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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>That's right. The Tigers getting Miguel Cabrera and Dontrell WIllis makes this one of baseballs greatest teams ever .Watch the run production this year, it will be sick .The year maybe over for ALL TEAMS!!!!!....thank the good LORD for my seats....10 behind 1st base on the aisle.<br /><br />the team<br /><br />1st base Carlos Guillen<br />2nd base Placido Polonco<br />ss Edgar Renteria<br />3rd base Miguel Cabrera<br />DH Gary Sheffield<br />r-field Magglio Ordonez<br />c-field Curtis Grandersom<br />l-field Jacque Jones<br />catcher Ivan Rodriguez<br /><br />starters -J.Verlander-j.bonderman-D.Willis-K.ROgers-N.Robertson<br /><br />this is SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICK !!! GO TIGERS<br /><br />edited over excitement of spelling.....yeaaaahhhhhhh!!!!
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Steve</b><p>Not many American kids playing ML ball anymore.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Ben</b><p>The Tigers got Miggy Cabrera? HOLY SH*T. Likely the best young hitter in baseball. He's gonna explode in that lineup with such great protection.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Did the Tigers get Willis and Cabrera today? Wow, that's a big deal.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>also ,CHiSOx mgr Ozzie Guillen stated he'd seen Cabrera. He is eating the right things working out and has never seen him look better .This really is a very intimidating lineup....wowie !
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>So Dan, who did the Tigers give up to get them?
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Ben</b><p>Easily a top 3 lineup in baseball, probably #1 assuming they gel early on. I think the batting order will look something like this:<br /><br />1. Curtis Granderson<br />2. Placido Polanco<br />3. Magglio Ordonez<br />4. Miguel Cabrera<br />5. Gary Sheffield<br />6. Carlos Guillen<br />7. Edgar Renteria<br />8. Ivan Rodriguez<br />9. Marcus Thames/Jacque Jones/Brandon Inge<br /><br /><br />Boy is that an intimidating lineup. And so well rounded. The starting rotation is great too. You have every reason to be pumped for the season, Dan. They are gonna be real tough to beat.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>paulstratton</b><p>Giving up Maybin, A.Miller and 4 other prospects is a stiff price...but worth it IMO. The whole lineup can rake! Let's hope the pitching stays healthy.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Seth B.</b><p>Ben, being a Braves fan, I think if Renteria is healthy, you gotta bat him second over Polanco!
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>jerms</b><p>when the red sox get johan--they will be the team to beat
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>That is a pretty wicked line up.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>I know who "pudge" is... <img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14>
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>The top two prospects the Tigers gave up have a lot of potential -- but how can they possibly measure up to Cabrera and Willis? Great trade for the Tigers.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>quan</b><p>if the tigers can sign MCAB to a long term contract i'd say it's a great deal for the tigers. seems like the marlins wanted to dump dontrelle's salary also. angels/dodgers must be pissed as they probably could've offered better deals/prospects.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>QUan....the Leyland and DOmbrowski connection had alot to do with it. The DOdgers or Angels didnt have the prospects as the Tigers. Maybin was ranked the #1 player. They say he has the all the Bonds tools w/o the roids. You should see him run.Seriously, he has an extra gear with arms flailing all over the place. He will steal 50 and hit over 30 hr's....just not sure what average he will hit. Miller 98-100mph lefty. BArry, they gave 4 other prospects as well.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>cmoking</b><p>it sounds like you are excited and a Tiger's fan, congrats on the great trade.<br /><br />However, based on this statment: "The Tigers getting Miguel Cabrera and Dontrell WIllis makes this one of baseballs greatest teams ever" ... if you really mean that, don't blame me for thinking you're a fool. But instead of thinking that, I'll just think you are just excited and a fan. <br /><br />P.S. they won't win 100 games. wanna make a wager on that? cmoking@yahoo.com
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jon Canfield</b><p>While I do think the Tigers are top 3, I don't think their run production will be #1 next year - IMHO.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>quan</b><p>yea maybin is REALLY good...maybe not a superstar prospect like a couple others but miller is not considered an elite pitching prospect like kershaw in la or joba/bucholz. i think the dodgers refusal to trade kemp/kershaw broke that deal and marlins wanted maybin instead of an if like kendrick or wood made the tigers the lucky sob <img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14>. i thought the angels could've gotten it done and was excited to see cabrera in anaheim...oh well <img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14> <img src="/images/sad.gif" height=14 width=14><br /><br />will be fun to see cleve/detroit/boston/ny mixing it up next year.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jimi</b><p>Ok, so what's the Top 3 teams now? I vote these in no particular order:<br /><br />1) Tigers<br />2) Red Sox<br />3) Indians<br /><br />Red Sox will be scary with Santana. The Tribe is not doing much shopping this winter....because they don't have to. The scary part about the Tribe is that they have an abundance of starting pitching available for trade. Gee, what a horrible problem that must be!<br><br>Jimi
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jimi</b><p>.....notice no National League team in my top 3. <br><br>Jimi
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Two thoughts: 1) The Sox with Johan is the best team in baseball; 2) the Dodgers do have the prospects: Loney, Kemp, Kershaw, Billingsley, etc.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>Willis doesnt make us the best , the overall will and your bet is on.Wrong choice of words.SInce you didnt put the line-up-up, here goes.<br /><br />Granderson 302 -38 doubles-23triples-23hr's-26 stolen bases. Ordonez 363 and won the batting title(both leagues).GUillen- last 4 yrs -318-320-320-296. Cabrera 320 plus 4 straight yrs 110+rbis and Polonco 341 and NO ERRORS at2b, I believe no errors in over 180 games.ANothe year of Gold GLove for Rodriguez hit 281 , still lifetime is over 300 and hit 330 over 3 yrs different.Renteria 332 another all star,Sheffield 330 best year and will rebound off last years injury.NA JAcque Jones best year was 304.<br /><br />ROgers- Verlandrer and WIllis have been 20 game winners .Bonderman despite an off year still throws 95 and then RObertson is fair.<br /><br />NEXT
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>the Tigers were the Top run producers in both leagues last year .SO now add Renteria and Cabrera over Inge and Thames/Monroe ?<br /><br />another bet sounds like to me.<br /><br />this is an ultimate line up.MAtter of fact, I think that 8 of 9 have been an allstar.4 won g-gloves last year. FIve of the 9 did hit over 300.ANd 4-5 hit over 320.<br /><br />NEXT
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>quan</b><p>it all starts with pitching and boston will be sick good if they get johan! channelling john buccigross...johan/beckett is to boston what lennon/mccartney was to the beatles???<br /><br />detroit's pitching:<br />verlander...Ace and hella good<br />bonderman...solid 2-3<br />Willis...declining stats and will take further hit facing AL hitting<br />Rogers...isn't he 60 and due for a decline?<br />Robertson...don't know much about him but stat's average and typical 5th starter<br /><br />...might not matter much with that offense!!!<br /><br /><br />yes yes finally a bet on n54! i know u guys like multiples or collect identical poses so i propose u each buy a graded card (red cobb sgc40 polar bear?) for the bet and the winner at the end collect both! certainly better than a mutual fund <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>I do agree with you on Santana and the SOx.TIgers will rest assure make the playoffs and out hit everyone. The SOx WILL NOT have the greatest hitting lineup ever....the Tigers have a real possibility of having the greatest hitters on a team at one time ever.<br /><br />That proposal sounds good to me, Quan.....but I propose you to slash your prices and we will be good !
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>cmoking</b><p>Dan, I can see you are really excited, and you should be! I was just razzing you and having some fun. The Tigers won't be a lock, but they surely will be up there with the Yankees and Red Sox as favorites to win the whole thing.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>you are an EBAY trader and Iam a barbs trader, it's all good !
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>on paper tigers?
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Brett</b><p>Just imagine the Red Sox after they get Santana <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Alan U</b><p>Better hope Cabrera doesn't weigh 400 lbs. when he comes to spring training
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>see for yourself and then add 320 and 332 to the lineup
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Mark</b><p>The Cabrera pickup is huge, and the Tigers will likely be amazing, but in terms of a "Starting 8" the team to beat is still the '76 Reds.<br /><br />They had only average pitching, but won the Division by 10 games, and proceeded to sweep both the LCS and World Series. They had 4 players with Hall of Fame Careers. 7 of the 8 starters made the '76 All Star Team, with only Gold Glove Centerfielder Cesar Geronimo failing to make the squad.<br /><br />The '76 Reds led the league in ALL of the following categories...<br /><br />Runs<br />Hits<br />Doubles <br />Triples<br />Home Runs<br />Walks<br />Batting Avg.<br />On-Base %<br />Slugging %<br />Fielding Avg.<br /><br />No other team has ever come close to accomplishing this. <br /><br />Here is how I see the comparison...<br /><br />1B Perez over Guillen<br />2B Morgan over Polanco<br />SS Concepcion/Renteria... tough one... call it a tie<br />3B Rose over Cabrera<br />LF Foster over Jones<br />CF Granderson over Geronimo<br />RF Ordonez over Griffey<br />C Bench over Rodriguez<br /><br />Some of these are very close, but I believe the '08 Tigers are superior at only 2 of the 8 positions. Does anyone disagree? Please be kind, as we Reds fans must often live in the past...<br />
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>howard</b><p>I just looked up the '76 Reds, Mark. That was some serious dominance. They also destroyed the competition in the post-season, including a sweep of my Yankees. I think their offense was better than the current Tigers although I would take Miggy over Rose. BTW, Did you know their hitters also led in Ks? Goes to show how that stat can be misleading. <br /><br />Dan, Rogers and Verlander never when twenty in a season although I suspect Verlander will next year. <br /><br />And don't count out the Yankees as the top lineup, folks. They scored almost 1,000 runs this past season.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>One fo baseballs greatest teams ever? <br /><br />Come on - they haven't even won anything yet - they didn't even make the playoffs last year.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Brian</b><p>As a yanks fan, I am going to be the first in line at the humble pie eating contest. With this move, the tigers become on of the more powerful and age balanced teams in recent history. Their offense will be amazing, if the pitching stays healthy, they will be VERY difficult. Depending what the sox give up for Santana, they could be a team for the history books, dual aces in the rotation, and young to boot has given any die hard yankee fan a twitch in their eye. <br /><br />I don't think that there is a move, short of giving up a box of balls for Haren, and a fungo bat for a decent first baseman, that will help the yanks. Perhaps finding the witch who took all of Damon's hitting abilities and getting her to reverse the spell and give him a throwing arm is a place to start.<br /><br />Crap.<br /><br />
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>joe</b><p>This looks like a great trade. I really got tired of Inge's at bats. I just hope they don't try to put Cabrero in left field and leave Inge at third as writer Tom Gage implied in todays paper. <br /><br />Joe <br><br>Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p><<ROgers- Verlandrer and WIllis have been 20 game winners .>><br /><br /><br />Dan, <br /><br />You realize by now, that this is incorrect. Rogers and Verlander have never won 20 (I think 18 is their peak.) Willis won 22 in 2005, 14 in 2003 and beyond that is a .500 pitcher. He always starts great and then fades. (Let's see how he likes Detroit weather in April!)<br /><br />Anyway, I agree this is a great trade for Detroit. It makes them a much better team. Perhaps even the favorite to win their division. Let's not build a new wing on the Hall of Fame just yet. <br /><br />
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>J Levine</b><p>Unfortunately, pitching wins world series in my opinion and I think the Tigers are weak there. Dontrelle might have a little bump this year but not enough. Rogers is chronically hurt. Verlander has the potential of being hurt ala Kerry Wood and Mark Prior. Their bullpen is not what it used to as well, their middle relief is suspect (although, I think it will be better than last year). Let us not forget that Renteria, Sheffield, Pudge, and Polanco are aging and apt to be hurt. There are no sure things in baseball (I remember this exact discussion on the Cubs a few years ago...Wood, Prior, Rameriez, Soriano, Lee, etc.).<br /><br />I think Detroit will make the playoffs but not sure they will overcome a team with dominant pitching (if the BoSox sign Santana, watch out!).<br /><br />Joshua<br /><br />PS Go Phillies?
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>peter chao</b><p>A lot also depends on Pudge Rodgriguez. For a catcher he had a great year at the bat, however, 2007 is below his normal standards.<br /><br />Also, he is 37 which is old for a tough position.<br /><br />But if he remains healthy and productive the Tigers could go all the way.<br /><br />Peter C.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>howard</b><p>I don't think Pudge is much of a force any more and as a catcher at his age it is very likely that his decline will continue. He had his worst offensive season in about fifteen years (below .300 OBP) and had his worst season throwing out base stealers.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>James Gallo</b><p>First off, no way can you say this is one of the greatest teams ever especially before they have even taken the field.<br /><br />I have seen many a team not gel and blow up!!<br /><br />Second off I think you are over stating things quite a bit.<br /><br />1st base Carlos Guillen Nice player strikes out a lot for the position and the power he gives you.<br /><br />2nd base Placido Polonco Another good player but I think he hit well beyond himself last year. He is around a .300 hitter at best and could be =/- 20-30 points.<br /><br />SS Edgar Renteria Another question mark. His AVG the last time he was in the AM was .276. Nothing great here at all.<br /><br />3rd base Miguel Cabrera Killer pick up and as long as the weight is down should be solid.<br /><br />DH Gary Sheffield He's over the hill. All offense is down will be 40 this year. I wouldn't be too excited about him doing much.<br /><br />R-field Magglio Ordonez Good solid player and proven, but HR and AVG are all over the place. I doubt you will see another .363 season from him.<br /><br />C-field Curtis Granderson Young guy had a break out year last year. Assuming he continues to bat .300ish and not .260 like in 06.<br /><br />L-field Jacque Jones Another player that isn't so great. Both HR and SO dropped 20+ last year so I guess that balances out. Just an average player IMO with a .280 LT BA.<br /><br />Catcher Ivan Rodriguez Will be 37 next year. Another guy that strikes out near 100 times a year. Average coming down and he defense isn't want it used to be.<br /><br />As for the pitchers...<br /><br />starters -J.Verlander- J.bonderman- D.Willis- K.Rogers- N.Robertson<br /><br />I don't know what Willis has and that is a huge question mark.<br />Rogers is OLD and he has up and down seasons at best<br />I know nothing about Robertson.<br /><br />That being said all I want to hear is that you got a little to exciting and although they will likely be a good solid team and near the top of the AM they aren't one of the best ever.<br /><br />If you so stuck on the offense here is a team that I will bet will kill the Tigers in every offense category. The Phillies!!!<br /><br />1st Howard .280 40-60HR maybe more<br /><br />2nd Utley .300-.330 BA 25-35 HR Plenty of doubles<br /><br />SS Rollins .300 BS 25-35 HR NL MVP Nuff Said<br /><br />3rd a bit weak right now but if Iguchi comes back it will be a solid .280+ with lots of potential.<br /><br />C Ruiz Young guy that is just going to get better. Very good defense and I will expect an AVG increase of 10-20 points.<br /><br />LR Burell Gives you another 30 HR<br /><br />CF ?? Not sure yet Rowand or see RF. IF Rowand comes back another .280-.300 hitter with 25-30 HR<br /><br />RF Victorino A very solid young player with 15-20 HR 40+SB and a .280+ AVG.<br /><br />Pitching well we got Myers, Hamels and the old guy Moyer. We got a closer in Lidge<br /><br />There are a few holes, but I would say from an offense stand point they match up very well to the Tigers. Pitching may still need some work but the Tigers are relying on Rodgers and Willis who might be done, and the unproven Robertson.....<br /><br />You jumped the gun just admit it. I will wait and see what the Phillies, Yankees, Bo Sox and the other handful of contending teams do but I would give the Tigers the WS yet.<br /><br />James G<br><br>Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>howard</b><p>James, Dan is just an excited fan and he overstated the Tiger case a bit. Looking at your post I see you did the same with the Phillies. No big deal that's what fans do.<br /><br />The Yanks are gonna score more than both teams anyway : )
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Ben</b><p>Phillies have a great offense too, but aside from Hamels, I dont see their starting pitching being good enough to go all the way. Their relief pitching is questionable too. Lidge has great stuff but he's not the lights out closer he was for that 2-3 year period a few years ago. We know all too well about the struggles he's had with his mental approach to the game. Are they converting Myers back to a SP, or are they still going to run him out in relief? (could never understand why they did that in the first place).
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>you arent even close in anything.This team has all 9 to hit 300. No team in the game has ever had that,yes....not even the great Yankee teams. I play and follow baseball more intensive then most on this board.This team could set a run scoring record, watch and see.There are a couple of post here just for chits and giggles...crap talk is all it is. There are 4 batting titles on this team.And 6 have hit over 330 in their span.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>paulstratton</b><p>The Phillies play in a "bandbox", of course their numbers will look better on the surface. The Sox haven't gotten Santana yet..he may not go anywhere.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Wil Jordan</b><p>It looks like an older version of the Florida Marlins. Before they can be called a great team they need to win something. The questions I have are can they beat the Red Sox? Will the pitching hold up--because when it gets right down to winning a world series it is always about piching not hitter.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>peter chao</b><p>Switching leagues is going to help Dontrelle Willis. The AL hasn't seen much of Dontrelle's unique pitching motion, he should win between 15-20 games next year.<br /><br />Peter C.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>shane leonard</b><p>What an awesome trade the Tigers did with the Marlins. Yes, the Marlins got two great players in Maybin and Miller, but Cabrera is the real deal. I agree with perhaps batting Renteria 2nd vs. 8th. He has much more power than Polanco and is a threat to steal than Polanco. Polanco is more a contact hitter which would be better served in the 8 hole or nine hole to allow the big boys to hit him in.<br /><br />Nice trade and I like it because I have Pudge and Renteria on my fantasy team.<br /><br />Shane
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Shane,<br /><br />Perhaps a bit early to call Maybin and Miller "great" players.<br /><br />I think Placido Polanco is an ideal hitter for the 2 hole. The guy hits .340, goes the other way frequently, makes contact and has reasonable speed. My bet is if Renteria hits .330 again he will bat 3rd in the lineup followed by Ordonez, Cabrera and Sheffield.<br /><br />I hope Inge does not play 3rd. Manager seems to love him. Miggy may end up in left.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Ricky Y</b><p>Now that's a scary lineup! The Tigers (Dombrowski) did a great job in putting that team together in such a short time. Now if BoSox can get Santana ... I'd pay to see that series...<br /><br />Ricky Y
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>PC</b><p>Greatest team ever? At the moment, on paper, they're only the best team in the A.L. Central in 2008.<br /><br />Last time I checked, this is the team that collapsed completely down the stretch in 2007, finishing 8 games behind the Indians and 6 behind the Yanks in the wildcard.<br /><br />A great trade, but you're asking a lot of two players, one of whom could easily be a .500 pitcher.<br /><br />But swing away Los Tigres -- I'm rooting for anyone who can beat the Sox in 2008.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Ed Ivey</b><p>I wonder how Cobb would fit into the lineup.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>go back to your wine. ANd say hello to Ernest and Julio !<br /><br />edited cause I wasnt done with the wino. ALso , you say that each player down the line wont repeat themselves , when in fact they did just have great season. You must live a negative lifestyle along with being dismissed in your second year of T-Ball.<br /><br />you must live in a town with no baseball, cause ya surely dont know it !
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>please forgive me if I ask that they be required to play the games. See, the offense that Cabrera brings is great news for Tigers' fans, no doubt, but they finished with the 3rd most runs and 2nd best batting avg. last year without him, and still lacked the pitching (mostly bullpen) to win 90 games, much less a playoff spot. So if Zamaya doesn't return to form, then you Detoit fans better still remain a bit humble for awhile. Having endured Willis on my roto team last year--he of the 5.17 ERA in a weak-hitting NL, I consider him a #3 at best, that is to say he's no savior. 5.17!!! That's nearly a half-run higher than flippin Nate Robertson, Tigers fans. So enjoy the Kool Aid while you can, and let's see how the September standings look.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>for whatever reason...Leyland brought up several youngsters and sat veterans in the midst of a playoff chance.Rogers ,Verlander and Zumaya were all out. So the wins have nothing to do with the way they dealt there own fate. i as a bystander could not believe what they were doing that whole entire time. Thew weirdest thing I ever saw. There is no team is history that has put a lineup together such as this.Sheffield was hurt and played still...which hurt the team.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>The Tigers were 15-11 in September. Verlander had 6 starts and Rogers 5, and Zamaya piched 10 times that month. They didn't have the pitching all year. Bonderman was awful the second half. Rogers is now what age 75? Todd Jones is not exactly Mr. Automatic. Zamaya's ERA went from under 2 in 2006 to over 4.25, and he was hurt. Willis sucks. If they get their pitching together, they'll win, if not, the Tribe repeats, IMHO. But hey, enjoy the moment. I'm a Twins fan--we're just happy when we keep our guys, and don't allow ourselves to think about acquiring someone else's talent. Still, don't look over your shoulder..............
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>JimCrandell</b><p>Whoops--lets hold the greatest team threads--story out this morning that Tigers may flip Willis due to payroll limitations.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>J Levine</b><p>"no team has ever put together a lineup like this"???<br /><br />Dan, really?<br /><br />That early '30s Yankee lineup really sucked...Dickey, Combs, Ruth, Gehrig, Lazzeri? <br /><br />Or the late '20s A's with Simmons, Cochrane, Cobb, Wheat, Collins, and Foxx.<br /><br />Again...hitting does not win games...great pitching beats great hitting everytime.<br /><br />Joshua
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jim VB</b><p>Dan,<br /><br />Breaking news!!! The rest of the American League has voted to PLAY OUT THE 2008 SEASON!! This despite the obvious dominance of the Tigers. Can you believe it? <br /><br /><br />Peter, <br /><br />Changing leagues will help Willis? Rarely does someone get better when they move from the JV to the Varsity.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>trashing is my field...........c'mon down............NEXT !!!!<br /><br />soon you's will see that...........you big dummies.<br /><br />Iam taking Peter's bet and others of THE GREATEST HITTing team on earth.............next !!!!!
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>howard</b><p>Jim...Peter may be on to something. In fifteen career inter-league starts (including games vs. the Yanks & Bosox) Willis' ERA is more than a run below his National League ERA.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>my post is not based on Willis. Evelyn Woodhead does have reading courses.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Brian</b><p><<3B Rose over Cabrera>><br /><br />The 1968 and 1969 Rose years are the only ones remotely close to Cabrera's. Rose's best year in total bases was 1969 with 321. Cabrera is better than that the last three years.<br /><br />I take Cabrera over Rose in a heart beat.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>DMcD</b><p>Joshua: And vice versa.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Larry</b><p>27 Yankees and 76 Reds would pull a 4 game sweep on this Tigers team. <br /><br />27 Yankees vs. 76 Reds? Yankees 4 games to 3
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>paulstratton</b><p>You're probably going to have to beat Beckett at least once, if not twice, to win a series against the Sox. There weren't any pitchers available, except Santana and they weren't going to trade him inside their division to the Tigers, so you have to try to make Beckett go through a monster lineup twice.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>DAn Koteles</b><p>see what Detroit did to him last year.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Dan, I agree that Detroit has a wonderfully balanced lineup -- and potent to the nth degree. However, in a 7 game series, which team is beating this starting four: Beckett (2 games), Santana (2 games), Dice K, Schilling? Answer: no team because great pitching beats great hitting every time.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>noone will outhit the Tigers .EVeryone wants to pick on Rogers, remember 3 straight shutouts in the playoffs the year before.His imjury again was a blood clot, not a rotator. Forget he is 43...he is a master locator like John Tudor and is more enduring. Verlander can match any of those guys.....Bonderman will come back, the guy has some sick pitches, then Willis?....I think all are wrong about him.HE will give you 200 + innings AND has finally getting run support .When you go to the park knowing you are going to win, it falls into place. YOu automatically play better with better people.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Chris Counts</b><p>Ultimately, it's pitching that wins championships, and I'm not convinced Willis will make a difference. He kind of reminds me of Barry Zito in that he walks a lot of batters and his strikeouts are going down each year. I believe that's because Willis, like Zito, has deceptive stuff, but hitters are learning to lay off his pitches since he throws a lot of pitches out of the strike zone. <br /><br />As for Cabrera, he's obviously a great young hitter, but baseball history is filled with great hitting teams that came up short ... there's a really good reason teams are willing to trade excellent everyday players like Orlando Cabrera for average but durable pitchers like Jon Garland.<br /><br />Personally, I like the Tigers. I was born in Flint, Michigan, which defintely qualifies as Tiger country. But I'm afraid their pitching is too dependant on fading guys like Kenny Rogers and Todd Jones. Plus, it looks like Joel Zumaya, who has the best stuff in their bullpen, could be out all season ...<br /><br />I'm looking forward to watching their lineup, but I believe they'd have a better team with Dan Haren or Erik Bedard, two guys that could have been had for some combination of the prospects that went to Florida. Imagine last year's Tiger lineup and a rotation of Haren, Verlander and Bonderman ...
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>James Gallo</b><p>Howard---Exactly what did I overstate? All my Phillies numbers were pulled from the last few years of experience. I looks at the numbers and that is what I posted. I don't think I over stated things at all. Did you look over the numbers?<br /><br />Ben--- Yes I aware the Phillies need some help in the pitching department and I never said the pitching was that strong. Myers is back as a starter and Lidge will have Gordon as a back up closer.<br /><br />Dan fist off you need to CHILL OUT!!!!<br /><br />Real original Wine comments jeee like I haven't heard that before.<br /><br /><br />Have you looked at your own damn team numbers?<br /><br />Last years BA from the Tigers OWN WEB SITE<br /><br />Rodriguez .281<br />Sheffield .265 Hasn't hit .300 since 2002<br />Guillen .296<br />Jones .285 and that was the closest he has been to .300 for 4 years.<br />Granderson his last 4 years were .240, .272, .260 and .302 so all of a sudden he is a .300 hitter give me a break.<br /><br /><br />I don't see more then 4 maybe 5 tops guys who are going to bat over .300 next year. I do see 2 guys over the hill and 2 guys that haven't proven anything in Jones and Granderson.<br /><br /><br />Oh and Dan Why not read over your owns posts, here is one for you<br />"noone will outhit the Tigers .EVeryone wants to pick on Rogers, remember 3 straight shutouts in the playoffs the year before.His imjury again was a blood clot, not a rotator. Forget he is 43...he is a master locator like John Tudor and is more enduring. Verlander can match any of those guys.....Bonderman will come back, the guy has some sick pitches, then Willis?....I think all are wrong about him.HE will give you 200 + innings AND has finally getting run support .When you go to the park knowing you are going to win, it falls into place. YOu automatically play better with better people."<br /><br />The following words are in my dictionary<br />noone<br />imjury<br /><br />You might try a grammer check too and ease up on those CAPS TOO!!<br /><br />Once again as I said lets see them play some games and you need to chill out. I hit you with facts and you come with wine comments are you 6 because that is sure they way your acting.....<br /><br /><br />James G<br><br>Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>"Verlander can match any of those guys" Ahh, Dan, hope springs eternal. I think the Tigers' pitchers have potential but as of today no way can they match Beckett in the playoffs. And Santana is just more experienced... I only hope that the Sox and the Tigers get to the Championship Series because it will be one of the most anticipated series in a long while.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>Iam acting like Iam 8, not 6. You correct my accidental spelling and didnt even spell grammar right. You put "er", er meaning stands for your baseball thoery,eeeeeeRRRRrReeeeeRRRRRRRR<br /><br />I love the way you respond to me ,it is like a 10 yr old picking on a 8 year old , you bully you ! whhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Mark Steinberg</b><p>Brian: <br />I was wondering how long it would take to get a disagreement on the "Rose over Cabrera" comparison... I thought I'd get hammered more on that one, as this was the one I labored with the most. <br /><br />You are probably right about Cabrera "on paper", but having lived and breathed it back in the day, I can tell you that Rose was so tough under pressure and in games that mattered. He really brought with him an infectious "never say die" attitude. This was well before all of the gambling nonsense and other poor decisions he made. Unfortunately (and perhaps deservedly so) he will be remembered more for the corruption. But the man did amass more hits than Cobb, for Pete's sake. (horrible unintended pun.... sorry!)<br /><br />Larry:<br />I agree with you about the '27 Yanks vs. the '76 Reds... probably Yankees in seven. But wouldn't that be an amazing World Series to watch? Perhaps not the greatest pitching, but what a potential slugfest... a meeting of the Gods!
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>James Gallo</b><p>Man I provide all the facts and all you manage to do is pick out one misspelling. I must have really hit the nail on the head cause you got nothing to say about ANY of the FACTS I put out.<br /><br />Good luck to the Tigers I will be happy to see them fall on their faces.<br /><br />James G<br /><br />Now back to cards please.<br><br>Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Howard</b><p>James, it looks to me like you analyzed the Tigers and Phillies lineups in different ways. You looked for the possible negatives for the Detroit while you did the opposite for Philly. For example, you project Rollins as a .300 hitter when, in fact, he never hit .300 in a season. Not even last year when he won the MVP. However, you also describe Polanco as "around a .300 hitter at best". So to you the guy who has a lifetime .305 BA and batted .340 last year and the guy who never once hit .300 are apparently both basically .300 hitters. Can you honestly say you would have put the same spin on them if Rollins was on the Tigers and Polanco was still on the Phillies?<br /><br />Also, this line: "Ruiz young guy who is just going to get better". Really? Why? He's not really young (28 when next season starts) and it seems just as likely to me that he'll decline next year.<br /><br />You think Iguchi will hit a solid .280 plus next year and he has lots of potential. Maybe. But I see a 33 year old w/a lifetime BA lower than .280 coming off his worst year. What would your description of him been if he was on the Tigers?<br /><br />Rowand will hit 25-30 HRs. Again..maybe. But you base this on his career year last season and discount the previous two seasons when he totaled about 25 HRs in about 1,000 ABs.<br /><br />Maybe your right and everything will fall into place but I will bet you that the Tigers score more runs than the Phillies next season. And Dan, I'll bet you that the Yankees score more runs than the Tigers next year.<br /><br />Now keep debating, guys. It's entertaining.<br /><br />Howard
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>you trashed my spelling while you misspelled first as fist and trash me while you couldnt even spell grammar.Now you come along and act as if you can tell me to hush while you get your last word in like some dictator.Iam the "dic" here and you are the "tator". you will dig a deeper hole as we merily go along.<br /><br />Talking with you is the same as chasing a dead snake. Put your money up son.....that is all the talking you need to do.<br /><br />BAck to cards JAmes, do you have anything to mention ?<br /><br />you have a deal Howard....thank you for the friendly bet. James can you do that for your Fightin'Phillies? Thanks also Howard for mentioning his Philly comparisons....the silly Phillian. GET OFF THE "BOONSEFARM" !<br /><br />editing was for Howard's bet and I had to correct some bunching.James , I bet you do not know the meaning of bunching?<br /><br />A)togetherness<br />B)a build up in a Gallo head<br />C)a partridge in a pear tree
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>I don't know why I post in this thread, as I don't have real strong feelings on the subject, but Dan, I don't think the '08 Tigers are even the best baseball team from Detroit in the past quarter century. I believe the '84 team would take them out in a seven game series nearly every time. Give me Lance Parrish, Trammell, Whitaker, HoJo, Darrell Evans, Kirk Gibson and Chet Lemon over today's group, and give me the '84 pitching staff, which had a better rotation--headed by Jack Morris--and a studly bullpen led by MVP Willie Hernandez. The more I think of it, the more I have trouble believing the '08 Tigers could even stretch that series to 7 games.
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>J Levine</b><p>Years ago I had a program that I could plug teams into using the year's stats including both pitching and batting and match them up and have them play a 7 game series to see who the better team. I used to love to plug my Phillies in and play them against the '27 Yanks, or the '69 Mets, or the upcoming years lineups. I would love to use this on the Tigers against some teams and see what happens...anybody remember this?<br /><br />Joshua
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OT/....One of baseballs greatest teams?...Detroit Tigers
Posted By: <b>shane leonard</b><p>Jim,<br />I agree that Polanco is a great opposite field hitter. Over the past three seasons Polanco has improved in every offensive catagory, perhaps getting more AB's has allowed him to become more consistant at the plate. I believe he only hit 8 homers last year in that lineup, but had an incredible BA and OBA. I would personally hit him after Pudge to not only clean up the guys on base, but be an on base threat for the top of the order. <br />Maybin and Miller are in the top 5 prospects in the MLB. Both are studs at their positions, and both will be future stars in the league. The NL has always played and succeeded in the small ball arena. Maybin has all the tools to play this game and will be a Jose Reyes type player. Once Miller gets more comfortable pitching in the big leagues, his control will improve. His height and velocity reminds scouts very much like a Randy Johnson. <br /><br />Shane
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