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bwbc917 10-21-2013 09:42 AM

Need ID and background help
2 Attachment(s)
Here is a scan of a cabinet I picked up years ago. Can anyone ID the player? Does anyone have background on the Studio??

Attachment 118824

Attachment 118825


pariah1107 10-21-2013 11:04 AM

Albert L. Werner "operated a Buffalo photography studio in 1890. He relocated his business to the Werner Building in 1896. Werner left the building in 1899."

According to the text below, The Werner Building was 101-103 Genesee, and his 289 Genesee address was the original location of his business (the photo probably dates, 1890-96).

Seems to be a very prominent photographer in Buffalo, and with a building still bearing his name, someone at a local library has probably done some research that may give you a more specific timeframe. Good luck.

Awesome cabinet!

rhettyeakley 10-21-2013 12:07 PM

Most likely year is 1890 as that was the only year that Cleveland and Buffalo were together in a League (the Players League), often times while on the road a team would sit for portraits in a different city thus the Cleveland player on a Buffalo mount. I don't immediately recognize the player so he is probably one of the lesser known guys on that team such as McGill, Stynes, Budd, etc.

I don't have the time right now to do too much searching but that should be a good start.

bwbc917 10-21-2013 02:06 PM

THX Rhett, that's in keeping with the suggestion when I bought it that the player was in the Player's League.

pariah1107 10-21-2013 03:28 PM

In 1890, "Handsome Jack" John Carney played for both the Buffalo Bisons and Cleveland Infants. I wish the image of him was better on baseball-reference, but this may be him. (Though images of Neil Stynes & Jay Budd do not seem to be available for comparison.) Someone with a razor sharp OJ might be able to confirm/deny this specualtion.

Pythonfactory 10-21-2013 05:36 PM

2 Attachment(s)
I don't have a great quality scanner or camera so sorry for the crappy picture. It is from the OJ book. This is pure speculation but Carney's eyes look a little beadier and his nose less pronounced.

bmarlowe1 10-21-2013 10:10 PM

2 Attachment(s)
This photo is a "well-known unknown" that we have been unable so far to identify. One problem may be that for some players like Stynes and Budd, there are no known (at least to us) photos in the SABR image database - they are on our "missing" list. That's not to say that people shouldn't try to figure it out, but I would expect it to be at best difficult.

He isn't John Carney, below right (nor is he McGill):

pariah1107 10-21-2013 10:22 PM

Great OJ's for comparison Bryan. Awesome side-by-side, Mark.

Agreed, not John Carney. Sorry to mislead.

bwbc917 10-22-2013 12:39 PM

I had the same feeling that it might be Carney. Now I'm clueless again.

bwbc917 10-22-2013 12:54 PM

Mark/bmarlowe1: do you have access to the SABR image base? If so, I'm a longtime SABR member, how do I get a look-see?

bmarlowe1 10-22-2013 07:25 PM

An old version of the image database is available via It is several years out of date due to web site problems - quite a few misidentifications as well as "missing" players that have since been found.

There is a project underway to rectify this.

bwbc917 10-23-2013 06:36 AM

Possible ID
One member has suggested that this is Dirty Jack Doyle who played for Cleveland in 1891 and 1892. Could some of you image eagle eyes check this lead out??? Thanks to everyone for the help so far.

bmarlowe1 10-23-2013 06:51 PM

It's not in any way even similar to Jack Doyle. If it is a major leaguer, it is not a well-known player.

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