Exhibits cards - mainstream, oddball, what?
 

Guys - quick question. Have collected off and on for 30+ years but had never really seen, much less collected, Exhibits cards until stumbling upon them on eBay over the past few months.

I have gotten a few now, and really like the old-time look and feel of them (e.g., the Hank Aaron and Jackie Robinson 1947-66s just look cool).

I've also picked up a few 1939-46 Salutations Exhibits, e.g,. Ted Williams, Bob Feller.

Questions:
1) Do you guys consider these mainstream?
2) Do you even consider them baseball cards? Or more postcards?
3) Are the Statistics Back Exhibits more desirable, in your opinion? (I think the Maris is sweet, tried to bid on one but it went way over my max bid)

My grandfather was a sportswriter and my dad gave me a few old time press release/photos as well (e.g., Rocky Colavito), but I think these are different from the Exhibits "cards"? Do any of you collect the old press release photos?

Any way, I love the vintage look and feel of the Exhibits, and just wondering what other collectors think and any insight on how these cards were distributed, quantities, etc.

Thanks a ton,
Mike

1) Do you guys consider these mainstream?
- I do not consider these mainstream as they were not issued like most cards. My understanding is they were sold in machines and not companion pieces to another item like gum or cookies.
2) Do you even consider them baseball cards? Or more postcards?
- I do not consider them baseball cards but rather postcards. The only reason for this distinction is that, for the player I collect, I try to get all of his card. There are a handful of Exhibit variations that are prohibitively expensive at this point, so considering them postcards alleviates the need to get them all, at least in my circular way of thinking.
3) Are the Statistics Back Exhibits more desirable, in your opinion? (I think the Maris is sweet, tried to bid on one but it went way over my max bid)
- I don't know if they are more desirable, but my personal experience has been that they are more expensive, likely because they were produced in a more limited capacity. If you are going for all Exhibit variations from a single player, than I could see the need to get the stat backs, but if you just want one of each player, etc., I don't see any meaningful distinction between the two types.

Mike.......

You'll find a lot of Exhibit collectors on here in one capacity or another. I think you have the 1920's and 1930's exhibits that I wouldn't consider mainstream personally. I think the Salutation and 1947-1966 exhibit sets are more mainstream. Size-wise they are different from cards but fall into similar sizes as the 1964 Topps Giants, 1970/1971 Topps Supers etc. Basically, it's what you make of it......if you want to consider them 'cards' and collect them that way, go ahead. The 1947-1966 set contains a ton of variations and tougher cards issued later in theat time run. I like all the exhibits and have a complete set of 1947-1966's and missing about 8-10 from the Salutations and have complete sets of all (3) Stat Back sets........overall, they're pretty affordable cards for the period they were issued in and some of the cards/poses are fantastic. Good luck in your quest!

I consider them mainstream as they weren't regional from my understanding, but were nationwide.
They also aren't postcards as they weren't sold as postcards and they weren't designed as postcards. They were sold in vending machines as baseball cards.
There are numerous sets besides just the 1947-66, Stat back and Salutations.
There are some which are tinted.
There are some pricier ones are those from the 1920s.

If you like the old time feel of them, look for some of the boxing, football or hockey ones. There also are movie stars, cowboys and probably a couple others.

If you really are into collecting them, you should seek one of the older vending machines.

Here is some information on them.
http://www.moviecard.com/zamerican/e...itgeneral.html

Oh they're baseball cards all right....
 

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...my only complaint is they take up a lot of space in your Bank Safety Deposit Box.

..but they are , in my eyes , big beautiful old baseball cards , with enough variations in the issues to make a set-completionist whacko like me happy...join the club ; you'll enjoy the chase and the hunt.......oh , and bring money since some of them are downright pricey...

..

I love the Exhibits-- as my avatar shows.

I think especially that the Lou Gehrig Exhibit RC is one of the coolest cards in the whole hobby!

I consider them mainstream, and also as cards, not postcards.

I have to agree with this assessment. The Gehrig RC is the only Exhibit card I own. Although postcard sized it looks like a baseball card to me.

They may not be as mainstream as other popular sets but there are quite a few collectors out there who enjoy the cards.

Guys thanks for the post. I especially like the advice, "if you like it, you should collect it," which I've seen in this post and on a few other posts on this board.

Look forward to sharing some finds as I progress, and as I start to look at some of the checklists, I see what you mean about all the variations and the pricey-ness of some of the issues!

'62 Pittsburgh(kennywood aracde?) exhibits are my favorite. Some can be cost prohibitive. I gave up on the set and just kept the Boyer Clemente and Maris for my player PC's.
I consider these to be regional. I don't believe they were distributed regionally, hence the Pittsburgh/Kennywood designation.

Love them

Same here. I am always looking for another Mantle if anyone has one? I traded my 8 of Clubs for a 5 of Clubs and now need to replace it...

Of course Exhibit cards are baseball cards, or from whatever sport the athlete represents.

Are they mainstream? Yes and no. Produced in Chicago, the areas they sold to were cities and well-populated regions, counting then the likes of the Chicagoland area's huge suburbia. Think about it, the company could not supply every city in the USA with an exhibit card vending machine.

In the end, I would think many parts of the country were well fortified with availability, but then many parts were not.

In Chicago suburbia where I grew up, I remember a nice restaurant in the upstairs area of the Randhurst Shopping Center in Wheeling, Illinois in the mid-60s with a huge treasure chest for the kids to select one free toy / trinket for coming with their parents to the restaurant. A nice public relations gimmick. I was a bit too old to qualify. However, as I passed by the open chest, there were a few baseball exhibit cards spread around with the toys. The cards were not wrapped, just lying there unprotected. Just waitin' to be dinged, jostled, possibly creased, and even fingered by childrens' hands that were by then perhaps a bit moist and greasy from enjoying their meal.

Their oversize nature left them extremely vulnerable to all sorts of handling that reduced their condition. Furthermore, what would a kid back then do with a nice exhibit of say, Mickey Mantle, Roberto Clemente, Willie Mays, Whitey Ford, and so on? Ponder that pertinent question for an hour.

The exhibits were gorgeous, black 'n white or sepia, while the older editions had a pleasing variety of sepia colors such as blue, violet, green, red, and brown. Some collectors rate them way below mainstream bubblegum cards. I do not. Perhaps not equal, but close, very close, to them. Not third cousins, thrice removed.

I would NEVER label exhibits as oddball. They're too beautiful and elegant for that. The epitome of oddball are the 1967 Topps Who Am I set, or the 1957 Swift's Premium Franks set, otherwise known as Swift Meats. Another would be the 1969-70 Topps Basketball Rulers, that came as a free insert in a wax pack of the regular cards. A further would be the 1965 Topps "Push-Pull". Definitely oddball. MikeGarcia put up two great images today of the 1965 Topps "Push-Pull" on the POSTWAR thread regarding Oddball issues.

In this categorical matter of the exhibits, collectors try to properly place them. But, where do we put them? They're not gum. I put them in with the regional / food issues because even though they were available nationwide, it was only in selected large localities. A similar example that's always been classed as a regional are the 1954 Wilson Franks. Wilsons were nationwide, but it was a small promotion in much more limited areas across the country, wherever Wilson Franks were sold, period. Back to the Exhibit availability. A baseball card-crazy kid in Beaverton, Oregon had zilcho hopes of ever seeing an Exhibit Company vending machine. Some outlet around there might order a gross of the cards for sales purposes, as the aforementioned restaurant, but that's a pretty big "might". Remember, those proprietors in the zillions of towns around the country would have to either know about them, or his supplier of candy, gum, toys, and novelties would have to know about the exhibit cards---AND WHERE AND HOW TO ORDER THEM FOR THE GIVEN OUTLET. I probably don't need to remind you of the fact there was no internet or email back then. Then there's the ravages of handling, and what kids tended to do with their exhibits, which then drives me to put the Exhibits with the regional / food category, since they seem to share in the matter of "built-in rarity", "not that easy to come by at the time of issue", and a "severe condition rarity based on how the cards were handled, displayed, or mounted".

There was a scene I recall in the wonderful old Warner Brothers movie, "Gentleman Jim", the biography of World Heavyweight Boxing Champion James Corbett, portrayed by the dashing Errol Flynn. A youngster is seen standing up his Exhibit cards on his bedroom dresser of either James Corbett, or his famous opponent, first boxing champion John L. Sullivan. This is the sort of matter I was referring to when I encouraged you to ponder what a kid would do with an exhibit.

Ya think those beautiful Exhibits are gonna remain in MINT condition set up on the wood top? Or perhaps the dresser was covered with a cloth or mat, whereby the fragile Exhibit cards might snag on the same when occasionally being picked up to view closely --ding, corner crease, permanent finger prints!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's not all. Yeah, bub, there's more. Back then, a large pitcher of water resting on a large bowl would be on that dresser to wash his face in each morning. Don't wash too vigorously Harvey, or droplets of water will shoot out all over Corbett's or Sullivan's nice Exhibit cards! Now Buster, don't be in front of your cards when you have to sneeze. Oh no. No. Watch out! AAAAAHHHCHEWWW!

Buster didn't cover his mouth. Now there's gooey green, hairy, snot-infused hockers and spittel all over John L.'s mug. I can't look. I can't stand it. GET ME OUTTA HERE!!!!!!!!!

See ya later, guys. Have a swell weekend. Dress warmly with the onslaught of the fall weather and chill!:D Remember that when you look at your raw cards. At least with a graded card, you can just wipe anything off!

Cheers. ---Brian Powell

If you are going to say that exhibits are not "cards" because of their original intended use, then you would have to say the same thing about T3.

Turkey Red cabinets were intended as display pieces in cabinets. They were only available through redemption, so distribution is limited.

Don't get me wrong, I think a lot of issues make the Standard catalog that have no business being there, That includes one card "sets" for advertising some bank, car dealership or hotel. But people can collect what they want.

The only thing that bugs me about exhibits is the fact that from the salutations and beyond,there's no way to track what a complete set is from any given year. They're all lumped into one great big giant set, even though that's not necessarily how they were issued.

Of course they're baseball cards, beyond any rational dispute. What's to disqualify them from that status? Certainly not their size--ever seen a W600 cabinet? T5 Pinkerton cabinet? Various Goudey premiums, especially R314's. R303's, and V351's? Partridge Meat Reds? 1917-1920 Mendelsohn's?

The fact that they themselves are the product being sold is a non-starter too. Remember when Topps removed the gum from the packs, and all you got were the cards?

As to mainstream, who cares? A 1921 Holsum Bread Babe Ruth in VG doesn't go for $83,000 because its "mainstream"--it does so because its extremely rare and its the Babe. Same with the 1914 Baltimore News Ruth minor league schedule card (gee, another one a bit bigger than we might be used to!). Value = rare and significant in the best condition you can find or afford. Mainstream means real value only if you're one of those collectors who is paying huge sums for PSA 10's re cards that are common and vastly cheaper in a nice "8" holder (buy the card, and don't pay thousands simply for the plastic holder and paper slip inside!). The Gehrig 1925 rookie is far from the only significant Exhibit card that should be in anyone's collection who is concerned with lasting and appreciating value.

I guess that was my buck-50's worth.

Larry

They were at Hershey and Dorney Parks as well. (Eastern PA)

I enjoy reading your posts Brian. I would have tacked the thing right up on my wall.

Any recollection on how they were distributed? I know there are different back stamps suggesting some were prizes.

I have always enjoyed collecting 1920's Exhibit cards for both their scarcity and photography.

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I know some (most) came right out of the Exhibit machines. I remember getting quite a few of the NASA cards (mid '60s), but I don't remember the price though. There may have been others that were provided as prizes, or some machines may have mixed in the ones with stamps to provide more purchase incentive. I haven't seen any from these parks with stamps, but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

Can you help with cataloging / PSA grading and variations? Sometimes I see slabs with:

1947-1966 Exhibits
1962 or 1963 Statistics Back

PSA
1) Has PSA always called out variations for Exhibits, or did they only recognize variations after some point in time, so that anything slabbed prior to that date is not properly coded? (like the 1956 grey and white back Topps)? For instance, Ernie Banks bat-on-shoulder with script or plain signature?

2) I can't seem to find differentiation between 1947-1966 and stat back exhibits in the SMR. Whereas, Beckett clearly shows different cards and different prices for each, such as the 1947-1966 Exhibit and the 1963 Stat Back Roberto Clemente

Scarcity
Also, I think I learned that sometimes prices vary because an Exhibit card variation was only issued during 1 year, where others, say a Joe DiMaggio 1939-1946 Salutations, were issued year after year for several years. Do I have this right?

You definitely have the scarcity thing right. It's also believed that some of the Salutations (1939-1946) were printed with the 1947-1966 cards as well like Williams and DiMaggio. As for PSA.....not sure you can fully count on the SMR being remotely correct on anything other than directionally usable. Just my personal opinion. Not sure how PSA identifies the variations of the exhibits. There are a lot of nuances between them that I'd bet aren't completely identified correctly. Same kind of stuff like T206 back variations and other specifics about individual sets that are difficult to fully appreciate.

A big +1 there! Exhibits had the best photography/visual image reproduction for decades and decades!

Best always,

Larry