New SGC slabs & more...
 

https://ogkcreative.com/work/sgc/

https://www.sgccard.com/index.aspx

Digital grading???
Not sure what they mean about “imprinting”?

“We used scanned video effects to demonstrate how a baseball card would be analyzed, imprinted, stored and maintained in the SGC achieve system.”

I knew it!!!
More color labels :eek::eek:
@ Leon: When do we get Net54 hoodies?

Those new labels are horrendous. I hope they aren't really going there.

Wow, that's a really expensive way to jump the shark.

I encourage everyone to read the entire page. I think a lot of people reading this are getting caught up on the cosmetic changes but there are a ton of potentially exciting changes and innovations.

Ive read the whole page and I’m personally not a fan of the changes or the redesign, but hopefully I’m in the minority and the changes work out for them.

I am not hung up on the labels and the cosmetic changes as others may be. What excites me, if I am reading this correctly is that they are digitally scanning all graded cards and will have that available on their database? Did I read more into the digital scanning portion or am I just assuming that is what is going to happen.

I think this change will be good for them and hopefully give PSA a run for their (and our) money. I am looking forward to seeing what happens here.

Really?
 

Wow. This is funny. You couldn't make this stuff up if you tried.

So we are now told that SGC is finally going to fix "The Problem"

"In the 150 years since the first baseball card was produced, no company had ever developed a trusted brand platform across the various age collectors. The world of card selling, buying and trading was filled with rip-off artists and fraudulent business men taking advantage of a lack of technology and proven auditing systems."

Fact 1: 15 years ago I was sold $10,000 worth of altered, re-glossed, trimmed, re-colored baseball cards by Gary Moser and Dave Forman. I discovered that when I sent the cards to PSA for grading. PSA clearly delineated the doctoring that was performed on each card.

Fact 2: I never got a penny back from either of these men, although Mr. Forman has tried to apologize to me for years for his actions. My attempts to get justice from the United States Attorney’s Office for the Eastern District of New York and from the FBI were unsuccessful due to the priorities (quite rightfully) of the Post-911 environment here in NY City.

Fact 3: Dave Forman is the owner of SGC.

Talk about the inmates running the asylum....

I also took umbrage with their talk about being the first registry, but maybe they were talking about 20+ years ago. About the same time they last updated their registry software... mentioning how good it is takes a bunch of gumption.

Imprinting also sounds like they're going to intentionally damage/mark cards. The whole S_____ G_________ C______ thing is just ridiculous. How much money did this take, and where did it come from?

Links are gone did anyone save a screenshot of the new holders?

Here you go...

Hopefully their shipping charges were reasonable. If they weren't, people might care.

Like everything else, people will resist the change but soon become used to it.

Fonz is looking good. Better than the new SGC holders.

eek:D

the graded numbers are much too large
 

takes away from the focus on the card

So is this the end of the 100 point scale?

After years of only sending cards to sgc I think it’s time to start using psa.

Does anyone care about cards? It's all about the FLIP. :)

I think it is important to note that this announcement was not supposed to happen yet so who knows if that is even the final version of the holder

Edit to clarify that I don't mind them. But I wanted to say that all of the info coming out now should be taken with grain of salt because this was not an official announcement.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one who thinks the new flips are horrible. I really hope they reconsider this one.

James is right though. When the flip is that ugly it takes away from the card in the slab. The two need to go well together.

Uh they're scanning each card that's graded and the scan will be available online to anyone who might be purchasing said card later. Granted it's not as important as orange packing tape but it's close.

Anything new looks foreign at first. I still think people's eyes will adjust.

If they really want to make a move on PSA they need to offer free shipping IMO. :cool: Free shipping is the way to hearts and minds.

Buy the holder, not the card. :)

I hope you're right Peter, for SGC's sake.

:) Exactly! Charge more for the grading fee, but as long as shipping is free everything else is irrelevant!

James, exactly. This is the biggest issue facing the hobby today, at least on this forum. Nothing sparks interest like a thread on shipping charges.

Business Idea: Purple Label + Free Shipping = Hobby Gold
 

Peter, if the purple label company would offer free shipping I think we both could agree it would be a game changer in the hobby!

I would accept any cost for a purple sticker as long as the damn shipping is free!

I captured the site before they pulled it...Support Giant Card :)

Frank, which agent did you speak to? And which proseoctor? It is a well known fact as you noted that the FBI and EDNY stopped investigating and prosecuting all fraud cases in the aftermath of 9/11 for a few years due to the need to shift all assets to counterterrorism. Caused havoc with my business as there was not a plethora of terrorism cases to go around and I was stuck waiting for things to get back to normal.

Doesn’t SGC Prime already offer free shipping?:eek:

I have always liked the old label. Why did they have to change it? :(

If it ain't broke, don't fix it

http://s210975194.onlinehome.us/auct...em_22081_1.jpg

It's like anything, changes/updates need to be made in order to stay in the mainstream/modern, plus, once these catch on, and they will, think of all the peeps with old(er) slabs that will now want their cards in the newer updated ones. $$$ :D

Smart move, imo.

These new labels look awful. Who is ownership of this company?

The label is overshadowing the biggest and most promising change to SGC: their scanned registry.

I cant agree more. I am not a fan of the label and it sounds like most are not but the scanned registry is an awesome idea.

I have no big problem with the label, as long as they are going to the 1-10 grading scale, which I feel is long overdue. Their Set Registry still needs to be more user friendly for them to move forward and to try to compete with PSA.

:eek: SGC!! Can't come up with anything original.

To bad I can't sue you assholes for stealing part of my business model and original idea! Actually you blatantly are ripping off my business model that has been discussed not only with SGC employees but members here on this board. Have your lawyer contact me!


Just want to make sure you have all my correct and current info. This is not a joke and I am not taking this matter lightly and neither should SGC.

Andrew W@@dfin
500F 25 Ave NW
Austin MN 55912
507-six9six-15four9

sgc, have your lawyer contact me too. i have a problem with some of those Beatles lyrics.

I know you think this is funny and it may be to some but it is not to me. I have been working and scraping by for way to long on this.

I will say that as I read through the page I kept thinking "This sounds just like what Andrew is trying to do". I do think the idea of scanning technology doing the grading has been around for a while. You were just the only one I heard saying they were going to do something about it.

if I had what I thought was a million dollar idea, I would not post about it on a public chat board. and i wouldn't supposedly discuss it with one of the leaders in the field I was hoping to enter. and I wouldn't think that posting about the idea on a public chat board gave me legal rights as the only person to pursue the idea.

I am pretty sure that the AI scanning tech has not been around more than 10 years in a format that anyone other than the Federal government had access to. I have talked with both the FBI Forensics lab and Facebook about their AI platforms some years back to see if I can get a base version with an open source for modification. It was not available for me or anyone else at the time.

What exactly do you think SGC stole/misappropriated from you?

Well good thing I did. The guy who invented the intermittent wiper had a hell of a time proving his idea before Ford stole it and that is the only way he finally got paid after he was drug through a divorce and the poorhouse for years.

He had patents, no?

Speaking of patents, I do see that as of 2017 there is a Patent Pending for computer grading technology.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20160210734A1/en

Who are these guys?
Inventor: Stephen Brent Kass, Edward Korbel, Daniel R. Barbakow, Robert Alan Cook

There are few more listed in the newest application:

https://patents.justia.com/patent/20180004756

These guys know of what they speak.

"Awareness in the marketplace of the possibilities for resubmitted cards receiving higher grades has resulted in card owners breaking open the “tamper proof” holders and resubmitting the cards multiple times, if necessary, without disclosing that the card has been previously graded.

The variance in grades for resubmitted cards combined with the subjective and inconsistent card grading process itself results in creating a lack of confidence in the marketplace necessary to sustain a stable and efficient market.

The present process utilized in the grading industry creates opportunity for larger collectors (e.g. larger customers of the card grading companies) to manipulate the current system's subjective grading to their advantage by re-submitting cards for a higher grade based upon natural human variability or their influence as a large customer. Small collectors lack sufficient size to “influence” card grading and often sell cards at lower prices due to the lower grades they receive."

That is some good stuff there. Looks like I made some people a lot of money

I wonder how many of those guys are members here on NET54?

I've known about this saying for many years but thanks to you I now know that the Fonz was wearing his leather jacket when he jumped said shark.

Brian

Are you saying that YOU are the one who actually invented this?
Did you file for a patent application?

Yes I did

No worries. Hard to prove its your unique idea when its written and built almost to a T from someone else plans and ideas from 10 years prior to filing.

The problem isn't subjectivity, it isn't that people are doing the grading. It's right there in the patent.

"Each of the grading companies grade cards by human evaluation, primarily with the naked eye and typically devote approximately one minute per card during the grading process. "

That's why things are a mess.

I would guess it would be actually much less.

The grading industry is long overdue for a major overhaul. I hope that whatever technology will be used corrects some or all of the curent problems. I really don't want to hear about the subjectivity of grading. I want to hear about a system that grades cards correctly and will deliver that same grade no matter how many times a card is reviewed. I don't want to hear stories about cards being submitted three times and getting three different grades. If it can't be done right, then it shouldn't be done at all.

Well one is a software engineer for Intel another one for Google, there's a lawyer in there a data scientist for Microsoft etc...These folks are not messing around!

I invented the blind spot indicator lights on cars' mirrors to let you know when someone is in your blind spot years before they ever showed up on a car. I wish I had patented that idea even to this day. I always said I was going to sell the idea to Mercedes or BMW as it would have to come out on a luxury car first and then it would become a common feature on all cars. Sure enough...

Oh well. Back to my desk and paycheck.

Gulp. I'm SGC's lawyer. Now what?

Awkward...:o

i’d posit that if need a whole minute to go over a card (esp if you have a loupe and a grid overlay for centering-which i would hope professional graders have in their toolbox) to grade it, that you’re a slowpoke doing it wrong.

If I were a current TPG I would be looking at this very closely. Wow....Some serious research here.

I left my address and phone number in one of the earlier post in this thread so do what you gotta do.

I'll be doing nothing but ok.

Hi Fellas,

New guy here. Saw they also secured trademarks. https://trademarks.justia.com/owners...g-llc-3035778/ Interesting stuff. Despite current grading approaches needing an overhaul, I am not sure this is THE answer.

Chase

One question I have regarding the process of grading a card via scanning...

Pre-War cards, particularly tobacco cards, tend to have ink errors and/or stamps. How will marks be detected vs. printing errors, and how will the grade be affected?

I am not involved, but I would assume the program would know the ink colors used and be able to distinguish between ink from the printing process vs ink that was added later.

I confess I haven't studied the patent. Do these guys actually have a machine that can grade a card which they have tested, or is it just a design?

I would assume the digital images of prior cards would be saved for comparison. Doing this they could do something completely amazing for the hobby.

Imagine SGC using there 100 point system to the fullest, having a T206 Cobb graded SGC 5.3 while another graded 5.8. Regrades would be rolling in and NO MORE DARN STICKERS!!.

Just my opinion: have two thinner gaskets with the card sealed in a nice sleeve in between. They don't have to change the look and no more sliding under the gasket or edge damage. I have a few in bad need of this!!

Yeah, to roll out a new, "more accurate" grading system, but then revert to a 10 point scale seems bizarre. You could deduct a single percentage point for a fisheye, or depression on the surface of a card. Having to downgrade it a half grade or no downgrade at all seems counter-intuitive.
I guess the standardization of monetizing a card's value would be too splintered with additional grading divisions, so maybe that's why it's on the way out. (That's presuming they are switching to the 10 point scale, which is implied by the images of the new flips; maybe they're mock-ups?)

My worry about computerized grading is that no card is technically perfect. Say the computer spits out the best graded card out of thousands of modern cards that get submitted and it's a 94%. Are they going to declare that 94% to be the standard for an SGC 100/10 Pristine? Are they never going to award a 100, 98, or 96 again? If the best grade a person submitted to SGC could gain is a NM-MT+, is anyone going to submit to a company when they could get a BGS 9.5 or PSA 10 with a human grader? I also think the whole idea is overblown, and that the market is doing just fine with cards being graded by humans on the whole. If it wasn't there wouldn't be an exponential increase in the value of high grade vintage commons like there is.

Someone could also flood the initial submissions with this new computerized grading with good quality fakes, and if not caught, those could be the first cadre of slabbed/scanned cards, and become the standard which real cards are compared to.

I wouldn't doubt SGC already has 1000's of cards already scanned before even the announcement of the new system and they're not going to blindly scan a card w/o authenticity. The initial website, before the take-down, was most likely to spur forum conversations and inputs.


This isn't for the dying vintage submissions which is/will be plaguing all TPG, this is for the NEW, shiny stuff produced every year. A full 100 pt grading would be VERY cool but may be a bit much. But on the high end shiny, it would make sense: Mint 90-94, Gem Mint 95-99, Pristine 100. How many BGS Gem Mint combos are there, couple dozen?

I got the email this morning some time, does anyone have a clue why the new stuff was taken down. Seems really silly to send out an email like that then pull it down.

I have supported SGC forever cause I like the look of the insert and I hate the floating and inconsistent casing PSA does on pre war stuff. Although I am sure that pre war makes up a small overall percentage of what people submit it is all I really care about. If these changes come through I am not sure what I will do, the large number is far too big and looks silly. One of the comic book grading companies made the grade number much bigger but it's a far larger item so, I am now used to the new look. Not sure I could even get used to this.

I guess time will tell but again why in the world was it pulled down??

James Gallo

Lawsuit?

Paging the good counselor

Some more details here: https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...cess-upgrades/

Sounds like some positive changes. And I guess I'm going to be the one person who kinda likes the look of the new label. I won't know for sure until I see one in person though.