What to do - Ebay Authentication Process/Possible Reprint
 

This issue involves a post-war card, but relevant to any card or ebay purchase.

So the facts...

* Always looking for Mickey Mantle cards like a great percentage of collectors

*Found a raw 1956 Topps Mickey Mantle - Looks like a 2, 2.5ish for $650

*I put it on my Watch List as it's clearly a good deal

*Seller throws an Offer at me - $575

*I looked hard at it...I usually don't like to spend more than $300 on something raw...BUT considering it had the Blue Ribbon Guaranteed Authentication I felt like there was little risk. To be fair, this is the first time I had considered buying a raw card under this new process

*I sent a quick PM to the seller, it looked like it had a pinhole in it? He immediately responds back that it's a print mark.

*I bought it

https://www.ebay.com/itm/325567433425

*Seller immediately sends me a "thank you" and a nice note and ships next day

*Here is the kicker...the CARD WENT DIRECTLY TO ME. It does NOT go to the Authentication process

*The card shows up yesterday, I am a little alarmed it went directly to me?

*Open the package...I'm now suspect if it's real. If it's a reprint, it's a good one. Just doesn't feel right...and don't laugh, it doesn't smell right.

*Seller has a clear "NO RETURNS". I submit for one anyhow...seller immediately send me several messages. First, he did not know why it wasn't sent to the Authenticator, he says he didn't even know really about that, just shipped to the address given. (Can that even happen?) He then automatically accepts the return, apologizes profusely I feel this way...he says he is 100% sure it's not a reprint (maybe he just believes that?) and wants to make it right...I wasn't expecting that for sure.


https://i.ibb.co/sW1RBLy/56-Mick.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/yN1R00B/56-Mick-Back.jpg



So...what to do. Why didn't it go to the Authenticators? Did I do something wrong? I have until 3/27 to send in the return...do I expedite to SGC (my preferred grader) and throw another $125 at it to verify? Or do I just return it and call it good. (I assume Ebay would have my back on their guarantee if I ship it back with their label.)


Finding myself in some uncharted waters...

No chance I’m keeping that without the guarantee. I mean dangit man, they have been sending all my stuff even graded to the authentication. I actually don’t mind that but should have happened for you.

Yes, that's not an option. No way I am just going to keep this and stand down.

I've read you can't opt out of the authentication...did I miss something where I needed to sign up for it? Or should this be automatic? Still no idea why it went directly to me.

It should be automatic.

The original listing certainly has the authenticity guarantee seal, so it sure seems like it should have gone to the authenticator. The usual process is when the seller prints the mailing label, the address line has your name, a code, and the authenticator's actual mailing address. So under the standard process, the seller couldn't send it directly to you even if they wanted to.

I'm not seeing anything in the listing that would eliminate the AG process, so the only thing I can surmise is that the eBay algorithms somehow failed when they gave your seller the mailing address for shipping.

Have you contacted ebay? Perhaps they would send you a shipping label so that your card can go through the Authentication process as promised.

If your mailing address is a PO box it doesn't go through the authentication process.

Back in February I sold a raw Tom Brady card for $400. I was expecting it to ship to the Guarantee program, but didn't. I don't know why. Normally, the default address when you ship a card that meets the monetary limit it requires you to send the card to the Guarantee address. It didn't in my case with the Brady.

Maybe the process has changed. At some point the guarantee service is going to revert to "Pay for Guarantee" program. Maybe they are just starting. It sounds like the seller has been straight up with you so far.

I'm assuming that now you have the card you have done your due diligence for authenticity, i.e. check the transparency, check the size, check the print dots. If the print dots are a match, in MOST cases it is real.

Pat R is correct.

I called ebay and just found that out. I use a PO Box (tired of getting my mail stolen!!!)

I'm going to just send the card back and take my return. Funny, the ebay agent said they would have backed me if he didn't take the return...he said the onus would have been on him to prove it's authentic to negate a return. This new policy of Authentication isn't to protect the buyer, it protects Ebay...

Learn something new every day. My lesson...any big cards that need Authentication I send to an address...if I want to skip their Authentication for a graded card, ship to my PO...lol.

That is what I have heard as well. If you have a PO Box and want to make a similar type of purchase that you are not 100% confident about, I suggest you temporarily change your delivery address to your home address on Ebay so that it can go through their authentication process.

Brian

I don't type fast enough.

Brian

Isn't one of, if not the, main reason they don't use the authentication process if you have a P.O. box is because a signature is required when your item is delivered? Another way Ebay can protect themselves, more so than the buyer or seller.

Perhaps that is Ebay's reasoning, but they could also pay the additional amount to require signature for the package, and then the purchaser just has to go to the counter at post office to sign for it.

Brian

Doesn't cost any more or any less for "signature required" to a residence, business or PO Box with the USPS.

always used a P.O. Box until they started the AG

personally rather have my cards sitting at the post and not driving around in a truck and sitting in my mail box. Unfortunately sense Covid the local post still does not use signature and will leave it at my door step.

I finally decided it’s better to know what I bought is as described and canceled my P.O. Box. Just too many scams dealt with in the past. Sense AG I have had to open 0 return cases. It’s awesome.

I would return too, especially if not happy with any intuition its not legit-

I use a P.O. Box and have received a half dozen cards from the authentication service.

I don’t think so, I’ve never had to sign for a card from the authenticator. They just get put in my mailbox...

Did eBay give you (John) the opportunity to still submit it to the authenticator yourself, and have it shipped back to you? Sounds to me like you want the card, but want it authenticated.

Either way, Good Luck to the OP

I see no reason to believe the card is not authentic from the pics but safety would be to send it back since it cannot be verified.

So that's what it's come to in this hobby...everything not graded or otherwise authenticated is automatically under scrutiny for being a fake.

I for one do not care about that. In the end, if my cards are somehow deemed fake, so be it. And I have some truly expensive cards.

If, and that's a great big if, I bought an expensive card off of eBay or Amazon or whatever, and I loupe it and blacklight it, and I'm convinced it's fake, I'm not going to the seller I'm going straight to eBay and go through hoops to speak to a human and say and do whatever to get my money back. Whatever it takes.

Well that's interesting you are the first person that I know of who has their ebay purchases shipped to a PO box who has had an item go through the authentication process.

When they first started the program I purchased a card that was supposed to go through the process and because of that it said there would be a delay in the shipping. I was surprised when I received the card in the mail three days later so I checked their terms and conditions and found out why. I have purchased 20+ cards that had the Guarantee and all of them were shipped directly to me.

Attachment 563187

I think it’s authentic, but I’d need to personally see the card to guarantee it. I understand you wanting to return it. However, if you do, you risk the seller deciding to keep it or selling it to someone else. You risk losing the card.

.

James you will be OK with raw cards. Card doctors don't fix cards to keep them raw. They fix them to get into PSA slabs because that is where the money is.

Keep card shes pretty

Sad the joy of buying raw cards is lost nowadays, and people refer to cards as 2-2.5 instead of G/VG. Everything is just a number!

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Ahh, yes. Thanks, Ben.

Raw is the way to go. I have somewhere in the region of 100,000 autographed flats. Forget about the exorbitant cost, but can you imagine how much more room 100,000 slabs would take up? They're so clunky and unappealing, not to mention the distasteful juxtaposition of vintage items imprisoned in modern plastic. I might only have 100 or less items in slabs because they were obtained already encapsulated. What would otherwise fit into a tiny space takes up far too much room. I just leave them in their awful tombs because the next owner will likely have differing thoughts.

This is NOT directed at John at all, just a general statement. Know what you are buying and from whom you are buying.

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Wow...no where near the situation, you clearly don't know me. 99.999% of my collection is proudly raw, with only ONE card post-57 graded, my 63 Pete Rose rookie as that's the only way I trust buying such a reprinted card. It wasn't the process that initially made me feel this card is a fake, it was the CARD itself. Looking back now I realize this entire time I have bought cards sent directly to me due to a PO, I just didn't understand the process. Last week I had a graded 1955 Koufax sent, I assumed since it was graded it didn't need it. I know now why.

I didn't need to go straight to ebay, buyer agreed to a return...there was no need. I only went to ebay after reading here to see why it was sent directly to me. If you are ok with keeping a card you feel is fake, good for you man.



I have a rather large Mantle collection...all raw except my 53 T, 54 B, 53 Dormands, 55 B...Mantle cards are the most trimmed, soaked, altered, and faked cards out there...and this one proves that. I buy pre-57 cards graded so I can sleep at night...

Again...not me at all, and putting me in the graded card club is laughable. I mentioned 2-2.5 to put it into perspective of the value. A graded 2 is worth about $1200...more than twice what I paid. Which is meaningless as I rarely if ever sell anything, and wouldn't have here. I love buying raw as much as anyone else...99.9999% of my purchases are just that. I also don't rip on those who love graded...this hobby is great because everyone has their own way of making it their own. To me it's sad there are people like you that only point out that not everyone shares your one way of looking at things "nowadays". You do you man...

I would LOVE to keep this.

So I took it to the local card shop to a guy I trust...to be fair we probably hold the same amount of vintage...but wanted his opinion...he also in 2 seconds called it a reprint...a decent one. In hand it doesn't feel right. Here are my scans, not seller pictures -

https://i.ibb.co/pfcJC5P/56-Mantle-Boyer-Together.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/qnv9mSt/56-Mantle-Boyer.jpg


You can be the judge via scan...I have a few 56 Mantles, no need to keep this and chase to grade. The borders are not "dirty"...it looks like it was aged before it was "reprinted", its really smooth. Sent back this morning.

You can direct that at me...I'm usually the one saying that. Had it not had the AG, I wouldn't have bought it...deal just seemed to good. His feedback is 136, low but not out of the realm...he has only a couple of new cards listed...graded by a company I have never heard of before. All red flags, even if legit, that I normally would never spend that kind of money on. So AG, or not, my bad. I know better.

Oh well. You took a shot. You're returning it. No real harm done frustrating though it must be. Sorry, man. I'm a lot like you in that most of what I buy is ungraded with some graded mixed in.

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Totally agree...unless the name on the card is Mantle...or, have you seen some of the really good fake raw 67 Seaver rookies out there? Those are scary...there is money on some cards in raw...a lot of money. My mind can't even go to the card dr.s and the fake high end due to grading...I have never "paid for a grade"...buying a vintage card in 8 is out of my league...

I did take a shot...no harm done is right. I did learn a few things, which is good. Don't use my PO when I need their services, and service or not, keep my normal "red flag" eyes open

I totally get it. The hobby sometimes isn't cheap, and I know it can get tempting to take a chance sometimes, especially with a card like a '56 Mick. I learn from these threads as well, so thanks for sharing all of this. I also had NO idea about the whole PO Box thing (even though I don't have one). Good luck as you resume your search. I'm glad you're getting money back on this fake. You know your stuff and can't be fooled.

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When I say I don't care if my cards are fake, I mean it. Could there be fakes in my collection? Perhaps. If there are, I will never know about it. However, that said, I seriously don't believe there are any. They feel right, loupe right, blacklight right, smell right, card stocks block lamp light right, fibers look right, the works. I don't need any grader to offer up an opinion that, quite frankly, I don't want or need or care about. I'm very content with them, I don't lose any sleep at night worrying about them, I'm not building some sort of investment legacy to pass on. I just enjoy them for what they are to me, a link to my youth and a glorious era of baseball.

I'm not condescending your situation in any way, and if taken that way, I formally apologize.

I have bought MANY cards from sellers on eBay. None of them overly expensive. All my really big money cards were either given to me years ago by friends and relatives or bought at card shows or events years ago (90%) or were obtained via trades, in person (10%).

Like you, I feel that after 55+ years in and out of this hobby that I am knowledgeable enough at this point to differentiate between authentic and fake real fast. Much like buying a car, I wouldn't buy from photos any big ticket card.

I guess, since I collect only raw cards, that my "Mason-Dixon Line" for a single card big purchase on line would be perhaps $250. If something went awry, I could live with that. Any higher, I would seek an in person deal or trade.

Correct bad fake

If the card is fake, it’s a good one. I went to the original eBay listing and focused in the best I could. The card appears to have the correct printing dots. However, like I originally said, I’d have to handle the card to make sure.

James...I think we are actually on the exact same page...appreciate the comments. I feel like I could have written most of your post. Totally agree on the $250 comment. Even in the 50's anything under that I don't need grading and if something went wrong, it's on me. When I say I buy 50s graded it was exactly that, anything more than $400ish really. I am on a SGC kick of grading some of my 50s big cards just for consistency and to be fair, I love the way they look. Mays, Aaron, Mantle, Clemente, Ted W, Jackie....only the big boys and most of mine are gloriously in low grade. I am not trying to cash in. I'm enjoying it...but who knows, I may pop them in a couple years...haha...call it a phase. :)

Funny, I just got something delivered to me last week that went through authentication, and I had to sign for the mailman, or I would have to go to the post office to pick it up and sign for it there. Do they do this differently for different items/people or something else I've never heard of before? I was always under the impression it was one fixed set of rules supposedly covering everything (and everyone) the same.

Assuming this is the authentication service we are talking about, yes I've received 5 or 6 to my PO Box.


https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...595b1c4f0e.jpg

Bob, I don't believe your shipment was handled any differently than anyone else's by eBay. The variance in experiences is more likely due to inconsistencies in local USPS practices. During the pandemic, most shipping services (like USPS) suspended their policies of making mail carriers obtain signatures on "signature required" packages. This was to limit carriers' exposure to Covid risks and maintain social distancing. Carriers would either sign for the package themselves, or in most cases just drop it off at your door or mail receptacle without it being signed for. It is very likely that not all local post offices have returned to enforcing pre-pandemic practices concerning obtaining signatures. It is also likely that even if they are now supposed to do it, some individual carriers might not make the extra effort. Sounds like you have a quality carrier that plays it by the book.

Yes that's the service Steve, and according to their own terms & conditions you're not eligible for the service.

The authentication process seems to be all over the place. I listed a card for auction with the BIN option high enough for it to go through the service. Card actually sold for $150 but is still going to the authenticator. I am happy because I personally love the service.

You may be right Kevin, but the odd thing is I have also received other packages from several different sources (AHs) over the past couple of months, and even had a second package delivered the same day and alongside the one I got from Ebay authentication. When I asked the mailman, they said the signature was only because of the one package from Ebay, not the second one they also delivered at the same time from REA. And none of the other past card deliveries from others have required any signatures either. Just seemed very odd that all of a sudden I had to sign for something like that. This kind of thing, plus other stuff like the poster who mentioned getting items sent to him from Ebay authentication despite using a P.O. box address, has me scratching my head on what they are doing anymore. But based on what the mailman told me, it seems that Ebay must have specifically requested signature verification on the delivery to my house. Now is there possibly some kind of additional dollar threshold that Ebay uses before also requesting signature verification then? I paid between $1,500-$2,000 for the item I had go through their authentication process, does that make a difference then in how they have it delivered and add signature verification? Very confusing IMO.

Interesting view. I like all of my cards to be real.
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