T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Adam J. Baxter</b><p>I know these hardly ever come up for sale, but I was curious to know how much these are going for nowadays? <br /><br />Good, Very Good, Excellent?

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>bruce Dorskind</b><p><br /><br />T 211 Red Sun Tobacco cards are quite rare, and like many minor league issues,<br />their scarcity is not reflected in the value because there are only a small<br />sampling of collectors whose interest is focused on this issue.<br /><br />SGC has graded only 120 cards and PSA has graded 21 Red Sun Cards.<br />The highest recorded grade is SGC 80 and PSA 6.<br /><br />Only 3 SGC examples received this rather remarkable grade and PSA has<br />graded two cards in condition 6.<br /><br />There has been limited activity in public auctions. In December 2006<br />two SGC cards graded 40 and 30 traded on E Bay at prices in the $450-490 range<br />In 2005 a high profile Goodwin Auction brought over $1200 for an SGC 30 example.<br /><br />In late 2005, we obtained one of the three known SGC 80 cards in a private<br />transaction. We currently have said card insured for $2750.00<br /><br />Bruce Dorskind<br />America's Toughest Want List

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Cobby33</b><p>We agree with Bruce, et al., althoughh there is only one of "us." Oh well.<br /><br />P.S. We will also add that there are a few lower-grade examples of same in existence.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>James Feagin</b><p>I picked up a SGC 40 T211 Sid Smith a couple months back for $410. Hope that helps a bit. Huggins and Scott has a SGC 50 up in their/our next auction.<br /><br />James

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Average gd-vg ones will usually be in the $300-$400 range and there are a few folks collecting the set. If it's one they need you can add another $100 or so....higher grade ones will go for siginificantly more. I would guess a nice EX one could be in the $700-$900 range...but personally I haven't seen too many go that high...though I certainly could have missed some sales...

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>The supply of T211s and, maybe more so T209s, seem to have dried up.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Adam J. Baxter</b><p>Thanks for all the great info guys, I appreciate it. I don't track prices/auctions as fervently as others on the board, so I'm not always up to date on current prices. I remember T211's being $100, 150, 200 about two years ago and I'm not surprised by the price jump as they are both scarce and visually appealing. I've thought about picking up an example or two in the distant future to go along with my T210's, which is why I was curious. <br /><br />Jay- <br /><br />I can't speak for the major auctions, but as far as EBay goes I think your right on the money. T211's don't even come up occasionally anymore and neither do their T226 boxing counterparts. It's seems to be the same thing with T209's, especially the second series. Popularity is playing a big role for both these issues as so many collectors are working on sets. Similar to what's been going on with T210's. They're all equally great sets, so climbing prices are probably long overdue.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Dan Koteles</b><p>If they are available, who is putting the sets together? The backs on Red SUn are neat, but the cards are ugly. But this is why there are different collectors for everything.<br /><br />Even way back when Sloate, Verkman, Festberg, Wheat, Knouse...etc were around or SCD, you rarely ever seen a Red Sun. I guess iam not understanding the popularity here.<br /><br />I hope you get some and your agreed price points.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>vg/ex T211s should sell for at least $600--I would not take that for mine.<br /><br />I also believe T209s, while scarce themselves, are found noticeably more often than T211s. <br /><br />BTW, I don't think they're ugly at all.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>bruce Dorskind</b><p>In comments with the regard to the relative rarity of the T 211 Red Sun<br />Tobacco cards, two Board Members noted that they were<br />aware of several collectors who were collecting the set.<br /><br />We find this observation to be questionable since neither SGC nor PSA<br />have a single registered set collector for T 211 Red Sun Set.<br /><br />Within the past 16 months there have only been six public auctions<br />(Vintage Card Prices.com) where a Red Sun has traded. It is worth noting<br />that the Victory cards, often identified as the rarest tobacco issue (excluding<br />Fan Cigarettes) had four examples traded in public auctions.<br /><br />Whilst PSA have graded a mere six examples from the rare Red Sun Series,<br />SGC has graded 121 examples. There are a plethora of other type cards<br />where far fewer examples have been graded which have still attracted <br />collectors to register their sets.<br /><br />Accordingly, we would like to know which collectors are puting sets<br />together, why they have not registerd said sets and if that information<br />is not available the basis for the comments that several collectors are<br />putting together sets.<br /><br />Bruce Dorskind<br />America's Toughest Want List

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Dan is correct in that all my years in the business I have had only a handful of Red Suns, and I never gave it much thought. But now that it has been brought up, they are pretty darn rare. Problem is, if I had one in 1995, I probably got $25 for it. We didn't pay as much attention to cards like T211 back then, as they were more just an offbeat issue that very few people cared about. It just shows you another way the hobby has changed.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>scott brockelman</b><p>just because they are not on any registry is irrelavant, that does not mean there are not highly competitive collectors chasing these elusive cards. There are many very tough and desirable sets owned by collectors on this board that are not on "the registry".<br /><br />When I gave up on the Red Suns I had 30 different, It was becoming very difficult to acquire more so I succumbed to greed and sold out.<br /><br />Scott

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>JimB</b><p>I picked up a T211 Seabaugh about ten years ago at a show from a guy who had mostly shiney stuff, but a handful of Goudeys and this card in the back corner of his case. I did not get the impression he knew what it was. I would guess it was just thrown in with a handful of other older cards he bought once and had been sitting on for a while. <br />JimB

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>I have one T211. I regret passing on a chance at buying half a dozen at a good price several years ago. All I have is Welf, Nashville. Seems T210s distracted me after I got one T211 as a type card.<br /><br />Instead of asking why T211 collectors haven't registered their sets, can we ask why anyone should register a set?? I'm a bit touchy about who knows I collect, and what they know. Registering somewhere indicating an interest in the cards could drive up prices. So what's the upside on this registering thing???<br /><br />Realistically, Red Suns are undervalued if compared to T206s... T206 collectors vastly outnumber folks after even one T211. So that demand is what disparately drives the prices of T206s beyond what the normal price differential should be if only supply were considered. At least that is my non-expert, lay, fact-less opinion.<br /><br />

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>bruce Dorskind</b><p><br /><br />Frank<br /><br />We totally disagree with your philosphy. <br /><br />As you well know, price especially in this hobby, is a function of supply and demand.<br /><br />One of our objectives as a collector of the rare materials is to bring more examples,<br />particularly the best known examples extant, to market. The most efficient way to<br />accomplish this objective is to alert the potential, albeit unknown, seller that he<br />could realize a very high price for his items.<br /><br />Our guess is that as a result of this thread, the price of Red Suns, particularly higher<br />grade examples wll rise. And that is a good thing because the higher the prices<br />the more likely it is that there will be a seller.<br /><br />As Barry Sloate pointed out, even if he had a Red Sun in the early 1980's why would<br />he recall the sale of a $25.00 card.<br /><br />We aggressively pursue a plethora of rare issues and do all we can to create buzz<br />in the marketplace with the hope that collectors will test the market and sell or auction<br />their super rare top condition items. <br /> <br /><br /><br />Bruce Dorskind<br />America's Toughest Want List

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Zach Rice</b><p>I own only one T211, too. I'd love to own more but with the prices they bring even in poor condition and their lack of availability, I don’t think I’d be making much progress any time soon. <br /><br /><br />I agree with Jay when he stated that both T209s and T211s have dried up. At the time I purchased my T211 there were at least two others with BINS in people's eBay stores. I feel very fortunate to have put together a grouping of 30 T209-2s but I haven't added a new one to my collection in over a month.<br />

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>DD</b><p>We would like to know how many sets Bruce has on the various card grading registries. Whilst we have viewed a cadre of sets listed by a plethora of well known collectors such as Don Louchios, Marshall Fogel, Charles Merkel, extant, we cannot locate any listings by Mssr. Dorskind.<br /><br />Since it is clearly important to pay as much as possible for the hallowed pieces of cardboard of our childhoods', can we see some examples of your collection. Surely, the prices would rise just by the rest of us seeing your treasured items.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jeff O</b><p>Bruce,<br /><br />Earlier in this thread you wrote:<br /><br />"Accordingly, we would like to know which collectors are puting sets<br />together, why they have not registerd said sets and if that information<br />is not available the basis for the comments that several collectors are<br />putting together sets."<br /><br />I guess my question is, how is any of this any of your business? I understand that you (plural) apparently collect this type of material, so you (plural) probably have an interest in locating additional examples. I'm just not sure why you (plural) feel like posters need to identify others by name, who may wish to remain private in their collecting pursuits. I also don't see how it's any of your (plural) business on why anyone decides to either register or not register their stuff.<br /><br />Jeff Obermeyer<br />America's Toughest Seattle Hockey Wantlist<br />

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Adam J. Baxter</b><p>Not to ruffle anyone's feathers, but I posted this thread to simply to inquire about prices on an interesting issue, not create a debate about set registries, market speculation, etc. I like to believe, perhaps innocently, that this is still a hobby. I'm not naive enough to believe that money doesn't play a role in it, but I'm tired of treating this hobby like an F***ing stock exchange.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I'm with you Adam. And I think most people do treat it like a hobby.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>I don't mind being disagreed with.... sometimes I don't agree with myself.<br /><br /><br />But please tell me why folks do this set registry thing...

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Frank--I think it lets people compete in areas where there would be no competition without grades. The vast majority of registry sets are not difficult to complete. So, the grading companies, mostly PSA, have come up with an interesting marketing ploy to get people to compete for an aggregate number rather than just for completeness. They've thrown the chum in the water and the fish are swarming. It's an ego thing. I'm not immune--I have a few registry sets of newer material but the vast majority of my collection is unslabbed.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jay- I think it's just an example of different hobby philosophies. The oldtimers collect for fun, and a little profit along the way never hurts. The set registry people are in it purely for the competition, and while they all say they are having fun, they have a lot more fun being #1 than #2, and even less fun being #3 or #4.<br /><br />It's really the oldtime way to collect vs. the 21st century way to collect! Or if you prefer, the haves vs. the have-nots (or the have-some) <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Why is it such a difficult concept for some people to understand? This isn't quantum physics: certain collectors want to have the best set of a certain issue that exists. With the set registry, the best graded sets are easily comparable. The more significant question is: why do seemingly intelligent people repeatedly claim that they don't understand the rationale behind the set registry?

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I fully understand the rationale, just isn't my cup of tea. But clearly there is a need for it, as it has gained a huge following and a significant piece of the market. I just think it is one of those hot button issues that causes debate every time it is brought up on the board.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Jeff--I hear what you're saying but the whole registry comparison process is somewhat artificial. Let me give you an example. Consider two 1948 Leaf boxing sets. One set has a grade of 7.4 but lacks a Graziano, the Wagner of boxing cards. The other has an a grade of 7.3 but has a Graziano. Which is the best set? In my mind the second is the best set, no question. However, if these were the only two registry sets listed the first would be listed as the current finest.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jay- aren't registry sets supposed to be weighted based on rarities?<br /><br />If I have 5 T206 commons that grade PSA 8, and you only have a Wagner that grades PSA 1, do I have the better set?

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Rob Dewolf</b><p>Whilst (sorry) I totally understand the rationale of the set registry, I am surprised by the large number of collectors I run across who use the registry as the definitive source for how many sets of a certain issue are "out there."<br /><br />This example is totally anecdotal, but I completed a 1952 Num-Num set about 10 years ago. Granted, this isn't a T-205, but it's not 1987 Topps, either. Because of the set's Bob Kennedy card -- a card that's really underappreciated in terms of rarity -- my guess is that there aren't many complete sets. But I've never considered having the set graded, let alone registering it. So by what percentage am I skewing the population number regarding complete sets?<br /><br />My guess is that there are numerous examples like this, albeit not as many when the topic is T211s. But to automatically assume that a set registry or population number is the end-all source is a mistake, IMHO.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Barry--Many sets in the registry have no weighting. The grade is just the sum of all your grades divided by the number of cards in the set. In the example I gave a Graziano is worth no more (registry wise) than a Willie Pep.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>The registry can only go with the information it has. It is still relatively new, so ten years down the road the information will probably be more accurate. I'm sure new cards are being added each week as more get graded.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Jay, you've obviously taken an extreme example: a set where there is no weight given to rarer cards. Regardless, I don't think your example is what the Registry nay-sayers are talking about. Basically, anyone who collects differently than they do is met with puzzled looks, scratched heads and seeming shock that anyone can do things differently than they do.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Jay- if that is true, and I am pretty sure that HOfers are weighted more than commons, then using my example of the 5 T206 commons vs. the Wagner, at any given moment I would gladly trade my better set for your worse set. That's an odd way of looking at it.<br /><br />If I have a Cobb that grades 7 and a common that grades 8, and you have a Cobb that grades 8 and a common that grades 7, you mean to say we are tied on the registry?

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>Bruce- I read your statement this morning:<br /><br />"In comments with the regard to the relative rarity of the T 211 Red Sun<br />Tobacco cards, two Board Members noted that they were<br />aware of several collectors who were collecting the set.<br /><br />We find this observation to be questionable since neither SGC nor PSA<br />have a single registered set collector for T 211 Red Sun Set."<br /><br /><br />I am not sure what you find questionable about what I said. Do you find me questionable, or just what I said I know? Do you really think the registry is what all collecting should be graded (pun intended) by? I just came back from seeing a collection of high grade, medium grade, and lower grade cards. Nineteenth century through 21st with a concentration on pre-war. I only saw baseball because I only had 5 hours or so to spend there. I didn't even know this person had a T211 set (minus 1-2) until today. He showed me a small handful of slabbed cards and said that's all he had and he could care less about grading. There are far more collectors like that than I think any of us really know. ...You can collect your way and I'll collect mine but please don't find me questionable when I state I know something. I am always prepared to back it up. (though I wouldn't divulge the names in public).....I hope you understand what I am saying.....thanks much<br /><br />edited to say the T211's would probably grade 3-6+ and the total collection was thousands of cards and is almost all e-sets, t-sets etc.....

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>Leon, interesting point. I have some sets on the registry but also collect other sets that I have not bothered to enter on the registry despite collecting graded versions of them. I guess I don't put them on because the cards are very slow to come by...and while I expect to complete the set someday it won't be anytime in the future - and the sets are rare enough that very few registered sets even exist. I guess to each his own -- even within the registry set guys.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Barry-Some sets are weighted, like T206, and others, like '48 Leaf boxing, are not.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>RC McKenzie</b><p>T211's don't pop up very often on ebay, but they do show up occasionally, about as often as e105 from what I've seen. I've never bought one because they are expensive and most of the players are unknown to me, Sid Smith may be considered a star along with Bay, relative to the other players in the issue. The boxers series has some pretty famous boxers, but they don't sell cheap when they show up. Would be fun to know what 2 cards are missing from the fellows set. regards

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Cobby33</b><p>We find this analogous to 3rd grade. Some kids would show off their new baseball gloves at school the next week. Some would keep them until they needed them. Same thing here, "not that there's anything wrong with it," either way.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>RC McKenzie</b><p>I know I like to look on sgc at the registries of other collectors of sets I collect. It's fun to see folks list what cards they have of rare sets on sgc. I will probably never list anything on there just because sgc is in NJ and I don't like sending my cards out in the mail for folks to grade my cards unless I am going to sell them, and even then it's a hassle. If I lived in NJ, I'd probably drive over there and drop off a bunch of cards b/c their holders protect cards better than a top loader.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>I think people's personalities dictate to a large degree how they collect. I do not consider myself a particularly competitive person. When I was an active collector, I always tried to get the rarest historical pieces I could, but I always knew some people had the means to have a better collection than me, and others on a tighter budget would probably not be able to afford what I had. I kind of knew it went with the territory. So if I were collecting today I doubt I would have much interest in the registry.<br /><br />On the other hand, some people are fiercely competitive and need to be the best at everything. So I suspect they would feel the same way about their collections.<br /><br />And as Jeff said, some sets interest him simply because they are rare, and others because it's challenging to try and assemble the best one possible.<br /><br />So what is my point? I have no idea <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14>

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Dave Hornish</b><p>Barry:<br /><br />Just curious-do you still have a collection at all or are you solely a dealer/auctioneer? You seem so passionate about the hobby I can't believe you didn't keep at least a few goodies. I guess in a way an auctioneer is a short term collector?<br /><br />Dave

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Yes- I've kept a few rare display pieces, primarily from the 1860's and 70's, mostly photographs and color lithographs, and some rare books, including some from the 1830's that are the first in America to depict baseball.<br /><br />I do not, however, have any cards other than my inventory. I consider that my rotating collection. I enjoy them for the short time I own them, but they all end up with the highest bidder.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>bruce Dorskind</b><p><br /><br />In response to a number of comments and questions<br /><br /><br />1. We are interested in Set Registry for three reasons:<br /><br />(A) Rarity- whilst it is not a perfect tool to assess rarity, it is as accurate a tool as is available.<br /><br />No one tracks unregistered and/ungraded cards and there is large discrepancy about condition<br />with regard to cards that have not been graded by a professional service.<br /><br />As a collector, one is likely to decide whether or not to collect a particular issue or card based<br />on a number of factors. Two of those factors would be the relative availability of the card<br />in the desired condition. The population report, the pricing reports and the set registry reports <br /> are tools which will provide a collector with the desired information<br /><br />(B) We assume that if there are no collectors with a registry set that the cards and/or the set may be<br />very rare<br /><br />C) We like to know who has what ..that information provides us with market intlligence which we will<br />attempt to use for competitive advantage as we bid in auctions, purchase privately or bid on E-Bay.<br />We certainly study every registered "target set." We have contacted a number of collectors with sets where<br />we had an interest. On a number of occasions we were able to work out favorable transactions<br />with said collectors. <br /><br />Any intelligence we can gather can prove valuable. For three years we monitored the 2nd-4th runner ups<br />on more than 1000 E Bay auctions. We have recorded this information, identified the collectors/dealers<br />and later used the information to our advantage.<br /><br />Finally, we do not post any sets on the set registry because we don't collect sets.<br /><br /><br />Bruce Dorskind<br />America's Toughest Want List<br />

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Anonymous</b><p>In regards to the registry I agree with Leon. Most cards arent accounted for on the set registries. It would be ridiculous to assume that just because a set isnt acounted for on a registry that its not being pursued by collectors. <br />When you compare the relative scarcity of T211, and others like it(T215,T216) to T206 ofcourse the price of T206's will appear inflated. But it's difficult to collect these more obscure sets so demand goes down. E106 ive felt was undervalued due to its relative scarcity to other E1 sets. Its been increasing as of late though. But when dealing with minor league players, no matter how scarce or beautiful, the set will be lacking in name recognition. If T211 had a Weaver, a Chick Gandil, or a couple HOF's it would be very highly prized. Its unique and colorful back grabs your attention, but it would need some name recognition to make it a top tier set.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>Thank you Jay, Bruce, Barry....<br /><br />I think I now understand it. I've never seen a registry, I'm guessing it is on the net somewhere. It seems a very clever marketing scheme, only way I could get some of my stuff on there would be to get it slabbed.<br /><br />And without maligning registry collectors, I see it as a new way to competitively collect, one that isn't attractive to old style collectors.<br /><br />Bruce, I can see that some of the high profile registry collectors tip their hands as to what they'd be after, or not, by registering that stuff... Just don't understand why you started with a 1. if all that was to follow was A B C...<br /><br />I guess I should try to find registry stuff on a site somewhere someday to fully understand it. Can anyone go look at the stuff, or do you need a password, membership number or some such?<br /><br />Frank.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>navigate from here:<br /><br /><a href="http://www.psacard.com/set_registry/" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://www.psacard.com/set_registry/</a>

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>RC McKenzie</b><p>Judge Wakefield,<br /><br />You don't need a password to look at the registered sets. Go to sgc.com and click on the 'registered sets' link. There are some amazing collections on there. Most don't have photos, but it's a good place to see what's out there. best regards

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>JimB</b><p>The registry is not only about competition. I put my E93 set up there several years ago with the hope of connecting with other E93 collectors and that is exactly what happened. Before I even knew about this board, I met other caramel collectors through my set and e-mail being on the registry. Being that I was trying to put together a high-grade set, it also enabled me to learn about more cards too. Often if people want to sell a high-grade card, they will look to see who is collecting that set on the registry and offer them the card. I was offered several nice E93s as a result of being visible in that way. The presumptions about competition, while sometimes accurate, are a bit knee-jerk in my opinion since that is certainly not always the case. There are many more low and mid-grade sets on the registry than there are high-grade. It is just that you all take note of the high-grade sets.<br />JimB

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Frank Wakefield</b><p>Gentlemen,<br /><br />Thank you. I think I understand the registry thing much better. Even went to it and looked at it a bit.<br /><br />It still seems like a blatant way of hyping slabbing to me...<br /><br /><br />But, I can see that if I had a set or near set graded and registered, then others who collected or had graded stuff could see where I was, and they might contact me offering to fill gaps I had, or offering upgrades. And that would be a pretty good deal. Now, for me, I find myself searching for the few cards I'm after... I'd love to have folks seeing my desires and contacting me with offers. So I truly see a real upside to the Registry process.<br /><br />I cannot see myself ever using it. But I see why folks who liked slabbed cards, or only high grade slabbed cards, why those folks would like it.<br /><br />And without me having asked you folks, and without you guys having patience to answer what seems obvious to you, I'd still not understand. So thank you. Notwithstanding my old biases, even I'm educable.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>robert a</b><p>Jim B.<br /><br />You have a knack for bringing out the positive aspects. <br />I've personally never been involved with a set registry, but you're living proof that not everyone who is involved is overly competitive or trying to hype their cards, etc.<br /><br />Rob

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>There are certainly some positives associated with the set registry, as Jim B. has clearly pointed out.<br /><br />The out of control wild prices that certain cards bring, however, when two or more high grade collectors set preposterously high snipes, may not be one of them.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>David Seaborn</b><p>Like JimB, I have found the set registry (in this case SGC's) to be another useful way to communicate with other collectors of the sets in which I am interested. An additional benefit is the ability to load scans of your cards (just like in photobucket, etc.). This way I can enjoy my collection without worrying about the safety of the cards. Finally, you can stay anonymous on the registry. You have the option of not supplying any contact information for others to see if you want to remain under the radar.<br /><br />I think it works for some and not for others. That doesn't make it wrong or right - just a useful tool for a percentage of vintage collectors, especially those of us who collect sets. Barry's point about out of control prices on certain cards just because of their graded population is certainly well founded though.

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>leon</b><p>though I don't care for the exact ending amount dollar # I was pretty close when I said:<br /><br />"I would guess a nice EX one could be in the $700-$900 range...but personally I haven't seen too many go that high"<br /><br /><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/1910-T211-Red-Sun-Atlanta-Crackers-Rogers-Baseball-Card_W0QQitemZ280080525306QQihZ018QQcategoryZ86841 QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item280080525306" target="_new">http://cgi.ebay.com/1910-T211-Red-Sun-Atlanta-Crackers-Rogers-Baseball-Card_W0QQitemZ280080525306QQihZ018QQcategoryZ86841 QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item280080525306</a>

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Todd Schultz</b><p>I think it was a steal. My lone T211 has much wider borders, but I see that the example listed on Old Cardboard is more in line with the one just sold. Maybe others could post scans of their T211s:<br /><br /><img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1171650075.JPG"> <br /><br />Edited to add: If that card was slabbed with any numeric grade it would have added at least another $200 to the price IMHO. I believe these cards are so scarce that most collectors are unfamiliar with them, and would shy away from raw examples, other than perhaps very low grade ones, for fear of the unknown.<br /><br />edited pic to be smaller (leon)

T211 Red Sun prices
 

Posted By: <b>Bob</b><p>Bruce- I would give two words of caution regarding the set registries:<br /><br />If you look at the PSA registry for E94s, you will see Brian Daniels' set as far and away number one but after that there are only 2 or 3 other sets registered and they have only a couple of cards graded in them, not even a fifth of the set. I have 4 complete sets of E94s and pieces of 2 others and could easily have the 2nd highest graded E94 set on PSA but I have no inclination to register them. <br />Also, all of my E94s are slabbed but they are about equally divided between PSA, SGC and GAI so although I could put together one very highly graded set the grading companies would be mixed.<br />I am not bragging about my cards but merely pointing out that there are nice high graded sets out there, even slabbed, which aren't on any registers. <br /><br />Bob

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Posted By: <b>JimB</b><p>Rob,<br />Thanks for the kind words.<br /><br />TBob,<br />You are very right about presumptions about what is out there. I know of some extremely nice caramel sets out there that are fully graded, but not on either registry.<br />JimB

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Posted By: <b>Jason L</b><p>Why do people use the set registry?<br /><br />Pride<br />Ego<br />Sense of Accomplishment<br />Networking<br />Killing time until the next episode of Seinfeld<br />

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Posted By: <b>Jeff Lichtman</b><p>I think Bob has hit the point here: on prewar sets, many cards are graded by SGC instead of PSA. Therefore, most collectors are loathe to crack them out or cross them to PSA solely to get on the Registry. Different story for postwar sets which are mostly PSA-graded. As an example, I have a handful of PSA graded T206s which are on my Registry set; however, I have dozens and dozens that are in GAI or SGC holders. Why bother crossing them over - especially since I love the black backgrounds that the other two grading companies provide?

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>One thing about the registry I don't understand is that sets are listed that are less than half complete, and in some cases less than 25% complete. Shouldn't a set be completed, or darn close to it, to qualify for inclusion? It appears there are almost no minimum requirements.

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Posted By: <b>Jason L</b><p>a card or two...I have seen this before...<br /><br />one purpose it does serve is to help collectors find others with the same interests...this has helped me quite a bit in the past - bugging other collectors who have listed their email address, looking for dupes, etc...<br /><br />other than that, I dunno...<br />

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Posted By: <b>Marc</b><p>It may seem counter-intuitive but as a collector of "major" sets (T205, 206, 207) and a collector of some rare smaller sets (Scrapps, Lections, etc.) I DON'T want to see competition that leads to value increases. I would be overjoyed if everybody felt that their T207s were worthless and undesirable and would therefore be willing to sell them (to me) for pennies on the dollar. As such, I would never register a set, though I own a few that would probably rate fairly highly. The LAST thing I want to happen, for example, on the exceedingly rare occasion that a Lections pops up for sale is for the other 5 people on the planet that care about this set to start jockeying for position to outbid each other and have the "number one" set on the list. They may very well do this anyway but a tangible goal such as a registry ranking will only increase this frenzy. I am an EXTREMELY competitive person by nature, by the way, so that has nothing to do with it.<br /><br />Of course, I totally see the other side of it as well. Those who are buying as an investment would want as much competition and advertisement as possible for any and all sets so a registry is an excellent tool to achieve both of these things. And somebody with an unknown and/or high grade unslabbed copy of a rare card AND who is intending to reap financial gain from it would certainly want the competition so there is something to be said for bringing more cards "into" the hobby. Myself, however, I prefer these gems to remain unknown...tucked away for me to uncover in some garage sale, grandpa's attic, or dark corner of a showcase of an unknowing dealer who swears that 2003 Upper Deck Exquisite basketball is the greatest set of cards ever produced.

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>Fair analysis Marc, and it goes back to our original premise: there are positives and negatives associated with the set registry.

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Posted By: <b>Scot Reader</b><p><br />Barry,<br /><br />You're right and have hit on something that has bugged me for a while. Set Registry is a misnomer. It should be called Collection Registry. <br /> <br />Scot

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>You should only be able to register a set when you complete it. Some sets like T206 can fairly be called complete at 520, and sets like Old Judge can not be completed. I see people with like 8% of an N172 set and they are 10th on the registry list. That holds no meaning whatsoever.

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Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>There is a lot of 12 T209s in Mastro current auction

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Posted By: <b>barrysloate</b><p>What does a lot of T209 in Mastro's auction have to do with T211?

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Posted By: <b>Jay</b><p>Nothing other than earlier in the thread people were talking about how both T209s and T211s had gotten scarce lately.