
Morehouse Baking: Lawrence, MA
Sporting News: St. Louis, MO
Standard Biscuit San Francisco, CA
Successful Farming: Des Moines, IA
Ware’s Basement: New Rochelle, NY
Weil Baking: New Orleans, LA

Blank-backed full sheets:

Bucyrus Brewing: Bucyrus, OH
Chicago Examiner: Chicago, IL
Furniture City Brewing: Grand Rapids, MI

That is again, a great help Todd. Thanks. I was speaking with my auction partner and commented on how well the Mall Theatre did in our last auction. I guess I am behind the times a bit as I didn't realize they were in that price category. (unless there were dueling Zimmerman collectors ).

http://b-lauctions.com/M101-4-Mall-T...n-LOT6489.aspx

[CamaroCPA]

I had lunch near the Gimbels Building in Milwaukee on Tuesday.

The office building Bud Selig works out of is just s few blocks away.

[ValKehl]

Hi Todd,
It is my belief that the Holmes Bakery was located in Washington, DC. My pathetic memory thinks I have copy of a newspaper pic of the Holmes Bakery plant, but I can't seem to locate it. Anyhow, a quick Google search turned up this:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/...LpR_story.html

which contains the following re the Holmes Bakery:

"The milkman was just one of a number of mobile tradespeople who plied the streets of Washington and its suburbs up until the 1960s. Bill Barry grew up on Taylor Street NW. Besides getting milk from Chestnut Farms Dairy, the family had bread delivered from Holmes Bakery. “The motto on the side of the truck was ‘Holmes to Homes,’ ” Bill wrote. “The trucks they had were Divcos, and the driver had the option to sit or stand while operating the vehicle.”

The Holmes Bakery was known for “milk bread,” bread made with milk instead of water — and not just any milk but “a large proportion of real Montgomery County milk.” In 1904, its bread was 5 cents a loaf; fruit pies were a quarter. For much of the 20th century, Holmes was the only bakery in the Washington area with regular home-delivery routes. “It will save you many a trip ‘to the store,’ ” promised the bakery.

In 1917, Holmes opened a new 100,000-square-foot bakery at 107-115 F St. NW (Todd, this is a Washington, DC, address). Customers were invited to take tours Sunday through Friday evenings. Today the Georgetown University Law school sits on the former site of the Holmes Bakery."

I am curious as your source of info for an Arlington, VA, location. Although it is located just across the Potomac River from DC, Arlington County, VA, was quite rural back in 1916. Also, the mention above that Holmes obtained the milk for its bread from Montgomery County, which is located in Maryland, further suggests to me that Holmes Bakery plant would not have been located in Virginia because if it were, I assume Holmes would have obtained its milk from a much closer dairy in Va.
Best,
Val

[nolemmings]

Thanks Val. I had amended my list about 90 minutes before your post to show Washington DC. I guess Leon cut and pasted my initial list before I changed it when looking for typos, if that is what you were looking at. I had mistakenly referred to old notes from back in 2008 when Tim and I were writing our article for Old Cardboard--you'll see from that article we had attributed it to Arlington County, VA. Yes it has been known for a few years now that the bakery was located in Washington D.C.

[timn1]

Takes me back to the days we worked on that article. After it came out we learned, thanks to some investigative-minded collectors, the location of Mall Theater, Everybody, Holmes to Homes, and now Gimbel's.

Val, we were basically guessing in the article; we were fairly confident Holmes was in the greater DC area but weren't able to pinpoint it. That WaPo citation you found makes me feel that we should have been able to find out at the time- Holmes was obviously a pretty big firm.

I believe Mall Theater is the scarcest M101-4 by a sizable margin, since that little Green-Joyce group appeared. Holmes the scarcest M101-5.