TCMA past and present...
 

Hey guys, Andrew and Mike Aronstein here. This is our first post :) .

We're in the car on our way up to Cooperstown right now, discussing my father's T206 collection from the 1970's, the Wagners he owned, and other stuff that boggles my mind about his time in the hobby.

Anyway, just wanted to say hello and introduce ourselves to the forum. If anyone out there has any questions regarding collecting in the 70's and 80's or would like information regarding TCMA sets, reprints, SSPC cards, or anything else we can help with, feel free to let us know.

Yes, TCMA still exists to this day! Though they are now published through Photo File, we continue to produce the 8x10 Induction Day Cards found in Cooperstown every summer. In-fact the reason for our trip today is to deliver our 2014 cards of Maddux, Glavine, Thomas, and the three managers being inducted.

Bit of a drive, but the scenery is nice and we get to talk collecting :) .

Welcome aboard guys, I enjoy your sets. Nice products.

Welcome to the forum, guys!! Glad to have ya'll on board. We all LOVE to hear stories of collecting from the past so will be eagerly awaiting some when ya'll have the time. My only question is "what took ya so long to find us?" :)

I know there is a ton of TCMA stuff out there , and I have heard great stories, but really most of the post-war cards are beyond my realm.



Have a safe trip today and once again, welcome!!

edited to add, I agree with Rich, it's great to see hobby pioneers write in the first person.

newbies
 

welcome aboard the board!
would love to hear your stories about the ancient days.
all the best,
barry

Welcome...I had quite a bit of TCMA "Stuff" in my collection as a kid and still have a good deal of it here and there. Looking forward to some great stories.

Welcome aboard! I remember your dad so well from those 1970s shows at the Union Center in Greenwich Village.

http://i1089.photobucket.com/albums/...thticket-1.jpg

Welcome aboard.
JimB

Always great to see hobby pioneers speak in the first person.

Welcome to the board. The TCMA minor league cards have really bailed me out of over the years in my Indians streak, letting me get players that otherwise wouldn't exist.

The Japanese set was especially helpful as you just so happened to print it in 1979, the one year little used Red Sox and Indians LOOGY Rick Kreuger pitched in Japan which created his one and only card

Welcome, Mike & Andrew! One (of many) questions...
 

Welcome, Mike and Andrew! It's been a pleasure following and dealing with Mike since the early days of TCMA - actually pre-dating TCMA when Mike headed up SCFC (pre-1970). The TCMA commemorative sets certainly filled a collecting void during the days of virtually Topps-only and today hundreds of hobbyists appreciate having sets such as 1936-37 New York Giants, 1942-49 Play Ball, Stars of the 1950s and 1960s and, of course, the comprehensive "The 1930s" set of 500+ cards, among many, many others including minor league sets which Mike's company produced by the hundreds.

Which brings me to my question: Why was Babe Ruth not included in "The 1930s" set?

A final, personal note: Mike and TCMA were among the biggest boosters, 1973-74, for the 20-issue run of Sports Scoop magazine and went on to produce his own collector periodicals - helping keep alive our great hobby. Thanks, Mike! We collectors owe you a great debt of gratitude.

Best regards,
Steve Mitchell

I remember as a kid (and my brother), that my mom got us something from Sear for Xmas and it was a starters kit. It came with a binder and sheets and bunches of cards (tcma)
I still got it till this day, sits in my closet. It was those 'immortals' set, I think there were 3 versions in the collection. Havent touch it in years and years...I do remember looking thru it and say look at these old people...yeah it the Babe, Lou, and etc.
This is what got us into the hobby of collection cards. Thank you Mom.

Awesome! I have a few TCMA sets scattered throughout my collection and am all ears if you guys want to get into your history.

This article I cut out of my dad's INCOME OPPORTUNITIES magazine in 1975, I have saved all my life. It is about how Mike Aronstein started TCMA. It's a quick easy read and you'll love it.

Mr. Aronstein found plates of older baseball players from an antique shop, and hence began the corp.

Love the paragraph in which it is explained he paid $300 for Goudey Lajoie, and $250 for a T206 Plank, and that he pays top dollar. Who would have imagined today's prices?

I used to have some TCMA stuff when I'd buy sets from Renatta Galasso in the late 70's-early 80's. Welcome and enjoy your road trip!

Great to have you here!

I learn new stuff all the time, and a couple weeks ago I learned something related.
Went to a stamp show and looked through a big collection of baseball covers. And came across one from TCMA. I never knew you did covers too.

I've got a few cards, and like the sets. I especially like the large set with the puzzle back. As time goes by I come to appreciate them more than when they were new.

Steve B

Good to have you aboard.
Always liked the TCMA '50's & '60's sets from the late '70's

http://www.qualitycards.com/pictures/16512804.jpg

I have several of these and it looks like TCMA was involved with the catalog in some form? There are quite a few different TCMA items for sale...

I had to block out the address label as I believe the collector/subscriber is still living, at least somewhat recently, at the same address, 35 yrs later :)

Tcma
 

A few things....

Hi Mike! Glad to see you here on the Net!

I got my Wagner "through" Mike in the early seventies!

Anyone know what TCMA stands for? I do, but I'll let others post.

Mike held one of the first collector get together's at his home in 1969/70. Not sure of the date. Just recall I was a Sophmore in college at the time.

He gave each of us a sheet of uncut cards and we all "autographed" the sheets on the reverse as a keepsake. See below.

Those signing were:

Bill Haber, Crawford Foxwell, Bill Zekus, David ?, Nate Cohen, Tom Dischley, Dennis Graye, Mile Jasperson, Yours truly, Bruce Yeko, Irv Lerner, Dan Dischley, Mike, Bob Jasperson, Bill Mastro, Tom Collier, Bill Himmelman, Jim MacAllister and Myron Aronstein.

I also previously posted a photo entitled 5 guys with a Wagner in the seventies.

Top L-R: Mastro, Nagy, Haber. Kneeling: Mike and yours truly.

Good Memories!

Fred

I have a TCMA-related question that I've been dying to know the answer to for years. Do you have any information about this card or the set it came from? I am a Tom Seaver collector and have never seen another one of these. It has a copyright date of 1985 and a credit line to TCMA at the bottom right. The back is blank.

TCMA The Card Memorabilia Assocites. TCMATomCollier Mike Aronstein. My guesses.

Hey, guys. Thanks for all your enthusiasm regarding TCMA Ltd. We're going to respond to everyone's comments individually and hopefully answer your questions! Here we go...

(This is Andrew typing, but I'm partially dictating for my father).

Interesting question, and to be honest we don't have a great answer. There was definitely a Ruth glass negative in the find that the set was created from, but it could be that we used that image for so many other sets we decided not to use it, or it was mistakenly left out. Most likely not a conscious decision :) .

Doing those cards was fun and we were growing, that era was an exciting time for TCMA. We wanted to do more Japanese sets but unfortunately, it didn't work out.

Doing cards of obscure players, guys who played in one game, etc. was part of the fun for us :D . My favorite was Manuel Onis from "The 1930's" set, who was 1 for 1 in his major league career.

Thanks so much for your comments, Steve. I definitely recall your name but it's been a long time. I think we met way back when, and I seem to have a picture of you in my mind but it's a 40 year old picture :eek: .

We definitely will :) .

Was that in the early to mid 80's? If they are the kits I'm thinking of those were done by us through a company called CMC, or Collectors Marketing Corp. Located in Manhattan on 27th Street and 12th Ave. Incidentally, this was also the building where George Matesky "The Mad Bomber" stored his explosives.

Amazing that a copy of that article still exists! It's mostly accurate. I do have to read it over more closely but some of what's in that article needs correcting. I'll try and delve into that more tomorrow.

We did a LOT of covers. One series was called "On This Day in Baseball History," and we did a set of autographed covers of baseball events, with CMC (Collectors Marketing Corp). Among others.

In 1998 we got into covers quite heavily when we produced covers through Photo File that were offered for sale in USPS locations across the country. Most of those were matted with a photo. We did those until around 2006.

Yes, we produced Baseball Advertiser :) . It was printed at Yorktown Printing on their web press. 4 times a year IIRC.

Hi Fred, great to see you're here! What a photo! The missing name is Dave Zemsky, from the Bronx, and I still have my copy of the uncut sheet :) . I'm still very friendly with Bill Himmelman and see him quite often.

What I think (and will confirm in our archives when I can) was that this was an insert/stiffener for an event cover. It was part of an autographed event cover series featuring various players.

Great to see you guys here! I've already enjoyed reading what's been posted so far.

I always liked the SSPC sets and especially liked the team sets like 1960 Pirates, 1927 Yankees, 1919 White Sox & 1955 Dodgers (with their postcard sized team pictures), All-Time team sets...

Looking forward to reading more.

Collecting the 1963 Topps set.

Myself and Tom Collier with our Cracker Jack reprints. Not sure of the show. 1972?

I've been wanting to write up something of a genealogy of modern minor league card companies, as there seems to have been a lot of convergence of companies (or at least brands) from 1987-1993. How did the TCMA to CMC transition come about regarding the minor league sets produced in the late 1980s? I notice the 1987 cards all have TCMA/CMC copyright lines. TCMA is nowhere to be found in 1988, but in 1989, some (all?) of the "CMC" team sets all say "TCMA CARDS" at the top on the reverse.

I'm not sure of the exact chronology but TCMA wasn't doing well at the time and CMC was, so we formed a partnership of sorts. Eventually, CMC was bought out and TCMA was left to continue on it's own. This process happened over the course of maybe 3 years, after which we started mostly dealing in 8x10 photos.

Welcome....
 

Wow:eek:...look forward to your posts!

Thanks for the answer regarding the "missing" Babe Ruth in TCMA's The 1930s set
 

Andrew & Mike...

Thank you for the response. I have wondered about this for quite some time and will pass your response along to the several collectors we are assisting in the completion of their TCMA The 1930s sets - including one fellow who resides in Switzerland! (He loves the set and is willing to pay the shipping/insurance costs.)

Again, thanks for the reply and have a great time at Cooperstown!

Best always,
Steve Mitchell

I]

The first sspc set i purchased was the 42 card set. I believe Jeff Morey took a lot of these pics. Is Dave Zemsky still around?

IIRC Jeff Morey lived in Syracuse and he shot only AAA players for us. It's been a long time but most likely it was Bill Hongach who shot many of the players for the SSPC set, and Rick Cerrone (former Yankees PR Director) may have shot some as well.

Welcome aboard. I met TC at a show in Laurel Maryland in about 1975 and always looked forward to seeing him at shows. I was 14 at the time and he was always willing to share his knowledge with me. Your Dad I met at the Gallagher's shows Starting in 73 again a very nice man who was a real asset to Baseball card collecting. Glad you are part of Leon's wonderful forum.

Regards
Jonathan

Well I'm not sure this is do-able but is it possible to post a list of every set that TCMA produced? I've always thought they price guides merely scratched the surface.

We do have complete lists for the Minor League sets, and I *think* I saw a rather extensive list of the other sets in our archive last week. Will have to double check on that and make sure it's what I think it is. If so, I'll be sure to scan and post up for everyone :) .

One of my favorite facts about TCMA (this is Andrew typing, not Mike) is that we did the Roy Hobbs prop cards for The Natural in 1984. Did have an uncut sheet around here but it's currently MIA:

Andrew- that last piece is awesome. I love when there are the printers colors and marks showing on pictures and lithographic items. Thanks again for sharing!!!

I've enjoyed this thread - welcome to the board!

My parents got me the Baseball's Greatest Hitters, Sluggers, Pitchers series when I was a kid and I studied the backs of every one of them. As a 12-year-old, that was about as close as I was going to get to owning a Cobb or Gehrig card. I remember really being in awe of the guys who were in BOTH the Hitters and Sluggers sets.

A few years later I picked up a box of cards at a yard sale and when I got home I realized I had complete sets of the 1919 Chicago White Sox and the 1946 Boston Red Sox, along with a lot of other various TCMA cards and 1970s Topps cards. I always loved the Ted Williams card from the '46 Red Sox set (pictured below).

Good work!

Just came across this article about the origins of TCMA, from 1975. Enjoy :) :

http://news.google.com/newspapers?ni...g=2755,3714538

Always been a fan:
 

TCMA products have always caught my attention. I'm not sure exactly how many I personally own right now, but I consider them some of my favorites.

In reading the exchanges in this thread, it does my heart good to see someone who has been so very entrenched in the hobby and has kept their passion for both the hobby and the game. Bravo.

I have never understood how companies like yours survive with all the licensing restrictions involved with marketing any professionally-based sports products. It must be frustrating, but I am glad to see you still pushing forward.

I look forward to any new product you decide to create.

How did licensing work with TCMA?
 

Given the current state of the various licenses for producing products featuring MLB or MiLB players and team logos, what was the licensing environment like in the 1970s and 1980s with regard to both the minor league sets TCMA produced, as well as the various historical sets?

Well, Topps had a license from MLB and TCMA did not, which is why they filed a lawsuit against TCMA in 1975/76 when the SSPC set was released.

Deals with the Minor League teams were reached individually. This generally consisted of providing the teams with half the print run of their team's card sets so they could be given away or sold at the games.

Thank you for the response! What about the historical sets? Did Topps just look the other way because they weren't producing anything similar or was there some sort of exemption related to producing sets using the images older than a certain date? I don't recall ever seeing any airbrushing or hiding of team emblems on hats and jerseys for any of the various team sets and all time greats sets.

And on a slightly different topic, what led to TCMA producing the one team set in 1985 for the Tigres de Mexico? Where there any plans to do more Mexican sets?

i wonder if that was because of the active player issue. After all in 1975, with a couple of exceptions, who cared about usage of a 1930's player in any sets.

But the MLBPA sure cared about the active players

Rich

You're probably right, especially given that upon retirement, players basically were out of the MLBPA and thus their likenesses were no longer the concern of the MLBPA.

Correct, Topps really didn't seem to care until SSPC directly challenged them.

We were asked by the team to do it :) . That was the only Mexican set IIRC but there were Japanese sets.

1972 TCMA Cracker Jack's
 

Here is a 1972 TCMA (1915) Cracker Jack Set still in its original bag. I have this as part of my my 1915 Master Cracker Jack collection. I also have "Bullet Joe Wood and Harry Hooper autographed PSA DNA 9 of these cards in my collection as well. They are super cool!!!

Very nice :cool: . You know, I bet there are still some of those floating around Baseball Nostalgia in Cooperstown. I know for a fact there are still several reprint sets there from the early days.

Lately I've been trying to get my hands on one of the uncut sheets of the Cracker Jack reprint cards but no luck.

This one:

Scfc
 

Hey Mike and Andrew,

I won a set of Yankees photos from the recent Huggins & Scott auction. They were produced by SCFC. I didn't know anything about them. Today I got curious and did a little research on the 'net. I found out SCFC stands for Sport Cards for Collectors and it was a precursor to TCMA. When I saw that, I thought of you guys and this thread. (Looking back in the thread, I see SCFC was mentioned early on by Steve Mitchell.)

The set is comprised of 99 4X5 photos. Numbers 1-36 are 1970, 37-58 are 1969, 59-87 are 1968, and 88-99 are 1967.

So, I assume the photos were made in 1970. Is that correct? Also, do you know why you went back and made photos for previous years? And why the odd number of photos per year - 36 for 1970, 22 for 1969, 29 for 1968, and 12 for 1967? Also, why was Mantle included in the 1970 grouping as a coach, but not included in the 1967 or 1968 groupings as a player? Why was F. Peterson included in the '68 grouping twice? In essence, can you shed any light on the thought process that went into the years that were produced and the player selection for each year?

Like many others have said, thanks for all TCMA has done for the hobby!

I've got a question regarding the Yankees yearbook and the "Phillies Way" books that were produced by SSPC.

Were these different since they were technically books and the cards were just inserts, or did these fall under the same copyright that Topps was trying to enforce?

It's always interested me on whether the method of distribution affected the licensing of cards. Since Post and Hostess in the past weren't selling cards, but rather using cards as packaging, was this a different legal territory?

Yes, that is correct :) . SCFC goes back to the late 60's and was my father and his Uncle, Myron Aronstein. From what my father says SCFC was really just a way for him to make extra money to support his collecting. Then, when things started to evolve he met Tom Collier and formed TCMA, buying out Collier within the first year or two of the partnership. I will have to get more details from the source, considering this all happened almost ten years before I was born!

Those photos are interesting, I don't think I've ever seen them before. To be honest I thought SCFC had only done the art cards that were drawn by my father's Uncle (and some by his Aunt). Will talk to my father this evening and let you know. This has me curious now as well. He just flew in from Cuba today and I think he came back with some cards :cool: .

Thanks for your quick response. I look forward to hearing what your dad has to say about the set. I've attached a flier for the photos. The flier was included in the auction.

I'm thinking these are the glossy photos, usually with facsimile autographs in blue, the team gave out in response to fan mail from the late 1960s to about 1990.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/--...amIssue4x5.jpg https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-3...nkeesPhoto.jpg

Jason, those are some examples of photos given out by the team over the years. I've got some from probably '65 (based on some of the players, e.g., Gil Blanco) that are approx. 3.5" by 6.5" with black facsimile autos, some from probably late '60s that are the same size but with printed names in bottom white border, some 4" by 6" with printed names in bottom from the '70s, some from probably the '80s that are 4 by 6 with blue facsimile autos (like yours), some 8 by 10s from '79 with printed names at bottom, and recently got some 8 by 10s from probably '76 with 2 photos on the page and printed names on left, with a similar one from probably '81. Unfortunately, I don't have many of any of them.

The SCFC photos from '70 are 4 by 6. Some have black facsimile auto, some don't. I've attached some examples of them.

The Bob Feller Story
 

Andrew, any chance you could shed some light on this set, and the different versions that may exist? It is my understanding that the set was created for the Bob Feller Museum. The complete set versions I have (including one that is autographed), was printed on heavy, brown card stock. The other, is printed on the more common white used by TCMA for almost everything. Were these printed by TCMA, and is the white card another one of those random cards that got reprinted for the collectors kits in the 1980s?

When I first was introduced to baseball cards, TCMA and Renata Galasso were a few of the places I mail ordered things from. Paul Marchant was another I remember buying from. I think I generally got my sets from Paul and Renata and the other stuff from TCMA. Aside from a rare trip to Pacific Trading Cards and a couple other small shops in seattle that I would later discover (Paperback Exchange and Golden Age Collectibles), everything was mail order.

I remember getting the TCMA catalogs for a while and wish I had kept more. I don't know what happened to all of the card magazines/catalogs I had, but suspect my dad tossed them (no cards were tossed luckily). I only have 2-3 floating around. I ordered a number of the collector sets as well, including the All Times Greats postcard set and the 1951 Giants among others. That is really what got me loving oddball sets and I have purchased many different TCMA sets over the years. Looking back at old catalogs, I wonder why I didn't buy more as the prices seemed cheap, but then again I was just a kid with no income!

I would love to see more posts and photos from TCMA! Thanks gentlemen.

Rick Kreuger actually has at least three cards. However the other two, a team issue from Pawtucket in 1977 and a Japanese baseball game card from Takara in 1979, are likely a lot more difficult to track down.

Sorry for the late reply...i just looked ans YES INDEED thats what is was.
Its still in the blue binder that has the gold striping and lettering.

I just put together a blog post on the TCMA reprint cards that were produced for the various collecting kits and grab bags one used to see in the late 1980s. Would anyone care to give it a once over and point out anything blatantly wrong with it?

http://clydes-stalecards.blogspot.co...ollectors.html

My assumption/conclusion about the MLB logo on the backs of cards led to a lot more possible reprints than I originally thought were out there. Expert insight would be greatly appreciated by the more knowledgeable TCMA enthusiasts here.

TCMA minor league card collector
 

Just saying hello. I'm Chris. As my collection focus is first cards of players from my birth year of 1969 to about 1991, (I call it Reggie to Chipper, lol), TCMA minor league cards are very prominent in my collection. They are very hard to find in high-grade condition, if even at all. I'm enjoying the thrill of the chase. I think they are great cards and just wanted to say thanks!

Over on TradingCardDB.com, someone just posted asking for help identifying this card:

<img src="http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/Identification/0-Ident-Fr204.jpg" width="300"> <img src="http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/Identification/0-Ident-Bk184.jpg" width="300">

I did not realize TCMA had issued any collegiate sets. Was this the only one, and does anyone have any idea where I might be able to find the rest of the checklist?

This is a funny story actually. From what my father tells me the team called him up and asked if he could do the cards, to which he agreed and offered to do them as a favor to the team. They sent him a team jacket as a thank-you though he wasn't expecting anything at all in return. That's typical of my dad.

Very nice thing for your dad to do!!

And I am glad you dad picked this particular team:
"IT'S ALL ABOUT THE U", as we hurricane alumni say

Thought you guys might enjoy this article I just came across from 1983/1984. Not sure of the publication but I'm thinking it's a local paper:


https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5659/...d5e12f47_c.jpg

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/680/2...ea31db63_c.jpg

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/685/2...585c6ed3_c.jpg

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5828/...bb6529cb_c.jpg

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/572/2...03dd76e5_c.jpg[url=https://flic.kr/p/AzNP71]

I enjoyed the article. Thanks for posting it. Your father looks just as I remember him at the Midwest Show at Troy, Michigan in July of '72.

Be that as it may, I would sure appreciate it if you would pump your Bronx-born father for any information and memories he may still have of the local 1953-55 Stahl-Meyer Franks baseball cards, as well as the hot dogs themselves. How much did they cost at the Polo Grounds?

---Brian Powell

Enjoyed the article a lot too. I think I have some very original and early corrspondance and will try to post some soon. Thanks for sharing.

I have found this thread to be fascinating. I can't imagine finding negatives and starting my own card company! I am collecting cards of players who went to high school in my home state of Indiana. I found out there is a guy named Bob Kahle, who played eight games for Boston and went to Morton High School in my home town of Richmond, Indiana. Imagine my surprise when he shows up in the 1972 1930's set! Does anyone know of a good place to find one? Sadly, my normal sources seem to be lacking.

Bob Kahle is card #451 according to the Standard Catalog. I would try contacting Pete or Bruce at Baseball Nostalgia in Cooperstown 607 547 6051. They may have one for you :) .

Brian, I will absolutely ask my father when we are together this week for the holidays :) .