SCP Auctions and shipping cost
 

I won one lousy card from SCP auctions. Sports Card Plus. David Kohler. I receive an invoice for my $200+ card. $17+ shipping and $1.60 insurance.

ARE YOU FKG KIDDING ME???????????????????????

My card arrives very well packaged in a box that could hold a 1952 Topps complete set. UPS which is a ripoff to begin with!

I sent an email and a note with my payment with no response to either.

God bless them that they do not need my business!

I may not bid on alot, but I am sitting on several million dollars worth of cards and a very good friend of mine used them to sell his collection.

When I am ready to sell, they will NOT be considered! At all!

Terrible customer service, RAPES their bidders with shipping, does not respond to problems.

SCP you can GO TO HELL!

Sincerely,

Dan Mckee

Whew! Tell us how you REALLY feel Dan!

I think most of the auction sites (besides places like ebay) charge higher shipping/handling fees. Did you have to sign for the package???

I was recently charged $13 shipping plus $3 insurance on a card I won for $30 from an auction house. It was obscene.

BP
 

Not to mention SCP's 20% buyers premium. 20%? Really? No inventory costs. The shipping, handling, and insurance is paid separately. 20% ?

On the flip side.
 

I won 6 cards and 5 baseball magazines from Sterling a few months a few months ago. I thought the shipping was quite reasonable. Only about 10-12 bucks for a large package. I was content and was surprised when Lee refunded several bucks of it a day later. Said it didn't cost as much as he thought it would. Thumbs up!

I'm pretty tight with Kohler, Dan. You want me to put in a good word for you and get it all straightened out?

-Ryan

I won a bat, was also $17 for shipping, $5 for insurance...maybe it's a blanket rate no matter what you win? should obviously be much less for one card.

Yeah Ryan, why don't you go ahead and touch base with him and let us know how it goes? :cool:

seriously?
 

:rolleyes:

Dan--so what's the damage? You feel they overcharged you $7? Not worth having a cow over that. That seems like a Buck Showalter reaction, not a reaction from my usually mild mannered friend Dan.

Multiple million dollar collection and overcharged $7 on shipping. Not really feelin it.

:D:D

So it's ok to be over charged if your rich. You don't become rich with out counting the pennies.

Dan will probably be the first to tell ya, he's not "rich", but he is sitting on a gold mine. he basically bought "gold" at $10 an ounce. ;)

Smart man, that Dan is.

I wish the hobby veterans on this board like Dan would post more about the big finds they have come across over the years. I've really enjoyed the reminiscing of hobby history by Mike Berkus, Josh Evans, etc. at the Net54 dinners.

He also mentions that he emailed them and sent them a note and didn't get a response from either, so not only does he feel he was overcharged, he also feels like they somehow, for some reason think they are too good to explain their charges to him. It's not just the overcharge, it's also the disrespect they showed him.

I quit bidding in their auctions, or even looking at their offerings, after they screwed Ryan over years ago. This just reaffirms to me that my earlier decision never to do business with them again was the correct one.

I can't think of a single auction house that hasn't been raked over the coals here, or that hasn't had at least one forum member say that they will never do business with them again. Maybe Leland's?

I bet that if we picked 100 people here and gave each veto power over one auction house, and said that the end result would be that no one on the board could bid in the veto'd auction houses.....we would all have to just use the B/S/T here to acquire our collectibles.

P.S. - not saying complaining about auction houses isn't good and necessary, just stating an observation.

I won 38 graded cards in last week's Sterling Sports Auction - that's a lot of plastic and a lot of weight. My shipping charge was $18, which I gladly paid and thought was very reasonable. Then, I got a refund notice from PayPal with a note from Lee saying, "I was able to get it all in a Medium FR, so here is a little back." He refunded me $3, making my shipping cost only $15 for 38 graded cards. Is that excellent customer service, or what?!? Maybe these other AH's should take note.

Thank you, Lee!!!

Lee (& Brian before him) has always been top notch.
REA (now w/ Brian added to the crew) is also great w/ quick & free shipping.

+1 I bought quite a few cards from him in one of the recent auctions. I purchased around 12 cards and the total shipping was only around $15 than he refunded me a few bucks and apologized once the cards were mailed. It was some of the best customer service I've run across in a while.

I just looked at the FedEx website and to send a 1 pound (which is the minimum) package from here in Florida to California without any insurance their published rates are as follows:

Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:00 AM FedEx First Overnight® 98.60
Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:30 AM FedEx Priority Overnight® 64.66
Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:00 PM FedEx Standard Overnight® 58.25
Fri Sep 13, 2013 10:30 AM FedEx 2Day AM® 30.17
Fri Sep 13, 2013 4:30 PM FedEx 2Day® 26.23
Mon Sep 16, 2013 4:30 PM FedEx Express Saver® 20.64
End of day(4 Business Days) FedEx Ground® 9.04

For most items the USPS is more economical, but many auction houses won't use them.

Ok.....now you did it..........

You're badmouthing UPS! They've put food on my table for 29 years........
(actually, WAY too much food, but that's another story)

You can badmouth SCP but not UPS!

Joking.....although I work there, they're not high on my list right now since they zilched my wife's healthcare. Also another story.

Everyone should use USPS for single cards. They don't have to make money so they charge a lot less. They have no shareholders.

The frustration is just so unlike you..............

I hear Brockelman and Luckey Auctions are top notch. :)

I'm with Tom easy on UPS. Also agree single cards should go through USPS. Although most everything is shipped through UPS and Fed Ex anyway, yes USPS uses UPS & FedEx to ship their packages...

Bwahahahahah!!!!! (I made Travis one of the 100 with veto powers)

Overcharging Shipping
 

I had same issue and posted about it a couple weeks ago with Legendary - basically $20 to ship one card under $400 value. To me the point isn't a few bucks - it's the principle. The feeling of being chiseled, ripped-off. Like some low-ball tactic to add to your bottom line - as if 19% juice isn't enough to cover you?

You feel good about paying "resort fees" at dumpy hotels, and for services you never used? Cab drivers that want to charge you an extra $5 if you use a CC? Having the waitress refill your Diet Coke glass a few times, then seeing $13 for soda on the bill bcse they charge by the glass and somehow never mentioned it to you? Most of those are minor in terms of actual dollar amount - - and at least some you can see coming. This tactic is "surprise!" "hey, we got you!" Like roaming changes. Especially in the wake of most auction houses charging fair and customary for s&h.

The worst was Legendary's excuse when I asked. BS "handling fees", "we box everything" (so do most), and then the ever-loving calling out competitors excuse and saying they get it from me in other ways, "believe me.."

That was enough, I said stop - OK, fine - just stop! Keep it, keep it - it obviously means more to you than me, so stick it up your a$$

I sent the check the next day (which they received 9/3 and as of 9/11 it still sits, no ship notice). No big to-do, threats, etc. - just like the restaurant with bad food/service - I will leave a few bad reviews, avoid, move on, they don't care. No big deal - I'm sure eBay will tell you it happens to them every day ;)

If it annoys you enough, stop bidding in the auction. If you continue bidding you are implicitly agreeing to these shipping charges. If so, stop whining.

On the flip side, I had the most eye-popping transaction ever with Legendary. I won a lot of almost 600 autographed baseballs, and the shipping charge (for two huge boxes that almost gave me a hernia) was 25 bucks. I am still stunned to this day.

Ken

S & h
 

I think that's what I said - stopped arguing it, paid it, will avoid in the future, move on .. I haven't continued to bid, this only happened couple weeks ago in their last auction.

I don't think it's such a bad thing that this is brought into the daylight and discussed. People should be made aware of over-priced shipping charges and people who charge them should be made aware that there is anger about it.

If enough people get upset about it and the company is concerned with its reputation enough... change will occur. Having said that, your point is also good that if everyone complains but keeps fishing in the same pool, there's little incentive for the AH to do anything about it.

...did that cover everything?... ha ha

John--think about it for a second. If I ship a $200 card at the post office (the cheapest way to ship one card) and insure it it will cost me about $5. The mailer cost me $1. The gas driving to and from the post office from my current house would cost me about $2 (this doesn't count wear and tear on my car), and this all takes about 45 minutes of my time (you figure out how to value that). What I am saying is that for you or me mailing a card worth $200 it will effectively cost us over $12. The big auction house has to pay for shipping materials, a shipping manager, etc. No matter how much you think the auction house may be ripping you off, I would bet that the shipping area, as a profit center, is a net loser.
Now, you can argue that the buyer's premium should be paying for this. However, that premium must cover all the auction house salaries (except the shipping manager who we already accounted for), insurance, rent, travel to find consignments, entertainment, interest costs on advances, systems work, etc. Remember, virtually no consignor pays a consignment fee any more. In fact, big consignors typically get a kickback from the buyer's commission on their lots. All I'm saying is that this is not a business model that churns out money. It is not unreasonable for auction houses to cover their total shipping costs.

Well... if they had explained it the way you just did, there probably wouldn't be as much anger... right? I don't really have a dog in this fight, because I rarely have enough extra cash to bid on something... but I never like the feeling of being ripped off (it doesn't matter about the amount). I have zero problem paying what at first glance seems like a ripoff, if the explanation makes sense. It's also common sense and makes for good customer service. How tough is it to write a rote response and attach it with the bill explaining the reason for the cost? Cut and paste. Done. ...and a hell of lot less anger.

That's just my $200. (originally two cents, adjusted for inflation and time to write this.) :D

Scp
 

I have always had good transactions in years past with Dan and SCP, especially Clay Hill. I think they are quality people. I think the auction houses could tweak their shipping charges somewhat in favor of their clients (us) especially concerning the elevated BP's. On that note, if you buy the Cal Ripken 1980 Charlotte card from Dan for $30,000 on ebay, I would imagine he would cut some slack on that $4.99 shipping charge. The auction houses should consider the same and not make shipping an added profit center.

It seems like many of them have set a floor for shipping charges and instances where folks buy a single card or a small lot, it seems like you're getting the shaft on shipping. Having worked for UPS for almost 30 years, I can tell you it's not cheap to ship stuff. Also owned a UPS store for about four years, so the packing side of it is tough too.

Legendary is the best packers in the industry. Period. They use top notch stuff, bought new, and don't scrimp on materials. What does that mean to the single card guy...not that much probably but they do a great job packing. REA and Heritage are top notch too. The smaller auctions don't spend the money that these big guys do on packing materials and don't have accounts with UPS or FedEx, use USPS, so it's tough to compare the two.

Regardless, like Jay said.....if you don't like it, voice your displeasure and if you don't get satisfaction, don't bid next time. Don't hesitate to tell them that's why you're not bidding as well. I agree with Jay on that whole they may be making a buck or two here, they're losing it there..,.you just hate to be the guy that feels like they're making it off of you all the time....

Having sold online for over 15 years and operating an AH for over 5 years, I have a pretty good feel on shipping costs.

We only use USPS and try to use the most economical way, which on larger lots is always the flat rate boxes. We try to factor in the appropriate shipping and enough to cover the prorated insurance we pay privately. At the end of each auction we are usually a bit short of the break even mark, but not enough to fret. Now we do not have a shipping department and we do recycle some packing materials, AND the USPS boxes are free. So we may have a slight advantage, but we try to keep the 1-3 card purchases that are $100-1000 at $6-12 depending on value, and the larger ones $14-20 again depending on the size, weight and value.

I will say many of the AH's I purchase from do packing to the overkill which is probably part of the inflated shipping. I recently received two SGC slabs in a box triple packaged that you could have fit 20 of them in. This is very much the norm for most of them. Extreme caution on the side of error, but again I would say a real shitstorm would hit if they threw your $2,000 card in a top loader and a legal (or even padded) envelope and you received it resembling a banana.

Most of their base cost seems to be with the carrier they use. Many folks detest one or all three of them, USPS, UPS, and FedEx, but you have to go with one of them. In all of the thousands of items we have sent thru the USPS, only one never got there. A postal employee stole it, the Postal Inspectors caught him and we eventually got the cards back through our insurance company. We have confidence in them and find their pricing to our liking

SO... after all of this I am not really sure I explained or justified anything, just some input that agrees with others, most AH's are not making a profit on the shipping/handling/insurance.

Well I wouldn't trust that shady Dan fella, but I couldn't have said better about SCP. Quality people all around. Especially my good friend Dave Kohler. I, too, have always had great transactions with SCP. The best part is their customer service and how well they take care of their customers. When SCP makes a mistake, like if they massively defraud a customer and misrepresent an item by doctoring photos of it and photoshopping damage out so it looks nice and purty in the catalog, or something like that, hypothetically speaking of course, they ALWAYS make it right. Instantly. Period. Just quality, quality people.

I mean, how can you not trust an auction house affiliated with the qualitiest quality person in all of Qualityville, Dave Kohler. Really do love that guy!

Go Dave! SCP rules!

-Ryan

Don't forget selling rebacked cards with no mention of that in the description. And muscling PSA to slab them as Altered - Authentic because they do contain some pieces of authentic cards. No problem there either. Totally above board.

Stoneypony hit the nail on the head.

So just because someone makes a good living...or bought when the market was much different...they should be charged more than the avg joe for the same thing? That's BS and you know it!

I often lie about my profession as people think that just because I'm a dentist...I'm rich and they can charge me more...I'm not...and they can't!

Maybe all the AHs could implement a sliding scale for S&H based on a means test.

There are a lot of people in this world that don't know it. A big problem these days.

Huh??? You think you were charged more shipping than anyone else who may have made that purchase?? Ummm nope

Hey Pete I retired from UPS figure it out I dont like shots from someone with a big bankrole and cries. I will hand him a kleenex to cry in.

then you have to pay the guy to box stuff it with your package stuffers, bubble wrap, shipping labels, ink for the invoice they print out, tape it all up, mark it paid in their billing systems, etc. he gets a decent salary to handle your valuables, with health care, life insurance, maybe a pension, 401k like the rest of us.

there isn't a room full of elves handling this process for candy canes.

kevin

In fairness I would expect the 20% (or so) Buyer's Premium to cover some of that, not the S&H.

Thanks for sharing, but who give a shit? Complain to the auction house, or don't pay the extremely high shipping to begin with. Life is too short to blow a gasket over 17 bucks.

Dave... i was more referring to The reference to Dan's multimillion dollar collection... Not SCP's shipping policies. Point taken hammer... Additionally... I would say the last 10 to 15 items I have sold on eBay I have undercharged substantially for shipping... I didn't realize how expensive it has gotten?!

that is what makes it a free market. much like all of the other pricing that gets discussed....you can chose to take your business else where or pay the price that it costs to do business with a particular business.

i don't really see much point in arguing really about the whole thing. the prices are listed on the webiste. you sign up and agree to pay a price when you knowingly bid on a card.

its almost like bitching about how TGIF fridays doesn't have cheaper hamburgers after you bought and ate your hamburger.

go to mcdonalds and pick yourself up a quarter pounder. you know they are cheaper there. they even ship your burger to you through a window.

kevin

UPS is ridiculously overpriced. I don't think that if there is a package for $17 that it actually goes to the shipping department and paying the guy's salary, or any of their other expenses. I would bet that the $17 goes straight to UPS. Considering the cost of UPS, I doubt that SCP makes much if any money off of shipping.

But, Dan makes some good points that it is insensitive to the "little guy" who might just want one card. The auction houses would do better to send packages under $1000 via USPS. It would be better for the small collector. Yet that is not where the profit lies for the large auction houses, so they will cater their systems to the large purchasers who spend large sums, and if that means going with UPS, then that is what they will do.

shipping
 

I have sold cards on occassion on ebay since 1998. I learned that it is just easier to ship for free. Bidders factor in the free shipping and the lots sell for a little more. It's easier than explaining that my Maserati only gets 8 miles to the gallon and I live a long way from a post office.

Dan, I’m sort of tired of explaining this to you. I have said time and time again my fuel charge to run and ship something out for you isn’t cheap.

http://photos.imageevent.com/piojohn...pic%20_77_.jpg

UPS Shipping Costs
 

+1!!!!!!

Joe T.

Pretty much most healthcare is gone. Mine too.

Joe

+1

Joe

UPS Shipping Costs
 

Jay - well said. Interestingly enough, there are individuals complaining about a few extra shipping cost bucks that set up at card shows and substantiate their seemingly high sticker prices due to the card show's overall overhead (table costs, gas, hotels, meals, etc. - which I TOTALLY agree with). Yet, these same individuals seem to conveniently dismiss the auction houses overhead as if their winning lots are magically packed and handled at ZERO costs??? Remember folks, the FINAL shipping fee is CLEARLY listed as shipping, handling and insurance....NOT JUST SHIPPING.

Joe T.

Most of the bidders bid on ALL the various auction houses. I think what has happened is that some of the auction houses (Sterling with their speedy shipments and refunding of fees, REA with their FREE shipping, etc), has spoiled some of us bidders. So when someone charges what is perceived as an obscene amount (and yes, everyone knows what is acceptable), it infuriates some of us.

This is true in a way, but it could also be looked at as intelligent people starting AHs to compete with the AHs who used to monopolize the hobby, and to compete, they're making alterations to aspects of their venture according to what they thought was wrong (is wrong) with the said AHs. So, due to the success of these new AHs, the largest ones are going to need to start matching the level of personalized customer service, and non-inflated S&H costs - or this "bad publicity" (truth) is going to really begin to affect them. It's simple business. If Dan feels it, though he may announce it differently, he is speaking the thoughts of many bidders.

I get more annoyed having to see the same ridiculously priced BIN cards cluttering up eBay for literally years and this includes many of Dan's cards.


Dav.id Re.is

I agree with the intent of your comment, but it's not quite 100% accurate. Now IF the shipping fee was including in the BP, then it would be the pot calling the kettle black. However the difference is that the shipping fee is IN ADDITION TO the BP, so it's not an apples-to-apples comparison.

Would you be happy if also added "S&H from the AH where I bought the stuff" to the list their overall overhead? :D

I think the point is (or should be) that the "shipping, handling and insurance" tends to be a "surprise" number with many AHs and is "CLEARLY listed" AFTER the fact of purchase. Some just have a general weasel-word description mentioning "reasonable costs" regarding S&H. The real question/debate is around "what is reasonable".

David, Did it ever occur to you that maybe that's how you sit on several million dollars worth of cards? :cool:

I have long felt that most of the big auction houses with the glossy catalogs and large BPs charge too much for shipping. And, I have assumed this is due to (1) their refusal/reluctance to ship via the USPS, which is usually the most economical method, and (2) their intent to recoup ALL of their costs associated with shipping from their charges to the winning bidders.

I strongly feel (not that any of these AHs care what I feel) that their shipping charges should cover ONLY outside costs (and not their inside costs, such as a shipping manager - these inside costs should be covered by the BP!). I believe this is what most of the online-only AHs, such as B&L and Sterling, strive to do, and I applaud them for this.

Some have suggested that I stop bidding with the big AHs that "overcharge" for shipping. But, of course, I can't bring myself to do this because the "stuff" trumps everything. But, I do very definitely take the BP and shipping charges into account when I bid. In other words, if the exact same card were in both a SCP auction and a B&L/Sterling auction, I would bid higher for this card in the B&L/Sterling auction, so that my total cost would be the same with either auction.
Val

SCP Customer Service
 

Back to Dan's point on SCP customer service.

I have called twice and emailed twice in the last two weeks with a question about a lot in one of SCP's auctions.

So far no response! I guess if they don't reply to a current buying customer what chance do I (a past customer) have of getting a reply?

fees
 

Remember who really is the loser in these auctions - the consigner. If I know that I will have to pay a 20% buying fee and 20 bucks shipping for 1 $200 card, I will factor that into my bidding. That $60 in fees that goes to the AH comes right out of the consigners pocket.

Rick

Dan gets world record prices
 

For his cards at the National, he should be able to absorb all these costs. :D

I will gladly give you $350 today for a Koufax rookie worth $600 tomorrow!! :p

bobby
 

In your case, isn't it a Ryan Rookie :D

nice one Taylor
 

LMFAO --

PS: Dan, my friend, you can spare the $17 -- better than those blood vessels you're about to blow.

Rich....You are so right!! I have a Topps rookie SGC A!!! Can I PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEE show it to you?? PLEASE, PLEASE PLEASE!!! LOL!

Of course you can
 

We all love to see new acquistisions. And I know you got grief on CU, which is why I put the smiley face next to my post. :)

in all seriousness, that card presents well and I'd be happy to own a similar copy

Rich

I got a winning lot from Love Of the Game Auctions, and it was packed GREAT...maybe even overpacked! so even some smaller guys ship nicely