[Archive]

Posted By: 1880nonsports

they may have some of the best authenticators in the world for cards (opinion)....... but going in I imagine their experience with cigarette packs to be woefully limited - we don't know that their best authenticators examined the pack - dishonest people are clever. The result after opening this pack (slabs often mean the item will remain entombed and thus not re-examined) flies in the face of currently known information. I have been on a search for quite some time to SEE a pack opened that HAS a card in it. Over the years I have heard MANY stories. Most of them I have either dismissed as implausible (the 5 cards found in a 1955 cancelled Polar Bear pack and a host more) or I have taken note of but felt were inconclusive or of questionable veracity. I collect packs and products associated with the early card manufacturers - although I collect many other things too - and I am NOT an expert in packs. I DO have more than 100 packs "on the shelf" and have continually been trying to learn more by dogged research when time permits. James Shaw, Alan Hicks, our own Jon C., Joe Hudgins (sp?), and C. Cooper are just a few people I listen to and learn from about cards and packs - but they only have PIECES of the story and I am still searching.... I know little about the T206 series. I thought I read above where the card was NOT possible with this factory. Danger Will Robinson! Wax paper - not a good sign as presumeably post 1916. 12 cigarette configuration - unknown (to me) before early 1917. Liggett & Myers ONLY on the box. Unless this was a brand that they retained when merged with the ATC (I will look futher next day or 2 but retained brands for the merging companies tended to be for plug and chew tobaccos) - it was produced AFTER 1914. I AM interested in the glassine envelope that the card appears to reside in. Never seen that before. Not sure what to make of that. If someone put the card in after production - why would they have secured it in something like that (unknown entity) instead of just putting the card in without the envelope? As I wrote this I realized I hadn't addressed a spooky question. The pack is sealed. If it wasn't going to be opened there is no reason to put ANY card in there. Why someone would put a card into a pack that was "sealed" if they weren't expecting the pack to be opened? If they were expecting the pack to be opened where's the financial incentive to have the card in there? To sell other packs from a same source bolstered with the evidence that a card was found in a similar pack? So much more to think about - and I'm a slow thinker. Heading to play Pinoccle for the first time in 30 years in a few minutes. I hope we can keep this exploration going. VERY important. The idea that a card has been found in what I am pretty sure is a post 1916 pack seems to allow for the following possibilities: T206's were inserted after 1911 and as late as 1917 into Piedmont packs. The card was never in the pack. The card was put into the pack AFTER production. Still worry some about the factory series thing on the card. Could someone add more to that? It's a RARE thing for me when I can experience a GROUP effort to explore a fundamental issue relating to PACKAGING like this that can help clarify current thought. It happens here and on the NS sometimes - a tribute to the members. Sometimes it's the mitigation of prior thought that energizes my collecting. It wouldn't be as much fun for me if I couldn't try and learn new stuff.....