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Posted By: <b>Robert</b><p>I recently sold a E-90 Caramel card as trimmed on EBAY and the buyer sent me a nasty email claiming the card to be a reprint. Telling me that I was probably not aware that I purchased a reprint so not really accussing me of being a scammer. I bought the card over a year ago from a very reputable dealer and it is in perfect mint condition minus the fact that it is trimmed. I know the card is authentic and not a reprint...how should I respond? I am going to tell him to send it to GAI or SGC and have them authenticate the card not grade it and if it comes back as a reprint then I will refund him his money plus the costs of submittal? Is that fair?

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Posted By: <b>T206Collector</b><p>...just refund the money and get the card back as soon as possible. Putting the buyer to work authenticating the card is a waste of time and will likely annoy the buyer even further. Wash your hands of it, get the card back, refund the money, and then if you want send it to GAI for the authentic grade. But when a buyer tells you he is unhappy with the transaction, it is best to do whatever he wants (within reason) to make him feel happy again.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>If he knew it was trimmed at the get go and now claims it is a reprint too, odds are he decided he did not want a trimmed card and is making an accusation as a pretext to cover his buyer's remorse. Get the card back first then refund the money and seek a credit from ebay for the final value fees. If the card is high profile, I'd certainly see if GAI will authenticate it. If you want to have a no-refunds policy, state it as an auction term.

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Posted By: <b>Darren J. Duet</b><p>I may be a Horse's patoot but I do know a reprint when I see/feel one in person. The card is a reprint, and I'm the buyer.<br /><br />Ebay Item #5207474311<br /><br />I also require a refund before the card is returned, if the card is not as advertised.<br /><br />The trimming is no issue.

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Posted By: <b>warshawlaw</b><p>nor would any business I know of. <br /><br />No offense re horse's patoot <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

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Posted By: <b>dan mckee</b><p>How can you expect a seller to refund you before you have returned his item? That is ridiculous.<br><br>That card looks very real in the scan. Darren, can you post a scan of the back here?

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Posted By: <b>identify7</b><p>If board members were not involved, the current status could be described as a seller (in the view of the buyer) has misrepresented his merchandise. Possession of the card and materials of transmission are evidence of that.<br /><br />If you return the card to a seller believed to be behaving fradulently, it does not make sense; what would then motivate him to return your money? Honesty?<br /><br />Of course, this does not apply here, imho.<br /><br />What do you think?

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Posted By: <b>dan mckee</b><p>Both have excellent feedback, I see no reason to suspect either would be anything but honest. Even with a dishonest seller, you have no chance of getting your money back if you do not return the item. The buyer is the unhappy one, therefore he should return the merchandise for a refund. As a seller, if a buyer asked me to refund him first, I would laugh at him.

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Posted By: <b>Josh K.</b><p>I agree, as a seller, I would ordinarily never refund money b/f receiving the card back - if it was s/o I knew, that would be different. However, if it was s/o I knew, I suspect it would be much like many trades Ive made with board members where both parties shipped the cards at the same time. As a buyer, I would not expect a refund first - doesnt mean I wouldnt ask though.

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Posted By: <b>dennis</b><p>if i sold a reprint by mistake,i would still want it back b4 i gave buyer his $$ back,because i would be afraid he was conning me.robert would never sell a fake card knowingly.darren thinks the card is fake,in this case with 2 honest people i would refund darren the $ back as i know he would return the card.also it could work the other way too. also i'll bet robert sends the card in to be graded when he gets it back and will tell us results.

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Posted By: <b>dan mckee</b><p>If the current holder of the card thinks it is fake, that is more the reason that he should send first. Since it isn't worth anything, why not just return it? You are not risking anything at that point. Yes, better get this in to a grading service to determine if it is real or not. Look at these fakes I got stuck with! <br /><br /><br /><a href="http://www.network54.com/Forum/thread?forumid=153652&messageid=1119307486&lp=1119 825142" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.network54.com/Forum/thread?forumid=153652&messageid=1119307486&lp=1119 825142</a>

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Posted By: <b>Darren J. Duet</b><p>I will post scans of the card this evening.<br /><br />I know most sellers will not refund prior to receiving a return. I have learned a great lesson dealing with reprints/counterfeits sold as authentic and the people who sell them(knowingly or not).<br /><br />If I receive a card that the seller claimed to be authentic and upon my inspection, I decide it is a fake, I will hold that card until I'm certain I'll be compensated for it or I'm convinced that the seller is honest. Why should I trust someone who sells a fake as authentic to send my refund once he receives the card? Furthermore, what is to stop him from doing the same to someone else with that same card?<br /><br />I agree that the card appeared authentic in the scan for the Ebay listing, that is why I bid on it. I'd be pleased with the transaction if the card were authentic.<br /><br />In higher dollar items there is no way anyone should return a suspected fraudulent item without objective assurance compensation is made. This may not be popular with many of you, but as quality sellers I'd expect that you don't experience this problem often.

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Posted By: <b>dan mckee</b><p>Darren, I understand your point of view but at that point, what are you actually holding? Nothing. Why not just return the card. If you get your money back, which it looks like you will, you are ahead of the game. If not, you lost a worthless reprint in addition to your money. Looks like a "no-brainer" to me. My best and your friend, Dan.

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Posted By: <b>Darren J Duet</b><p><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1120084317.JPG"> <img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1120084297.JPG">

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Posted By: <b>Bob Rousseau</b><p>if a seller has a high enough positive feedback, then I would not presume that they knew it was a repro and continue on to conclude "why trust them to give me my money back". Yes, I imagine sellers may at some point "go bad" and start to screw up more, but most want to maintain a good reputation. I agree with what someone said- if you think it's a repro- what do you have by holding onto it? There's always an inherent risk when you don't buy a card face to face- but 99% of the time, that risk seems to be worth it.

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Posted By: <b>dan mckee</b><p>Thanks for the picture Darren but I can't tell, again, if it is a reprint to you, return it for a refund. The seller posted this so my guess is he will refund you upon receiving the card back. Dan.