[barrysloate]

A hidden reserve is legal, shilling is not. I don't see how you can compare them.

Shilling is fraud; I don't see how anybody in this discussion can defend fraud. You may be resigned that it will happen, but you should never stop fighting against it, and exposing it when you can.

And if there were an auction house who admitted to shilling, I don't believe there would be very many bidders.

I have to say this is one of the oddest debates we've ever had.