Let the bidding frenzy begin......
 

There should be some mild interest here.

And let the debate begin.... on whether this should have been outed here!

Interesting it is a one day auction.

Interesting that the seller makes no mention of M101-6 or Felix Mendelsohn or Sporting News.
Seller has two feedback since Jan of '09.

I was wondering the same thing, he/she is selling another high value card.

Looks like he just sold a nice Cobb and a signed '54 Bowman Mantle.
Has a couple other cards listed.

I'm surprised this auction was outed also. Is it okay to publish any auction as long as it's not your own?

Checked his feedback, this seller has sold some nice stuff. Auction looks interesting, thanks for letting us know!

Price just doubled since this post started!

And that is why you do not "out" auctions.

This wasn't just a regular m101-6. If it says Babe Ruth in the title it WILL be found.

It is not ok to out anything you have a vested interest in, or doing it for a friend who has a vested interest... That would be against the rules. No, it is not against the rules to out other ongoing auctions, in general. It is a very debatable issue, and I would prefer they not be outed myself, but there can't be a rule against it for various reasons. We have had at least 3-5 good debates about outing ongoing auctions, and we can always have another, but I can't imagine that rule changing.

It's goin to the moon!

Really?
 

Can anything really be considered "outed" if it's on ebay? With all the ebay talk on this board I can't believe anything of any significance could get by the members here. If someone wants to bring an interesting item to the board's attention it should be certainly allowed and even applauded so everyone has a fair chance at it.
Just my opinion.
PS - It's better than all the name calling and sniping at each other.

Well put, Tony

This Ruth item was not going to fly under any radar.

well if it makes anyone feel better, I saw it and wasn't going to let it sell cheaply. Great card!

Love it Jeff

I was hoping to miss it, see that it sold for a low price, then have it be consigned to an auction house, watch it sell for a significantly higher price with me as the underbidder, then complain about that ridiculous selling price.

Sorry for outing Mt. Everest in Nepal :o.

wow. $5k in 5 hours....

I was high bidder at 7300 for about two minutes. Mendelsohn's are really hot right now.

I'm not sure who sent the seller the card type, but I'm assuming that person is on this board. That was really cool... I hope this seller is on the up and up. It blows me away that the seller wouldn't remember the card type. Could you imagine if it was consigned to REA.

That is a different ruth in the old Lipsett auction.

Strong price for a raw f-g card!

Yes it can be outed. High price items always sneak past on ebay. I won a auction last week for alot less money then the items were worth.

That item wasn't going to sneak past anyone.
And I agree with Pete, no the same card in the Lipset link.

Had I been seriously looking to buy this card I would have been pissed off that it was outed. It's impossible to know if the results would be very different... But if it were not mentioned here I never would have seen it. There definitely can be good deals found on eBay Especially when the items are vaguely marketed... Everyone knows this!

I agree. Very strong...

I agree, i would've been pissed if i was into it. It was a 24 hr auction with a terribly vague listing. I was not interested in bidding but not sure why we would out this one. I know a babe Ruth search would have turned it up but still.

Peter

I was not interested in bidding either but do not think that it should have been outed. Other than a newbie, no one who was an interested bidder would have mentioned it.

I know that on a couple of occasions recently, fellow board member(s) have outed an auction or two where I was an interested bidder and they ended up skyrocketing in price afterwards. For payback, I would consider doing the same on an item that I would pass on but think might interest them. Maybe something like that was the reasoning here........Hopefully, it was not helping a friend out.............

Do we really think that an ebay auction with Babe Ruth in the title is going to go unseen?

Jeff:

Since I have been searching for a Babe Ruth item on e-bay for the past few months, I can tell you that on an average day, there are 200 - 300 new listings that mention Babe Ruth in the title, on free listing days, I have seen near 1,000 listings. I'm not too sure that too many collectors would be willing to sift through all of those listings on a daily basis by performing a simple search for the name "Babe Ruth" and not more detailed search criteria.

If that's the case then "outing" it would be doing you a favor, right?
That is if you're not willing to do the work to sift through the listings.

I can see both sides of the issue, to me - no big deal as long as there is no "pimping" going on.

I am just glad the seller didn't end it early and sell it to someone who noticed it and send them a $500 offer to sell off of ebay. :)

I would have missed it, and I search for Mendelsohn, m101-6, 1917 and 1917-20 every day. I oftentimes check for m101-6s in postcards and photos too, although not by that search term. Obviously, none of that would have helped me here.

This was a 24 hour auction of poor description. While Ruth chasers might have immediately clued in, I believe it likely at least some of the bidding came as a result of this auction being outed. I certainly don't search for Ruth items on a daily basis, and there probably are loads of things to sift through if you do.
Bottom line and FWIW, count me among those who think this auction should not have been outed.

EDITED TO ADD: I see I'm late on some of these remarks but would add that although outing it allowed me a shot, I still think it should not have been outed.

I would agree in the thought that a substantial amount of bidding may have resulted from the post here.

Um, this thread is the first I have ever heard of "outing". Either I understand it completely wrong or I have no idea why it would be an issue to broadcast the sale of an item. Is the argument that if no one says anything that the eventual winner will get it for cheaper? If so, that is absurd.

Two issues at play here: a.) the issue of a seller/consignor slyly "outing" his listing anonymously in order to attain greater audience share and drive price, and b.) the feeling that if an ebayer through their own work has uncovered something listed either poorly, erroneously or incorrectly so that it may be able to be obtained at a significantly lower price then the "outing" negates this chance. It is "b" that is being discussed here.

Thanks. Then I do understand and it is completely absurd. For one to assume that none of the other millions of eBay users will see the same listing is just f***ing dillusional, particularly a big ticket item with "babe Ruth" in the title.

I have to agree that any auction with the words "Babe Ruth" in the title is not going to slip by undetected. I am sure there are lots of Ruth fans out there that search by his name on eBay. When I search using a player's name, I usually set a set a minimum price to weed out all the overproduced modern stuff.

I am not a Ruth collector, and $8Gs are way out of my price range. But that would make me feal uneasy to drop that much cash on a raw card off eBay.

Well guess you don't have alot of experience buying from ebay because sometimes big ticket items get past people. Not every person who goes on ebay finds all the same items. Some people may look in weird categories while others just stick to searching in basic baseball categories.

And it's a 24 hour listing, say someone who does a ebay search for Babe Ruth wasn't on ebay that day but came across this thread. Now they know about the item. So what do you have to say about the lot I won two weeks ago that sold for $700 because it was 1. Listed in wrong section 2. described wrong and the items are actually worth $3,000+. If it was listed in the right section or got outing in a forum it would have sold for alot more.

But say you only search ebay once per day, and when you did your daily search you didn't see this card because at the time it wasn't above your min price.

I agree w/brock! Many on this board have found bargain gems on ebay due to poor/vague listings...i have too.

seller's weird. he knows it's an expensive card. he knows of lipset, yet he puts up a vague title and 1-day auction. 2 too many red flags for me.

Fellow Collectors: DON'T OUT AUCTIONS!!! Period. If you have a question about an item that you are thinking of bidding on, try to word your question hypothetically. Or better yet, try messaging someone on this board privately. I think this ebay-outing example kinda sux! And no, I wasn't an interested party.

Quan,
It is/was a very curious scenario.

I agree with Brock, Peter and others against outing. This card had a good recipe for less traffic being one day. Strange how the seller sold an American Caramel Cobb last month with a 10 day listing. Anyone know the winner y***t (4337)?
Obviously members here already mentioned missing it?

Thinking about this further, I think the fact it was a 1 Day Auction made it far more likely to have a limited audience than the peculiarity of the listing. Good points being made.

You're right. I stay the hell away from $10k raw cards with vague descriptions by sketchy sellers. They're all yours.

The auction was outed. Not a card of interest to me, but I'd hate to see for a Detroit OJ of Deacon White, for example, to be outed in a similar fashion.

Despite having Babe Ruth in the title, it would have been missed by many given the one day listing and strange (early) end time. Some of us patiently, frequently, and diligently search eBay for the cards we collect in the hope that we will sometimes be rewarded with a little less competition when a card of interest does surface.

On the other hand, we often help each other out by alerting friends to cards that we know might interest them without going public.

I usually set my min. price for something like $100-150 to weed out worthless stuff. If an $8,000 card is has not cracked the $100-150 barrier, there is a good reason for that. The reason is far more likely that it is a fake than simply because every collector on eBay at any given time has just missed it.

I don't mean to be argumentative at all. If the auction title would not have had Babe Ruth in the title listing, I could see the card flying under the radar. But not when Ruth is named in the title listing.

I understand "B" and feel that "B" probably occured in this case, I can see why some folks may be a tad upset, but I don't understand why "A" would be any big deal? Isn't there even a section on the BST for "outing" (advertsing) your own ebay auctions?

Well, that's where it is properly done. The front page could end up being flooded with that type of listing. And usually when it is done on the front end page it is not done with full disclosure so to speak.

I.e., "What do you guys think about this "so and so" listed in "X" Auction. Isn't this a tough card? It really looks like it is in good shape. What do you think is a fair price for it?"

That has no business on the Pre-War Card Forum page IMO.

+1

"I understand "B" and feel that "B" probably occured in this case, I can see why some folks may be a tad upset"

+1

also posted by tonyo

I understand and agree (regarding "A") .

This quote by Leon seems to be saying that outing your own auction is frowned upon: I'm not really following the logic there, unless he is saying the same thing you are saying. (advertise your own auctions with full disclosure and in the proper place on the forum)

It is in fact "f***king delusional" to maintain that the absence of pertinent info on the card in a one day auction, even Babe Ruth, does not lessen exposure and thus potentially results in a deserved bargain for someone who put in the time to dig it out without the help of outing.

I am saying that it is not ok to spam your own sales and/or auctions, or those of someone you are conspiring with who has a vested interest in an item, on the front page. There is a place for that in the BST sections. It is the 8th BST section from the top and says

Ebay/Vintage Card Auctions B/S/T

That is the place to spam things you have consigned to auction houses, ebay auctions, other peoples auctions or whatever. As I always say "there is no rule against outing auctions, per the easy rules, but I personally would prefer it not be done." No one will get in trouble for doing it besides having some folks not be happy with you.

I still think it's effing crazy to talk about an ongoing auction on the front page which you have an interest in. Just crazy. And I didn't have much back up on the issue when another board member did it recently..which is fine, it happens, but to me it's ludicrous. No smart person is going to post something they have an interest in so thousands of others can see if they have an interest too. I will look anyone square in the eyes and tell them that was a stupid thing to do.



.

People search for Babe Ruth cards every blankin hour. There's no way they wouln't see it. Is the seller a member of Net54 ? Maybe the winner is a member, too. We can ask him how he found out about the auction.

how much would this card in this condition go for in a major auction house?

who knows?
 

Hard to tell. There was an SGC 70 of this same card that went for slightly over $8k about fifteen months ago. It doesn't trade frequently enough to have a good idea, but I think >$10k is a very strong price for this card, period.

Doesn't matter how many people search for babe ruth cards a hour. Not many people would spend 10k+

but I think >$10k is a very strong price for this card, period.

That's where I'm at.

I would have preferred that this auction not have been outed. As others have said, although Ruth is widely searched on ebay, people miss auctions all the time. I have a saved search on Ruth, but I did not know of this auction until I saw the net54 posting. You can see how dramatically in price this card rose on a typically slow Saturday for ebay after the thread went up. Especially since this auction was a 1 day auction, ending at a strange time, there might have been a small chance to pick it up at a decent price. As Brock said, it's not that you need to weed out every Ruth collector. You just need to have the ones who would have been willing to bid more than you for this auction miss it.

The price for this card was very strong, especially considering the back damage. It might even grade an authentic for all we know. This card sold on ebay last year for ~10K in SGC5. It was then flipped to PSA 5, and sold at Migh High for over 30K to Spence. Peter picked up a very nice version of this card last year also. No question, this card is hot.

Well that clears it up and you and Jeff are saying the same thing.

I was corn-fused by your post #13:

A Ruth is better condition (PSA 5.5) went for 44k recently. 10k doesn't seem ridiculous for this card IMO.

I don't know why a seller would do a one day auction with such a weird description on this. If I had won the card I would be picking it up in person for that kind of money.

Just searched Ebay for "babe ruth". There's been 86 new listings in the last hour, 738 in the last 12 hours (387 baseball cards). This discussed 24 hour auction could have easily gone unnoticed by a huge group of buyers.

Besides all that, it seems that out of common courtesy posters wouldn't out auctions because there is a significant group here that wishes you don't.

I just read through the first four pages. IMO, I don't feel that there is anything wrong with outing an auction. However, I can see where some may think differently. For those that do, just answer me one question. What's the difference between outing the auction that is the subject of this thread, or outing this auction that is also on the main board...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=163501

I really see no difference.

(1) For the Plank, if you go to the Legendary auctions home page: Link, you see a picture of the Plank card. That is, this Plank is such a featured card in this auction, nobody is going to miss it.

(2) In contrast, the Ruth card is a one day auction on ebay that ends at a strange time. It does not even list M101-6 or Felix Mendolsohn in the title. A lot of people are going to miss this auction.

(3) The Plank is such a key hobby card that a website (t206resource) even lists every single variation of this card, and the sell prices. Even though this is a very rare and popular Ruth right now, it does not have the same notoriety that the Plank has.

+1, there is no difference, some folks just get the chapped ass when they think they missed a "bargain." Who is to say it wouldn't have gone for 10k+ anyways? It only takes two bidders with 10k in their pockets...

Gary,

Now I am even more confused. Are you saying iIt's okay to out an auction, just as long as it's not an eBay auction or are you saying it's okay to out an eBay auction, just as long as it's not a one day auction?

Same applies to other auction houses as well.

First, I want to say, it's done, it's over, I've moved on. Chris' bid would've crushed my bid anyway.

I think as Leon says, there is no hard and fast rule for this. I mean, sometimes there are even net54 contests where people guess the ending price for auctions, so obviously those auctions are outed.

Saying that, IMHO, I don't think ebay auctions should be outed unless there is concern that the auction is not legit or the price of the auction is already at a level where practically no one can afford. If someone is looking for that card, it is common courtesy to not out that auction on the main board since that will increase the price that someone needs to pay for that card. If you want to out it, put it in the BST forum under the ebay section, not on the main board. The main board, IMHO, is for general hobby discussion, not for every individual auction that might be going on. Planks, the Brooklyn CDV, and others like it have an important place in the hobby. This auction was for a pretty specialized Ruth card, which although it is popular with Ruth collectors, is not a cornerstone of the hobby card.

Anyway, it's a thin line. I think it's better to just talk about the card after the auction is over or put it in the BST section as I said. I don't know why it has to be in the main board.

+1

Only sellers benefit by asking questions on this forum about a live auction.

I think there are plenty of people on this board alone who are pissed about the auction being "outed"

Isn't that an indication it wasn't flying under anyone's radar?


Give the guy a break.

Today there was an uninformed collector who wasn't taken advantage of for his lack of knowledge. Outing is a good thing.

Actually, it was encapsulated in a PSA 5.5 holder and sold in MIle High for $44K!

It flew under my radar, as well as others here who would prefer that it had not been outed nonetheless.

Nonsense. Lazy perhaps, as he could have taken the time to research or at least better remember a card he himself bought from a notable card auction house.

I disagree.

:D True.

I wonder how many of the posters who are upset about "the outing" actually bid on this Ruth before it was outed? Now, there's a poll to be taken :)

Sincerely, Clayton