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-   -   B.b.b.b.g.t.m. (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=297476)

jingram058 02-25-2021 02:55 PM

B.b.b.b.g.t.m.
 
16 cards made to look like 1953 Bowman black & white cards, even to the card numbers, 65 through 80. I have found next to nothing on the internet trying to find out more or any discussion. I have found PSA and SGC (and others) graded examples. Seems like they are looked on as a legitimate extension set to complement the actual black & white set from 1953, and were put out in 1979. Does anybody know anything about these cards, who made them, or who "B.B.B.B.G.T.M." was?

cardinalcollector 02-26-2021 08:48 AM

This is a collectors issued set. They are listed on page 30 of my 2009 SCD Catalog of Baseball Cards under "1979 Baseball Favorites 1953 Bowman"

Link: https://www.tcdb.com/ViewSet.cfm/sid...hite-Extension

Stonepony 02-26-2021 01:12 PM

My father and I made this set in 1979. I talk about the set here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pVQRLlHkOs

ALR-bishop 02-26-2021 01:30 PM

Then I am one of your customers Dave. Bought a set to keep with my 53 Bowman set. I think I got it from Fritsch ( could be wrong)

Stonepony 02-26-2021 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop (Post 2073788)
Then I am one of your customers Dave. Bought a set to keep with my 53 Bowman set. I think I got it from Fritsch ( could be wrong)

probably- as I recall Fritsch bought alot of them back in the day, and sold them over the years

jingram058 02-26-2021 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop (Post 2073788)
Then I am one of your customers Dave. Bought a set to keep with my 53 Bowman set. I think I got it from Fritsch ( could be wrong)

I just bought a set today from Fritsch. Yes, I took the plunge into black & white after finishing my color set.

JollyElm 02-26-2021 04:54 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stonepony (Post 2073776)
My father and I made this set in 1979. I talk about the set here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pVQRLlHkOs

I enjoyed your video, can I ask you about the Willie Mays autograph?

I believe you say they were all in-person signatures. Is that truly the case? Were you there when he signed it, or was your dad solo? The reason I ask is because there is a long standing debate concerning his autographs, namely how people (who never offer any proof of it) claim that autographs similar to yours were done by his wife. Their sticking point is often the specific use of a dot above each 'i' (Just looked this up: It's called a “tittle,” better known as a superscript dot or diacritic dot) means that Mrs. Mays, NOT Willie, signed it. I've never bought that (but readily admit that I have no proof of it either, and assume that his signature just evolved/slimmed down over the years to what it commonly looks like now). All the TTM autos people have from that time period (I'm assuming the 1980's?) look so very similar to yours, so it's hard to fathom how two different people (not counting professional forgers) could possibly have the exact same handwriting, if yours was actually done in-person. I'm hoping you may be able to add some 'proof' or insight to the debate. Here's a screenshot from your video:

Attachment 442798

Here's what some of mine look like:

Attachment 442799

Thanks!

jingram058 02-26-2021 05:06 PM

Just watched the story on YouTube. With a handle like bluejacket 66, if you weren't in the Navy, you should have been. I did 26 years myself.

Stonepony 02-26-2021 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JollyElm (Post 2073890)
I enjoyed your video, can I ask you about the Willie Mays autograph?

I believe you say they were all in-person signatures. Is that truly the case? Were you there when he signed it, or was your dad solo? The reason I ask is because there is a long standing debate concerning his autographs, namely how people (who never offer any proof of it) claim that autographs similar to yours were done by his wife. Their sticking point is often the specific use of a dot above each 'i' (Just looked this up: It's called a “tittle,” better known as a superscript dot or diacritic dot) means that Mrs. Mays, NOT Willie, signed it. I've never bought that (but readily admit that I have no proof of it either). All the TTM autos people have from that time period (I'm assuming the 1980's?) look so very similar to yours, so it's hard to fathom how two different people (not counting professional forgers) could possibly have the exact same handwriting. I'm hoping you may be able to add some 'proof' or insight to the debate. Here's a screenshot from your video:

Attachment 442798

Here's what some of mine look like:

Attachment 442799

Thanks!

Interesting question that I cannot answer for certain. I will say that I had nothing to do with the signage of that card. Mays was a pretty regular ( albeit cranky) signer at shows in the early 80s and I for sure remember getting multiple items signed at the shows in person. I'm rather certain that my dad did not send this in the mail to Mr Mays as a TTM auto. The reason being 1) It seemed unlikely he would sign through the mail and 2) including Mays in this set was a matter of anxiety and trepidation for my dad as he thought if any one of the players would protest with " rights of image" or other legal problems... it would be mays!!! Therefore without direct proof , I am very confident this was obtained in person. Here is the kicker though: he had a large collection of a around 150 autographed HOF plaques that i sold a few years ago. The buyer sent them off to PSA DNA and everyone of the cards were authentic... except the Mays!?!?. I have zero idea where he obtained the plaque but PSA thought it was no good. So, I havent helped you much but it was fun to think about!
- Dave


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