[steve B]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

Why are people so hung up on when so-and-so was using? We know they were using and it's an easy enough guidepost to tell when they started based on the marked change in stats. For me, though, the timeframe is completely irrelevant. They're crooked and have no place in an ethical HOF if such an institution actually existed. It does not, so who cares? The constant discussion feels like such a waste of breath if you take the position that the juicers should not be inducted.

I'll contribute my own waste of breath to mention that it really irks me that Ortiz was given such an easy ride and free pass due to people liking him. I never cared for him whatsoever, and it was pretty obvious he was doping. I actually like Manny more than Ortiz, and I really dislike Manny, but he made no bones about what a complete and utter clown he was and is. He wasn't hiding behind a supposed nice guy personality.

It may be a small thing to many people, but when they had the 2004 post-WS celebration on field at Fenway, the imbecilic Ortiz felt the need to blast the F word into the microphone as part of his little speech for all the world to hear. Yes, kids hear that word all over the place, and I'm not as much of a vernacular prude as this makes me sound, but have a modicum of tact, Ortiz. He is such a putz. What's weird is that nobody in the crowd seemed to care, nor did I hear anyone mention it in the media afterward. Maybe I was all alone in my annoyance, but that's fine.

Never spent much time in Boston have you?