How to find the commons.
 

What's the best way to find the common cards that have very few numbers in pop reports or registry? I don't think very many AH even care about common players and I get they want the HOFers. So where does that leave a guy that wants to buy the Verne Clemons of the world?

Also what type of collector hurts the hobby the most and I'm sure it's subjective. Is it type collectors, set collectors, single team or player, other?

In what way would any of those collectors hurt the hobby?

My view is a collector only hurts the hobby if he is no longer collecting.

Brian

Different ways I'd imagine.

For me I just inquired about a card that a set collector has. No dice won't sell. Took a decade to get the complete set. Doesn't really care about the players in the set, just that it's complete. I even offered to trade him a lower grade for what he had, and no more response. Still a complete set for him. I'm a single player collector, and I just want to get the best I can since there's very few cards for me to collect. It has personal value to me for multiple reasons.

What about ones that don't care, and won't sell? This kind of reminds me of another hobby I had. Vintage cars. People would let em rot in the ground, and wouldn't sell. I just don't get that line of thinking.

The ones who cut up and destroy unique material before even documenting it, hurting research and knowledge. And the fraudsters.

I don't see how collecting in different ways would hurt "the hobby". To each, their own.

If it was the set collector contacting you, would you sell it to them or trade them for a lower grade? If the answer is no, then analogical reasoning should get to the answer. Eventually. Maybe.

If I was a set collector the grade wouldn't matter. Having the complete set would be all that would.

It takes a lot of looking. When the cards are actually hard to get it takes even longer.
If you want a specific card

Regularly searching Ebay.
Asking here.
Going to shows and asking dealers.

Being willing to pay a bit extra to finally add that one card.

Even some really common cards can take a while.
I didn't make an all out effort, but I needed Jose Canseco to finish my 88 Topps set. It had been a somewhat better card, so it was never in big lots I'd buy. But it had gotten "cold" in the market, slid to the dollar box, then to less. Usually the old no longer selling dollar box "out back"
Everyone was sure they had it. But even offering $2 for what was then a 25 cent card wasn't enough for anyone to go dig it out.
Yes, I could have bought a complete set for something like $10 but where's the fun in that?
It took around 2 years I think but I did finally find one.

I don't think any type of collector hurts the hobby.

Every type of collector affects the hobby in some way usually not by much. Sometimes by a lot. Any other collector my like or not like those effects, but they generally don't hurt the hobby overall.

Set collectors may tie up more difficult cards a player or team collector wants. But they also buy up commons that are slower selling, which makes those commons worth slightly more.

Player collectors or HOF collectors bump up prices on cards the set collector may need. But those higher prices slightly drag the commons up with them, also helping the set collector in the long run.

Investors, drive the prices of premium cards up by a LOT. That puts many cards any other sort of collector wants out of reach. But those high prices in turn make people finding vintage cards pause on the way to the trash, and that brings "new" stuff into the hobby. Which is good for everyone.

And so on for pretty much every kind of collector.

Oh, really. I just learned something new about myself. Up until a minute ago, I thought I just wanted near mint cards in my sets. This sure makes my set collecting a lot easier. Thanks!

That in no way hurts the hobby. A collector acquiring a card and not selling it IS the hobby.

The best way might be to let people know what you are searching for, you have yet to say what it is. Just maybe someone on this board has it or knows someone who does....

Usually your best bet to pick up the commons is going to be on eBay or else through a dealer.

There are a number of dealer-type sellers on eBay who are breaking up larger sets and who offer the option of picking the card that you want from the set. Obviously your one card isn't always going to be on the list, but scrolling through those should be part of your strategy.

Sadly, any way you do it will probably both require a lot of patience, and you may have to overpay a bit to get what you want.

Otherwise, about your only option is usually to buy a larger lot that happens to include the piece that you really want. And then spend a lot of time trying to offload the pieces that you didn't really want but had to buy to get the piece that you really wanted.

It's a hell of a thing in the hobby. You want a Cobb, Ruth, etc? There's tons to choose from at any given moment. The only thing holding people back is the cash and/or price.

You want some random semi-star or common? Save searches on sites that let you, enter searches on every random auction that opens, and have friends keep an eye out for you.

It makes sense, but it's a hell of a realization that going after the top dogs is very easy and trying to find some dude that put in 3-5 years then went to work selling insurance might take you years.

It's definitely single player, star player, rookie card collectors, who hurt the hobby the most. These fellows make it more difficult for set collectors to complete their sets which leads to frustration and disgust with the hobby.

:(

^ This.

:(

First, it’s his card and he can do what he wishes. Second, you have it already in lower grade?? Why the whining?

“The hobby” and “your personal interests” are two different things. How is it hurting the hobby for other collectors to not put your collecting over their own? People are not obligated to sell/trade you a card because you want it. There’s a few items I’d like that people won’t sell, but they aren’t hurting the hobby by keeping them and declining my overpay offer. None of us are entitled to an item. Especially if you’re trying to trade them an objectively worse item for an objectively better item. Why would somebody trade you a higher grade copy for a lower grade one? That’s a very bad deal for them.

This. Exactly this.

Glad I could be of service.

Context is hard thing for some. Don't bump your head from the soap box fall.

So true. I messed up a few times early on, and have really paid the piper.

Indeed! They're the worst.

:(

Never said it wasn't.

What I was given for a response was literally he didn't want to break the set up. That's why I responded with an offer, but got nothing back. I did so knowing he had no set parameters with grades because he has [A up to 7] most in the 1 to 4 range.

I don't have the lower card I just know of one I could obtain. He would still have a full set and I could get the card that has personal value I'm looking for.

My reasons are multiple, but I want the best I can get within reason. Everything I find will be donated to the town in which the player(s) came from. I have 2 players to find items for Jerry Mehlisch, Verne Clemons and non player owner Jim Dunn. They all came from the small town of Clemons Iowa. Same town I'm from. I can guarantee my desire far outweighs any guy just trying to get a complete set. All 3 are distant relatives as well.

This is the most self-centered response I've ever seen.

Regardless of how pure your motives are, if the current owner isn't really interested in selling, your options are to move on or to make him a stupid high offer that he could never refuse.

Quite honestly, paying way too much for it is about the only way you can really put the strength of your desire into action.

It's not collecting. Again, you're missing context. I just explained it in another post. If a person was looking for the highest grade and that was stated my offer would have never been offered. What was stated was he wanted a complete set and my offer would have still given him that. He's not into high grades as he has A-7 most in the 1 to 4 range. I'm not asking to deal on a HOFer, but a common the guy probably doesn't even know who he is.

Yep, but I don't give them the back story of why I'm wanting the items. I just know many don't even know who they are, and their value is way different then mine.

How so?

Your collection is more important than anyone else's. In your mind only.

It's not a collection. It's town history preserved for future generations of a small town of about 140 people. It's people that are blood relatives of mine. I can post personal letters if you think it's just a collection you'll soon find out it's much deeper then that for me. Jerry just passed last year at 92 almost 93 years old. Trust me my intention is far more then a collection like yours may be. Every penny I spend is lost, but the value it brings for others can't be measured.

Sounds like it's time to break out your check book to buy that card.

It's not an option. I'm not a jerk to people. Obviously he was done talking, and I don't push people. I offered and that's all I could do.

Rationalize it any way you want, but your ownership of the card is no more important or valid than the current owner who wants it for their set. This mindset hurts the hobby more than any type of collector.

My ownership? What's your drug of choice? Stupidity?

Cool cool.

I guess next time you'll have to make a more enticing initial offer.

Best of luck tracking down all the cards you're looking to pick up for your town.

... Are you seriously arguing that a set collector wanting to keep his higher grade card is not collecting because they didn't give it to you for a lower grade copy? Offering someone a lower grade copy of the card (which you apparently do not even have!) for a nicer one is not of any benefit to the other collector; that's them giving you something for something lesser. Why would they do that? Other people are not obligated to give you things. Other people who do not service your desires are still collectors. A collector is defined as somebody who lets you rip them off and give you whatever you want.

You're spot on. I was born in the same town as Mark Lewis and Joe Nuxhall. Being a Cincy fan you most certainly know them both but outside of Ohio, most collectors don't even remember Mark Lewis even though he was once one of the games top prospects and went #2 overall in the 88 draft.

I PC both of them and I would guess I'm one of the larger Lewis collectors there are. Given he played primarily during the junk wax area, there aren't a ton of rarities out there. However, if I came across some random late 90's 1/1 or something, I'd think that card would mean more to me than most people but at the end of the day I'd really have no idea and it wouldn't matter anyways. The OP may very well be correct that he desires the card more than the owner, but he seems to believe he deserves the card more and that's why he came on here griping about which collectors hurt the hobby more lol.

I wish the OP well but coming out to a forum full of the type of collectors who could actually help him attain the cards he's looking for and immediately ask who we believe are the worst among us is not doing him any favors.

I'm sorry, but I included myself as an option in the list. I was actually just curious. I'd say some people are thin skinned or a nerve above the skin was hit.

My main question was how to find common players, and somehow some have missed that others hit the nail on the head. I think a look back may help you understand my take because I'm sorry, but you're really far off on your conclusion.

Is reading comprehension that much of a lost art?
Seriously is it?

Now you're trying to out-Greg the OG (original Greg)!

Yes. I’m the dumbest fellow alive. But even I know I’m not entitled to anyone’s cards and don’t make threads bitching someone didn’t let me rip them off.

You say so, I'll gladly agree.

Where have I stated I'm entitled to anyone's card? By suggesting a trade? How would I be ripping someone off?

Sorry but you're just clueless man. Reminds me of the jokester on here a few years back trying to trade up from a $1.00 card to a Jackie Robinson rookie. You're oblivious to your own foolishness.

You made a thread that is 50% whining that someone didn't trade you a higher grade copy of a card for a lower grade copy of the same card. That is a rip off offer. Why would a stranger give you a more valuable higher grade copy for a low grade? Why are you so incredibly entitled as to believe that your great higher purpose is more important and makes this in any way reasonable? Why would set collectors give you better, more valuable copies just because you are special and 'want it more' (though apparently not enough to make a fair offer)?

Haha, it's not thin skinned when you throw out passive aggressive insults about collectors, regardless if it's pointed at an individual or a certain segment of the hobby. A simple message like the one below would've got you the answers you were looking for and potentially someone on here helping you get the cards you're after.

"Hello everyone, I'm trying to pick up a few rare cards of a couple of obscure players that happen to have grown up in my hometown. I'd like to pick up the best copies if possible, as the cards will end up in a local museum some day. I haven't had any luck with a few set collectors that had high grade examples of the cards I'm looking for, any suggestions? Thanks!"

That's all you needed to say.

When you offered to trade him a lower grade card for his higher grade card, was it straight up or did you also offer cash along with the lower grade card?

Suck at reading comprehension and math! Now let's go for the trifecta.

Then there's this lil nugget about a great ripoff. I'll slow down the keyboard so you can understand.

The person I emailed about his card told me he didn't want to "break" his set. I then offered a lower grade card in exchange for his higher grade card to keep his full set. I know this will come as a huge shock to you, but it wasn't card for card. It was for cash and card.

The person strictly responded he wanted to have a complete set. This person has cards that range from A to 7 and most at 1 to 4. He didn't respond and that was the end of my conversation with him. I'm such a jerk! It was a total of 2 emails. There was no crying, no entitlement or anything else you have suggested or read into it.

I'll put this out there for you as well. True story I had a transaction with a person that sold me the highest grade card of V100 for said player then went out found a lower grade card and completed his set. The ignorance of this guy. He's actually a poster on Net54.

A highly pertinent fact mysteriously and strangely kept out until right now! It is my acumen at math, of course, that should allow me to divine information you didn't disclose, say, or hint at it while repeatedly talking about trading a lower grade card for a higher one! I cannot imagine why you are having problems making deals with people.

It never got that far because he stopped responding, but yes I would have included cash. His end was all about keeping the set, not about the grade or at least that wasn't the impression I got from him. I'll clarify by saying I did offer cash, but it never got to an amount because he stopped the conversation.

So you did NOT actually offer cash alongside the card, because he stopped responding after you offered a lower grade copy.

Now it makes sense why this relevant fact wasn't part of the original telling :rolleyes:

It wasn't left out or asked before you're personal attack towards me. The person could very well be a poster here and I'm not going to give the email out word for word. It ended without a response from the other party, and that's where it stayed.

My first response was will you sell, his was I don't want to break the set, my next was how about a lower grade card to keep your set complete and nothing after. Both cash and card from my end for his card.

Yes cash and card were offered. You're relevant fact conspiracy gotcha is just that. I offered cash then a card to help what he wanted. A complete set.

It sounds like you never made it clear to him that you were offering cash and the lower grade card. Even though he stopped responding, maybe send him another email making that clear and saying how much cash you're willing to include and see if that gets a response.

If you want to bitch at personal attacks, go read your posts about me lol. Looks like I was indeed correct, you're telling different versions to different comments. This isn't the bullshit of "card and cash" that I was supposed to magically divine (which somehow equals math) just a few posts ago. In this version of cash OR card you offered cash, he rejected, you then offered instead a lower grade copy of the same card and he ignored you, probably for the obvious reason that that is a rip off.

Whatever the actual truth is or which of your disparate stories is true, you are not going to close many deals this way. Collectors or types of them are not "bad for the hobby" because they do not serve your personal interests. Your personal interests are special to you and only you, not to anyone else. They have absolutely nothing to do with "the hobby".

Are you spending 50% of your time crying? I'll clue you in on the first response talking about a transaction. Notice a funny thing about won't sell and then offered a lower grade card. When you sell or buy something doesthat typically include currency?

For me I just inquired about a card that a set collector has. No dice won't sell. Took a decade to get the complete set. Doesn't really care about the players in the set, just that it's complete. I even offered to trade him a lower grade for what he had, and no more response. Still a complete set for him. I'm a single player collector, and I just want to get the best I can since there's very few cards for me to collect. It has personal value to me for multiple reasons.

Cash AND card is very different from Cash OR card. A few posts ago it was AND. Last post it was OR. Maybe you should examine your own abilities here. One post you are emphatically not a collector, the next you are back to bemoaning there are not many cards for you to collect. Cards have value to a lot of us for many reasons. You are not special, regardless of how much you think you are. Other people, especially those you don't know, don't put your 'special' interests over their own. The hobby and your personal interests are completely different things. If you don't like that fact, tough shit lol. You are only the main character of your narrative, just like the rest of us.

Again, it was sell and sweetened with card after he said he didn't want to break the set. It didn't go from cash to lower grade card. I've never claimed my interest or the so called being special (your summarization of me) trumps others that's your unicorn, nor do I try to play that with anyone. If they ask why my interest or want my back story then I'll include that. I already stated that as well. If you think my interest isn't more then yours for the three I listed I don't really care about you're opinion. I'm sure if you had players in your bloodline you may see my view differently.

Here's the truth. Most people don't care about the players they collect. They care about completing a set. It doesn't matter who's in it. I don't care about set's I care about 3 people that have meaning beyond a collection. It's not a collection to me. It's extremely challenging to find items this rare. Another poster summed it up very well. The HOFers are easy compared to finding the common players. Every auction has HOFer cards as long as you have the cash. When you're looking for obscure players with very low registry and pop numbers that's my world. I've exhausted about every known card that I can contact the owner. I've been trying to find items since I joined and I haven't gotten any cards from here yet, but I'll keep trying.

It's really difficult to figure out what's true and not because the story keeps changing. In your last version here, it was CASH, then it was CARD. Not both. Your original version only discussed card.

You are somehow not collecting or building a collection, but you are a collector looking to collect. You insist you aren't collecting, then you are. It's really hard to keep up with your bullshit because you keep contradicting yourself on even the most basic things.


You have, several times, insisted on the superiority of your collecting or whatever-you-want-call-it-this-post. Hell, we can just look at the top. You made a thread asking what the worst type of collectors are because a set collector didn't give you a card you feel entitled to and you want to whine about collectors, which you both are and are not yourself depending on which post it is. Your answer was collectors that don't sell (meaning, of course, this guy to you). Because somehow, your collecting is more important than the set collectors who is apparently not looking to downgrade.

You made a whole thread because you are salty a collector didn't accept your offer, which may be cash, card, or both depending on which post is actually true, if any of them.

I can't imagine why you aren't getting cards from here, but good luck in your collecting or not-collecting or whatever. I'm sure making threads bitching people didn't swap a nicer card for a lesser one will help your quest.

In the USA, people are allowed to own private property. He can refuse any offer for any reason without explaining anything.

You seem to think you have a better understanding of his collection, and what matters to him (just having the set complete with some cards in lower grade) than he himself does. You don't - he gets to collect as he chooses.

He said no thanks. That's his right, and he's not being unreasonable. If you want to obtain cards, it's a better plan to find people who want to sell, rather than complain because you can't pry a card out of someone's collection who doesn't want to trade/sell.

The offer is irrelevant. You could have offered a million dollars, and there is nothing wrong with the collector declining and keeping his card. You have no right to it in the slightest, and it doesn't hurt the hobby that he doesn't want to sell. Call people stupid all you want. It's clear here who that applies to.

If you share with us the card(s) you are looking for, perhaps a fellow board member has one available in the grade you are looking for?

It is unusual to find such unanimity on this board. That folks are universally telling you that you are in the wrong ought to give you pause, but you plow ahead nonetheless. I agree with them and won't belabor that point.

But, I am going to point something out. While you state you are a single player collector, you also state that the items will be donated to the town of Clemons, a booming metropolis of 140 people. Presumably this will happen upon your death? Or not? If so, exactly how old are you? A 25 year old promising to donate material is far different than an 85 year old. Either way, you might want to consider that donating materials to a town of 140 may actually be a pretty poor means of historical preservation.

Don't believe me? Take 90 minutes and drive down to Van Meter ( pop. 1484) and visit the Bob Feller Museum. Wait. You can't. It closed and the building is now the Van Meter townhall with only some of the material preserved and on display. If a town 10 times the size of Clemons can't support a museum for an all time great, how does that bode for your Clemons collection?

Reading this thread is 10 minutes of my life that I'll never get back again.

Lucky for you, we only got about halfway down page #2 before we gave up.

I read quickly.....unfortunately in this case.

Anything Verne or Vern Clemons. I have 2 - 1923 Willard Chocolates V100 PSA 5.5 and a 5. I also have a raw 1922 W573 strip card. The colgan's and Curtis Ireland will probably never be had. I need a E120 V61 type 1 and 2. I think that's all he had. I buy anything related.

For Jerry Mehlisch he has 1 card, and it was made in 1953 for the Fargo Moorhead Twins. Jerry had the card and he was kind enough to give me a photo of it so. I could try to locate one. I buy anything related. I also buy anything Clemons Iowa related. I'll share a few photos of items I have found.

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That's some of the baseball items I've found and purchased.

I was going to let this go, and let it die, but I need to help your difficulties of understanding something very simple. My stance has never changed which you keep claiming as fact.

Again I'll try to slow things down so you can comprehend.

The deal started as do you want to sell the card.

Definition of sell
give or hand over (something) in exchange for money.

His response back was no thanks I don't want to break a set.

My 2nd and last response was I'll include a lower grade card so you will still have s full set in which he didn't respond, at which point I didn't bother him any further. Pretty damn simple. Your mountain, meet molehill.

It was a transaction attempt I'd imagine many people here have done. That was if you care to read my initial post. You just chose to read it incorrectly or couldn't grasp what was said. Since it's still ongoing I'd say both are true

I'm collecting in the sense to give, not a collection for myself. Lables are used, so I attached that label to identify myself as a single player collector for my second question of my original post.

I don't think I was being salty, I was simply discussing an attempt to get a card.

The second question was honestly just a question asked, because I'm not a card collector. I just thought it was a harmless question that must have struck a nerve of some folks.

I just wanted to understand the hobby more. Its actually amazing to me some of the stupid response I got. Like I don't understand it's not my card or that I can't make a person sell it or that my priority trumps someone else's.

The card holder shouldn't have just said, I don't want to break the set, sid not for sale. That would have been the end. I would have said, well if you ever want to sell let me know. I wasn't being a jerk many have painted me out to be.

If you want to label me a collector it's of anything relevant to Clemons. I'd label myself as a preservationist. The bullshit is on your end, and I'm sorry you can't grasp this.

This illusion of yours, and others thinking "my superiority of collecting " is pure idiocy. I take it your a set collector, and got all steamed, and couldn't see straight past that initial take. Again, it wasn't to point a finger at any type of collector. I simply stated what happened in a transaction, and then I thought to add the second question, and it had no relevance to my first question. Maybe I should have just made two separate posts.

People are acting like I'm trying to strong arm people to sell me something. Ask anyone I have delt with, and they can tell you I'm nothing like that.

I'm not getting cards, because they're very few to get. That's why I tried to ask a person if they would sell. I don't have many options. Its not a money thing like trying to buy a HOFer it's a population thing. I'm dealing in less the 10 known cards or less recognized. Most are under 5. The E120 has the most. I haven't checked between all the registries. I've been here for multiple years trying to find things. The reality is the items I'm searching for aren't a common want.

Actually, I made a thread you ignored the main ask. Just so you understand the set collector was just part of a discussion not to point blame. If that's the case I also blamed myself. The irony!

Haha! Were you stewing about this all weekend and just couldn't let it go? Dude you are such a Karen.

Since this is a sports card sight and I have respect for Leon, I will just post a few pictures of items I have hmmm "collected".

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This is to prove you aren't salty and that I'm an idiot because you insist on not being a collector and also being a collector and that actually makes perfect sense. All your direct contradictions actually aren't. Mhm. Go touch grass.

Why do you use words that you don't have understanding of to label people?

preservationist vs a collector. Maybe if you understand the difference it will set you free, but I'm not counting on it. I'm not looking for monetary gain or something having intrinsic value. There's several of us trying to keep the historic value of our town alive. There's no financial aspect or gain for those doing so. Keep grasping for that last blade of grass!

Every thread needs a card!

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