Quote:
Originally Posted by JollyElm
For instance, when I see a PSA 5 card that is off-center, I don't think, "I guess that card was a 7, but they lowered it to a 5 due to the centering." No frickin' way!!! I say, "That card is a 5 AND it's off-center, so it's more of a 3."
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Yeah, but that's not right. At EX 5, a card can both have subtle corner wear, (generally agreed no creases...) and be noticeably OC. 80/20 is noticeable. 83/17 is noticeable. But both can still be PSA 5's. Now, dramatically OC 5's may sell more like 3's... but that is another matter.
It's been my experience for more than a long time now that centering tolerances confuse the hell out of most collectors, especially as you go further down the scale. Below about PSA 6, centering problems don't affect the grade anywhere near as dramatically as other things or as much as they do for high end cards. The PSA standard for a 5 is 85/15 or better on the front, and when you get down to a 3, it only moves to 90/10. Because of this, true PSA 6/5 (OC)'s with the qualifier are super rare. I don't know that I've ever even seen a 5 OC. This is very much splitting hairs in terms of being a small difference that the average collector, and indeed probably many graders trying to eyeball - are not going to get correct all the time. But I would disagree that a badly centered 5 should be relegated to 3 range based on centering alone. If there is a wrinkle, sure, but otherwise there becomes a point where real damage / mishandling of cards VG and below becomes more important than even really bad centering, and I think those scenarios are what the grading standards were originally written to care for.
Overall, I would agree that PSA over the years here has made a mess of things in trying to both institute reasonable centering standards per grade, AND accommodate collectors who don't like qualifiers on their slabs. It makes sense if you really get familiar with the standards, but of course most people don't and then complain when they see something they perceive as unfair. What they should be doing in cases where no qualifiers was requested is simply lowering the card to where it fits in the scale based on what the centering actually is. For example a PSA 9 that would get the OC qualifier could be a straight 7 if the centering was 75/25 or better, but only a 6 if it was 80/20. The problem here of course is this is very subjective from person to person just to eyeball, and we all know that most run of the mill cards are not measured by a ruler, or digital caliper or anything else like that at PSA.
I would agree with those who have already said that more information is better, and to me at least the idea of subgrades would be the quickest way if nothing else to settle the centering confusion. But I don't see this suddenly happening, at least at PSA and SGC - and especially for vintage cards.